Working on public holidays
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Working on public holidays
Interesting court case! If it becomes law, what is your fee to work a public holiday if you don't have to? I think I'll need a double RDO payment or to have my operator (not QF mainline or VA) renegotiate the existing EBA.
Public holidays 2023: Bosses must ask employees if they want to work public holidays | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
Public holidays 2023: Bosses must ask employees if they want to work public holidays | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
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Pretty sure that pilots get 6 weeks annual leave, instead of the society standard 4 weeks, because we work on public holidays without extra compensation. The amount of public holidays roughly equates to 10 working days, hence the 2 extra weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
The following 3 users liked this post by Seaeagle109:
Pretty sure that pilots get 6 weeks annual leave, instead of the society standard 4 weeks, because we work on public holidays without extra compensation. The amount of public holidays roughly equates to 10 working days, hence the 2 extra weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
The model around staff volunteering to work PH’s is probably beyond many rostering departments to organise. Generally these periods are the busiest for airlines and travel, and generally the times staff just don’t want to work either. I am sure many will sacrifice 2 weeks leave to have those peak period off, I sure would, wouldn’t mind the Easter long weekend off, yet I am stuck working Friday to Monday.
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Karma will be a bitch for airlines if this is applied as it appears it will be. Years of the war on staff cannot go unpunished. Colleagues I have spoken to already have suggested only large sums of money will get them to work on a public holiday.
Someone mentioned something about the 6 weeks A/L being compensation for public holidays in a prior post. I don’t believe this has been expressly stated in any EBA, rather suggested by management. It’s a null and void argument.
Someone mentioned something about the 6 weeks A/L being compensation for public holidays in a prior post. I don’t believe this has been expressly stated in any EBA, rather suggested by management. It’s a null and void argument.
The following 3 users liked this post by gordonfvckingramsay:
For context, here is some insights into the BHP proposed EA for Production Staff - 15 March 2023
Working on Public Holidays
OS works 24/7 rosters. To meet our plans and commitments to our customers, we need rostered shifts to continue over Christmas Day and Boxing Day.
Where an Employee is rostered on over Christmas Day and Boxing Day, they will be required to work unless they have leave approved.
To enable Employees who are rostered on to take leave, the proposed EA outlines that OS may call for volunteers to work Christmas Day and Boxing Day. Where an Employee who is not rostered on volunteers and performs work on these days, they will be paid overtime rates.
Separate to the EA, Employees who are rostered on and who work will continue to be eligible for a $700 per shift payment in accordance with the Working on 24-26 December Ex-Gratia Payment Policy.
Employees who receive overtime will not be eligible for the $700 policy payment.
Annual Leave Entitlement
The proposed EA will not change your existing annual leave entitlements or accruals. Under the proposed EA, Employees are entitled to 5 or 6 weeks’ annual leave per year (depending on the type of roster they work).
For full time employees who are entitled to 6 weeks’ annual leave per year:
- employees working a 2/1 roster will typically be entitled to be absent from work on annual leave for 28 shifts per year (or 2 full swings), as they would typically work 28 shifts in a 6-week roster cycle; and
- employees working a 7/7 roster will typically be entitled to be absent from work on annual leave for 21 shifts per year (or 3 full swings), as they would typically work will 21 shifts in a 6-week roster cycle.
Last edited by RealSatoshi; 31st Mar 2023 at 03:57.
Pretty sure that pilots get 6 weeks annual leave, instead of the society standard 4 weeks, because we work on public holidays without extra compensation. The amount of public holidays roughly equates to 10 working days, hence the 2 extra weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
At a minimum I'd expect to see penalty rates applied. If I recall correctly this holiday requirement cannot simply be contracted out of either.
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At risk of society shutting down the government will have to step in and ensure that employers have the right to force employees in those industries to work, but as quoted in this AFR article:
An employer could still require the employee to work on a public holiday if the employee’s refusal was unreasonable given the nature of the work, reasonable employer expectations, the type of employment and the level of pay.
All an employer has to do is say “you agreed to work in aviation therefore it’s expected you work holidays” and your right to opt out is over. However they may be forced to institute a mandatory penalty payment for working on a holiday.
I don’t think this ruling will ensure pilots and airline employees a guaranteed Christmas off every year. But you may get a bit more money in the bank account for working on the day.
If you look at all the others professions who work public holidays, police, nurses, hospital staff, emergency services, mining, retail, aged care etc there are a lot of people needed on public holidays who would also like to get the day off. I can’t imagine there’s too many workers in other industries willing to volunteer to give up every holiday to help out their boss.
At risk of society shutting down the government will have to step in and ensure that employers have the right to force employees in those industries to work, but as quoted in this AFR article:
An employer could still require the employee to work on a public holiday if the employee’s refusal was unreasonable given the nature of the work, reasonable employer expectations, the type of employment and the level of pay.
All an employer has to do is say “you agreed to work in aviation therefore it’s expected you work holidays” and your right to opt out is over. However they may be forced to institute a mandatory penalty payment for working on a holiday.
I don’t think this ruling will ensure pilots and airline employees a guaranteed Christmas off every year. But you may get a bit more money in the bank account for working on the day.
At risk of society shutting down the government will have to step in and ensure that employers have the right to force employees in those industries to work, but as quoted in this AFR article:
An employer could still require the employee to work on a public holiday if the employee’s refusal was unreasonable given the nature of the work, reasonable employer expectations, the type of employment and the level of pay.
All an employer has to do is say “you agreed to work in aviation therefore it’s expected you work holidays” and your right to opt out is over. However they may be forced to institute a mandatory penalty payment for working on a holiday.
I don’t think this ruling will ensure pilots and airline employees a guaranteed Christmas off every year. But you may get a bit more money in the bank account for working on the day.
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Pretty sure that pilots get 6 weeks annual leave, instead of the society standard 4 weeks, because we work on public holidays without extra compensation. The amount of public holidays roughly equates to 10 working days, hence the 2 extra weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
So, if you want to decline to work on public holidays, I guess that employers will want to reduce annual leave back to 4 weeks.
52 weekends plus
12 public holidays (or more depending on
the state) plus
4 weeks annual leave
that is 144 days off a year (about 40%)
pilots get 42 days off (about 12%)
i hope you are not a captain if that is the way you
look at data before you, you think we should go from 12% down to 8%. An airline managers dream.
It is easy to see who is getting raped by their employer
Pilot's only get 42 days off per year?
Anyway, so you drop from 6 weeks to 4 weeks, but gain 10-12 days in PH Paid days off. Unlucky if they fall on your RDO however. You also get the choice to have those peak, holiday, and often non attractive work days, OFF. Sounds good.
What is stopping them from dropping a clause in the EBA seen across some other industries......."if we can't get volunteers, then we can force you to work etc."
They would struggle to even maintain 10% of a daily schedule going off volunteers. Might as well not operate on the 25/12. But hey, don't all the folks in HQ all over the place get the day off?
Anyway, so you drop from 6 weeks to 4 weeks, but gain 10-12 days in PH Paid days off. Unlucky if they fall on your RDO however. You also get the choice to have those peak, holiday, and often non attractive work days, OFF. Sounds good.
What is stopping them from dropping a clause in the EBA seen across some other industries......."if we can't get volunteers, then we can force you to work etc."
They would struggle to even maintain 10% of a daily schedule going off volunteers. Might as well not operate on the 25/12. But hey, don't all the folks in HQ all over the place get the day off?
normal worker has
52 weekends plus
12 public holidays (or more depending on
the state) plus
4 weeks annual leave
that is 144 days off a year (about 40%)
pilots get 42 days off (about 12%)
i hope you are not a captain if that is the way you
look at data before you, you think we should go from 12% down to 8%. An airline managers dream.
It is easy to see who is getting raped by their employer
52 weekends plus
12 public holidays (or more depending on
the state) plus
4 weeks annual leave
that is 144 days off a year (about 40%)
pilots get 42 days off (about 12%)
i hope you are not a captain if that is the way you
look at data before you, you think we should go from 12% down to 8%. An airline managers dream.
It is easy to see who is getting raped by their employer
and I sincerely hope you’re no where near an aircraft. A real concern!
Last edited by B043; 1st Apr 2023 at 11:10.
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normal worker has 52 weekends plus 12 public holidays (or more depending on the state) plus 4 weeks annual leave
that is 144 days off a year (about 40%)
pilots get 42 days off (about 12%)
i hope you are not a captain if that is the way you look at data before you, you think we should go from 12% down to 8%. An airline managers dream.
that is 144 days off a year (about 40%)
pilots get 42 days off (about 12%)
i hope you are not a captain if that is the way you look at data before you, you think we should go from 12% down to 8%. An airline managers dream.
The following 4 users liked this post by Eclan:
This is certainly interesting to ponder. Not just for us, but for many industries. To me the biggest benefit is choice. Some people want Christmas, Easter off etc. I personally don't. I am more than happy to work public holidays etc. I hate going away in peak periods and having to put up with people's annoying offspring and crowd's etc. Choice is always a good thing.
But this could have such a huge quality of life benefit for so many people that I can't see the government letting anything happen from it. Healthcare providers would burn the country down before they give their nurse's anything.
But if COVID has taught me something, there is zero care and loyalty in this game anymore. So if you don't give me my wife's birthday off or the kids footy grand final off I sure as hell won't turning up.
But this could have such a huge quality of life benefit for so many people that I can't see the government letting anything happen from it. Healthcare providers would burn the country down before they give their nurse's anything.
But if COVID has taught me something, there is zero care and loyalty in this game anymore. So if you don't give me my wife's birthday off or the kids footy grand final off I sure as hell won't turning up.
You can add some days off to the 42 days leave.
Typical 28 day roster has 8-10 days off depending on employer, making 108-130 extra days off.
Making 150-172 days off. 👍
If you happen to use your sick leave (2 +wks) you only work 50% of the year any way 🤷♂️🤫
Typical 28 day roster has 8-10 days off depending on employer, making 108-130 extra days off.
Making 150-172 days off. 👍
If you happen to use your sick leave (2 +wks) you only work 50% of the year any way 🤷♂️🤫
interesting, though, that the test case involved miners, who work in a famously 24/7 365 industry and it’s not like anyone could reasonably claim they are underpaid. Closing down medical and emergency services would lead to anarchy pretty abruptly, but you can close air travel down for 18 months or more and society will keep trudging along, so calling it essential is a bit of a stretch. They might find themselves in a situation where they have to demonstrate that their service is more essential than mining- no mean feat in Australia.
Won't stop them from trying on the "essential" caveat though. When the time comes, this should be the first thing they need to be reminded of.
The following 2 users liked this post by KRUSTY 34:
and they will respond with the government ‘minimum domestic network’ and ‘IFAM’ etc etc.
To which the unions should respond ‘well you only needed x pilots for that’
it’s simple. You can have any day of the year off you want. (Except Xmas day…..) we don’t need a PH mandate. The reality is this will only benefit the hours pigs who live for money. The only other benefit I see is if there is some kind of penalty attached and you are assigned work on a PH, you’ll get something extra.