Disgusting Jetstar
I'm sorry, but unless they turned up late or checked in separately, you can't say it's not Jetstar's fault. The check in agent has eyes and the ability to read and would have seen they were split seated. Maybe he/she did, maybe the pax didn't care at that stage or maybe they just handed them the BP and let them go blissfully unaware. I don't know a check in agent of any experience who wouldn't have looked at the seats and at least tried to do something, if they were the 207, 8 and 9th to check in out of 209 then it's not JQ's fault but if they checked in halfway, I know it's a low cost carrier but there's no cost in moving a few seats around and re-printing the BP.
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The whole point is being missed here, whether you agree of the demand of the passenger wanting to be seated with his family or not, when you board the aircraft you agree that you will follow crew member instructions if you agree or not none of these instructions are unreasonable.
This guy flat out denied and if you watch the video in full he comes across as intimidating to the CM by raising his voice. The CM escalated to the PIC where then the AFP got involved where they also gave this guy a lawful direction where he denied after multiple warnings AFP officers they also escalated as this guy denied to follow their lawful directions.
All this guy had to do was follow the direction of the CM and none of this would of occurred and he would be in ML with his family that it was so important for him to sit with, now he is on the other side of the country wasting money on hotels. I hope he gets the full extent of the law thrown at him and never to fly a QF group AC again. We can’t have this behavior occurring on board AC.
This guy flat out denied and if you watch the video in full he comes across as intimidating to the CM by raising his voice. The CM escalated to the PIC where then the AFP got involved where they also gave this guy a lawful direction where he denied after multiple warnings AFP officers they also escalated as this guy denied to follow their lawful directions.
All this guy had to do was follow the direction of the CM and none of this would of occurred and he would be in ML with his family that it was so important for him to sit with, now he is on the other side of the country wasting money on hotels. I hope he gets the full extent of the law thrown at him and never to fly a QF group AC again. We can’t have this behavior occurring on board AC.
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I remember a story about VA not so long ago where it certainly appeared from the reporting that a passenger asked a question and the gate staff called the police.
Gate staff often call the police with the slightest disagreement. In my day
but with nearly 40 years of experience I question if this couldn't have been handled better.
So how did they get away with "free seating (unallocated)" when they first launched?
As I said, nobody ever cared about seating and identification purposes wasn't ever a consideration (CASA/the airline/the crew)
If it's a mutal swap (as I said), it has no effect at all.
Your argument is invalid.
As I said, nobody ever cared about seating and identification purposes wasn't ever a consideration (CASA/the airline/the crew)
If it's a mutal swap (as I said), it has no effect at all.
Your argument is invalid.
And do you believe that story to be accurate? If so you aren’t using your brain to overcome your emotions, you’re just identifying a story that fits with your idea that things are no good now days, and rolling with it. Apply some critical thinking to that story. It’s complete rubbish.
No they don’t. Why do you think that’s the case? I’ve operated about 4000 sectors out of major Australian ports in the last 15 years and have had Police to the aircraft twice. Both well deserved, one booze and ego, the other mental health.
If it could have been handled better my guess is that the improvements are to be made after the AFP entered the scene. That said, I don’t want to judge them without knowing the full story.
No they don’t. Why do you think that’s the case? I’ve operated about 4000 sectors out of major Australian ports in the last 15 years and have had Police to the aircraft twice. Both well deserved, one booze and ego, the other mental health.
If it could have been handled better my guess is that the improvements are to be made after the AFP entered the scene. That said, I don’t want to judge them without knowing the full story.
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The whole point is being missed here, whether you agree of the demand of the passenger wanting to be seated with his family or not, when you board the aircraft you agree that you will follow crew member instructions if you agree or not none of these instructions are unreasonable.
This guy flat out denied and if you watch the video in full he comes across as intimidating to the CM by raising his voice. The CM escalated to the PIC where then the AFP got involved where they also gave this guy a lawful direction where he denied after multiple warnings AFP officers they also escalated as this guy denied to follow their lawful directions.
All this guy had to do was follow the direction of the CM and none of this would of occurred and he would be in ML with his family that it was so important for him to sit with, now he is on the other side of the country wasting money on hotels. I hope he gets the full extent of the law thrown at him and never to fly a QF group AC again. We can’t have this behavior occurring on board AC.
This guy flat out denied and if you watch the video in full he comes across as intimidating to the CM by raising his voice. The CM escalated to the PIC where then the AFP got involved where they also gave this guy a lawful direction where he denied after multiple warnings AFP officers they also escalated as this guy denied to follow their lawful directions.
All this guy had to do was follow the direction of the CM and none of this would of occurred and he would be in ML with his family that it was so important for him to sit with, now he is on the other side of the country wasting money on hotels. I hope he gets the full extent of the law thrown at him and never to fly a QF group AC again. We can’t have this behavior occurring on board AC.
All the FA had to do was recognise that it didn't really matter if both the swappers were happy and the passenger would be in ML with his family instead of back spending a load of money on hotels etc. etc.
See, anyone can make an argument that makes sense to their own point of view!
Despite all the over-hyped bad publicity Qantas gets these days and the deserved criticism in many respects of the 'Feral Abacus' running QF, you never hear of this sort of thing on a Qantas aeroplane. Perhaps because despite all the changes over the last 10-20 years, the CC are still professional and know how to deal with people.
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All the FA had to do was recognise that it didn't really matter if both the swappers were happy and the passenger would be in ML with his family instead of back spending a load of money on hotels etc. etc.
See, anyone can make an argument that makes sense to their own point of view!
See, anyone can make an argument that makes sense to their own point of view!
It serves for identification purposes in the event of "the sh1t really hitting the fan"
Do some research on DVI teams. Victims are never identified by the seat they are sitting in for all the obvious reasons.
Also remember that in the developing country that is Australia, airlines have no idea WHO is traveling on their aircraft.
Decades flying in a big country to the north and I’ve seen whole aircraft been taken over by passengers in protest of delays , police turn up and shrug saying it’s your problem . Never seen cops remove a passenger unless arrested for stealing only in Australia do we taser for wanting to swap seats ?
In this instance the seating issue shouldn't have made it to the aircraft, traveling as a family he should have had it sorted at checkin, checking in at a kiosk doesn't permit seating coordination, it's pot luck. Traveling as a family of five we leave seating till we put the bags through, staff have always managed a row plus two across the aisle or row in front/behind. Don't know if having frequent flyer cards helps, or the fact we are always early. Checking in late is obviously going to seriously curtail your options.
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I'm sorry, but unless they turned up late or checked in separately, you can't say it's not Jetstar's fault. The check in agent has eyes and the ability to read and would have seen they were split seated. Maybe he/she did, maybe the pax didn't care at that stage or maybe they just handed them the BP and let them go blissfully unaware. I don't know a check in agent of any experience who wouldn't have looked at the seats and at least tried to do something, if they were the 207, 8 and 9th to check in out of 209 then it's not JQ's fault but if they checked in halfway, I know it's a low cost carrier but there's no cost in moving a few seats around and re-printing the BP.
Society has changed. More flying, fewer frills, more passengers, greater sense of entitlement. You'd have to be blind not see the changes in societal behaviours since the internet was invented.
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You risk being nibbled to death by ducks. If you let one passenger dictate where they'll sit and how they'll behave then you'll be dealing with, potentially, 20 then 30 and then a whole plane load of pax who want to decide how the operation is going to be run.
Never said people should be able to choose their seats or do their own seat swaps, not at any time. I was saying that there is an entry in the system to change a pax from one seat to another, it's not rocket science and it's possible to do it at check in. It's called customer service, even in an LCC. They all rave about it on their website so they should show at least a modicum of an effort.
Society has changed. More flying, fewer frills, more passengers, greater sense of entitlement. You'd have to be blind not see the changes in societal behaviours since the internet was invented.
Never said people should be able to choose their seats or do their own seat swaps, not at any time. I was saying that there is an entry in the system to change a pax from one seat to another, it's not rocket science and it's possible to do it at check in. It's called customer service, even in an LCC. They all rave about it on their website so they should show at least a modicum of an effort.
Society has changed. More flying, fewer frills, more passengers, greater sense of entitlement. You'd have to be blind not see the changes in societal behaviours since the internet was invented.
In this instance the seating issue shouldn't have made it to the aircraft, traveling as a family he should have had it sorted at checkin, checking in at a kiosk doesn't permit seating coordination, it's pot luck. Traveling as a family of five we leave seating till we put the bags through, staff have always managed a row plus two across the aisle or row in front/behind. Don't know if having frequent flyer cards helps, or the fact we are always early. Checking in late is obviously going to seriously curtail your options.
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So how did the cabin crew even become aware of these two swapping seats? I've seen passengers move to empty seats before take off, I've seen passengers swap seats during boarding or before take off. I've never seen the cabin crew come and tell them to move back, even if they saw them do it. I thought maybe the guy just took that seat and the assigned passenger complained to the crew when he found the guy in it, but in I see in the video the swap seemed to be mutual. Irrespective of the "failed to obey the instructions of the crew" angle, how the hell did it spiral out of control in the first place? There's more to this, and the reasons could be ugly.
Rules are Rules, If you don't follow cabin crew directions then you are breaking them. Whether you think it's right or wrong the crew acted within their boundary. It's not a bus, tram or Light rail, you are given a seat which is probably for a safety reason ( weight/balance) then you sit in it.
It was his inability to follow directions in the first place that led to the cops turning up.
His argument over his entitlement to swap seats is an entirely seperate issue, the two should not be confused.
So how did the cabin crew even become aware of these two swapping seats? I've seen passengers move to empty seats before take off, I've seen passengers swap seats during boarding or before take off. I've never seen the cabin crew come and tell them to move back, even if they saw them do it. I thought maybe the guy just took that seat and the assigned passenger complained to the crew when he found the guy in it, but in I see in the video the swap seemed to be mutual. Irrespective of the "failed to obey the instructions of the crew" angle, how the hell did it spiral out of control in the first place? There's more to this, and the reasons could be ugly.
Or they just could have seen him do it.