G'day Dehav,

You're right, you know. I've quoted AEO speeds not OEI speeds, and it's too long ago for me to remember the correct ones. Ooops. :\

The ETOPS on this route is a very interesting one. Warburton does not meet the requirements for anything in Code 3c or above. This is due to the runway strip being only 80m wide and 90m is required. Having spoken to the surveyor about his one he says they cannot make it any wider as the local inhabitants have some "sacred land" on the side of the runway. I would like to therfore know how Skywest is using this runway for Etops requirements if in fact they are. Having planned and flown this route in a Brasilia from Perth I found the only suitable runway that met Etops requirements was Patjar but his poses additional problems as although the runway strip is 90m wide it is only 1400m long and therefore would only work for the Brasilia if alternate LDR factoring of 1.43% was applied. Departures out of The Granites also really need to be a minimum of 1hr before last light beacause if the aircraft experiences a problem up to half an hour from the Granites after departure(before it comes into range of Patjarr) will require a return to The Granites and with the unlit tower off the end of the runway you cannot land there after last light. It is an Etops and plannning nightmare from Perth and the Brasilia ETOPS requirements mean within 200nm of a suitable aerdrome, not sure what the distances are for the F50 but I would be interested to know how they are doing it.

Re: Changes in the West
 

if I was a betting man I would venture that they have not even considered the possibility.

It will get ignored and life will go on.

CASA need a good look at themselves

Re: Changes in the West
 

Where's TGT?

Re: Changes in the West
 

TGT = The GraniTes

Re: Changes in the West
 

Ah, thanks Capt...

I was confused with IATA Port Code TGT in Tanzania. Serious ETOPS problem out of PER for a -8, F50, or pretty much any twin I suppose.

VHCU

Re: Changes in the West
 

Especially Perth to Tanzania.:eek:

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I think you'll find that it is greater than 180nm. 60min S/E

But looking at the route options it seem meets all the requirements to me. I'm sure that professional companies like NJ and XR would have done all the required work and number crunching and met all of the requirements. (and CASA would have said something in their constant audits). If you have an issue perhaps you ring their flight ops departments, i'd think you'll find they wouldn't do it if they couldn't. I don't know what the fuss is all about...

SP

Re: Changes in the West
 

Pusher, I would be surprised if it is much more than 180 nm, I can't remember the correct numbers but it TAS's out on 2 at about 250-270 doesn't it?

What adequates are you using and what is the routing?

Re: Changes in the West
 

KG, ASP, Warberton (which does meet 90m etc) Balgo Hill to name just a few...no worries:ok:

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To find an answer just get scarenorths flight planners to organise the route, cause with metros over water to dili and back with no life rafts or jammed in the nose locker they sure to have good friends in casa. By the way the dash on the route to the tgt with njs had a gravel kit so any road with the low pressure tyres became a suitable strip. long live the dash what a machine

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The Airnorth Metros did have liferafts for the legs to Dili, Baucau etc. The seat next to the emergency overwing exit was removed and a liferaft stapped down using the same douglas clips as the seats. Is this no longer done ?

Re: Changes in the West
 

hey wiz,

the punters out your way should be happy they have an air service at all, when you consider similar sized towns around oz have been left with no services. Skippers service is better than no service...just...

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Mate, as far as I'm aware, Skippers don't come here for anything other than Mines charter/crewchange. I haven't seen any RPT here as yet. They all go out to places like Thunderbox, Murrin murrin, Darlot, sunrise dam, Ect. not into town itself.

Re: Changes in the West
 

Ah TGT - the Granites.

Worked out there one January for a few days, some of which was inside the mill - that big metal drum rotates. It was 47 degrees outside, and when we emerged from the mill, it was a relief to get out of the heat....

The following day flying home was the only time I have had the oil temps in the green BEFORE starting the engine.....

Do remember the pelicans in the water dam though... :ooh:

Re: Changes in the West
 

Understand that Airnorth, Regional Pacific, Skywest and others have a CASA exemption againt the carriage of life rafts over specific routes. Think you will find that Airnorth are not required to carry rafts for RPT ops to Dili.

Re: Changes in the West
 

Dear All,

I can assure you that PH DCT TGT is 1030 nm, which the F50 will traverse in 248 minutes (nil wind, 260 kts).

Let's do the sums:

Empty Op Wt. = 13650 kgs
Full Fuel = 4050 kgs
TOTAL = 17700 kgs

Now, at 32C and nil wind, RTOWs / payloads are as follows:

Rwy 12 19920 kgs / 2220 kgs (19920-17700)
Rwy 30 20820 kgs / 3120 kgs (20820-17700)

So, at 94 kgs per pax (84 kgs + 10 kgs baggage), pax uplift ex TGT equals:

Rwy 12 23.6 pax
Rwy 30 33.2 pax

Remember, this is at 32C, nil wind enroute, nil holding at PH etc etc.

So, the direct service is not a goer, especially with full pax.

Perhaps via KG (deja vu NJS), and with enroute stop available?

Cheers,

LCK186

Re: Changes in the West
 

Stick Pusher, your blind faith in companies doing the correct thing and CASA actually ensuring they do is "interesting".

I would suggest just about every company out there is flaunting the rules, some know they are, others inadvertantly. The result is the same of course.

With regards to the 60 min business, I recall Scare North operating to Timika from Darwin, there is absolutley no way they could do that within 60 mins single engine in a Brasilia, but don't let that stop them. They used to stick the life raft in the nose locker of the metro, that in itself indicates their attention to the saftey of their passengers. Why take one at all? I wonder if management beieve the weight of safety equipment should be included in weight calculations?

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Ick186 :

I can assure you they are doing it direct, I believe the first one leaves @ 0500 tomorrow...and pax loads are capped...

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Stick Pusher, for my own reference could I ask where you found that Warburtons RWS is 90m?? If it is I would be interested to know for my own benefit. Thanks