Qantas to Paris
 

I was talking to a captain in HK recently who stated that Qantas is about to lose it's slot into Paris as it has not utilised it for quite some time. (I have no idea what the time requirement's are on the use of a slot...)

Rumour has it, Qantas management or otherwise said to the French, 'that's ok, we will use Jetstar to operate into there.' To which the French have said, 'No, only Qantas will be allowed.'

Discuss, 500 words or less.

Have heard the same thing!

Qantas are attempting/looking to have the weight limits on the 330 increased, for future dabbling into Europe through KUL, perhaps...... but any expansion to that part of the world wont be done by us.

Having said that, I wasn't entirely sure the LAX/JFK flying was anything other than a rumour as well, so I stand to be corrected.

It's a wonderful thought though :ok:

AUS-EU Open Skies
 

Would the impending expiration of the "slot" you refer to be rendered irrelevant by the mooted Australia-EU airservices agrrement foreshadowed in the recent Aviation White Paper?

Or

Is this about access to the airport rather than the airspace a la Heathrow?

I was told QF won't be going back to Paris until they can get a daily "slot".

I think we have access to daily slots now, after the last Transport Minister [John Anderson] made representations to the EU.

Prehaps there just isn't the demand for SYD-CDG. Difficult to compete with the Asian and Middle Eastern hubs here. Daily CDG-DBX/SIN with onward connections all over the world yes, is there enough traffic just wanting to go to OZ though ?

Then what the hell are we waiting for? We have spare 744's, I have a low line and can greet pax with a cheerful "Bonjour". After 32 yrs flying the Gallic shrug should be no problem when the IFE goes belly up.
Paris here I come...:)

Just curious, but where do you think these spare 744's are?

Surely Frankfurt is close enough and good enough, remembering QF can codeshare into CDG if and when needed.

And seriously, of all places, why Paris? Why not for example, somewhere in Italy, Spain or even Central Europe - if they're insisting on having a 3rd city for QF to fly into?

I had my tongue firmly in cheek in my previous post
When the A380 was being introduced "management" spoke of the extra capacity on the "spare" 744's. It was suggested going back to Paris. Same "management" said demand was there but only if we had daily services.
I do have a lowline though...bless little Carmen:ugh:

Qantas used to fly to Paris 3 times per week, that was around 1200 seats per week ad the flights were full. When code share started with Air France, airport manager stated it was 50 seats per flt. So we went from 1200 seats to 350 seats per week. So were did these other 850 passengers go, probably EK, Singair etc. Another great decision by QF.

We constantly see reports of QF market share dropping, most likely because we don't offer the pax an option of getting to their destination unless they want to go via LHR, FRA.

As stated, we have extra a/c and crews, but the management is so fixed on their Jetstar plans they fail to see any growth opportunities for Mainline. If we had 777's and QCCA cabin crew operating in them, we could offer a profitable full service option to ports in Europe with a known and trusted brand. Well at least it was trusted till Dixon took the helm.

Why do I get that nagging gnawing feeling that management deliberately sabotage the QF longhaul operation in order to justify its destruction? Tell me my gut instinct is wrong.

MR Wooby
So its ok to have low cost cabin crew(QCCA) but not low cost pilots flying to Paris. At least I know what you think of your cabin crew now!

What difficulty is that Metro man?

The only problem I can see is the QF management.If they give the crew the right aircraft with the IFE etc...to compete with other carriers there is no problem.

How long have we watched the network retract...It's retreated more than the Italian army during WW2....:E

MrWooby is right about destinations and if you are flying to a major destination in Europe then why fly with QF with only Frankfurt or London in the UK to choose from.
If you are going to have cut price cabin crew then why not cut price tech crew?

Your comment shows how little some pilots know about the travelling public.

That is one of the problems with QF one area of the company does not give a hoot about the others and the company loves it....

If the company put as much effort into QF as it is with J* it would be flying to more destinations with a competitive product than it is at the moment....

You only have to remember the network we used to have and to also think that it was QF that thought of Business class and you can see that successive managements have well and truly dropped the ball.....:ugh:

the open sky
 

agreement with Europa won,t be around for some time,regardless what Rudd & Co thinks. Given that Europa is being carved up by LH & AF and partners and to a smaller extend BA & Iberia, Fortress Europa has become even bigger and they wont give away slots for nothing. Hence there will be limited opportunities for J*. The slots for QF could be taken up (Rome, Paris) but there is no strategy in place to make it work.:ugh:

Maybe Paris would work now with the soon to be upgraded/reconfig 3 class (J,Y+, and Y) B744s?

Qantas could not make a profit to Rome and Paris because of their choice of aircraft. Significant numbers of B777's ordered 10 years ago and we would be a completely different airline today.

QANTAS could'nt make money to Rome because they were operating 747 classic's with 30 odd seats blocked off so they could get the gas on hence no/little profit. Whilst it would be great to see CDG back while management are still putting all their effort into porn* I suspect QANTAS longhaul will continue to flog along with it's arm's tied behind it's back like it has since the bow tie boy took the reins. Management have alway's been from domestic side and have little idea how to run international ops, SFO a case in point.

The Qantas Kangaroo route via London to Paris adds 2 hours onto an already long trip. Originally Qantas weren't allowed into Paris as a tit for tat for not allowing Air France into Australia. This changed when British Airways bought into Qantas.

Although Air Mail postage between say the UK and Australia is fast, mail from France is typically 10+ days as only Air France takes French mail out of France whereupon mail is dumped out in the open in Singapore where it is nobody's responsibility until it's eventually put on a Qantas flight. Not enough people effected. No votes in the issue. 'Who cares' is the attitude.

I don't think so. the problem with Southern Europe, ROM, ATH (and BEG if you want to go back far enough) is no First or Business class volume, and no Freight.

LHR and FRA provide that, and PAR, maybe, would have benefited from 777 - not enough to make the case though.

Fleet choice always involves compromise.

Hub based carriers such as EK and SQ funnel traffic in from all points on the network and disperse it on to various destinations. EK can operate several daily services to CDG as its passengers can go on to South America, Africa, Asia and Australia.

QF passengers are going to be mostly for Australian destinations only. Are there enough of them who will choose QF over EK/SQ to make it worth while ?

The difference is when EK/SQ fly to a city they offer worldwide connections through their network and have a huge market. When QF fly to a city they offer Australia/NZ only and have to compete with the lower costs of Asian and Middle Eastern airlines.

A reduction of traffic between France and Australia would affect QF directly, possibly rendering the flight uneconomical, where as for EK this would only be a small overall reduction possibly compensated by increased traffic to other destinations. If the French suddenly prefer India over Australia, Emirates can still fly them QF can't.