Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

QF mandates Vaccine

Old 19th Oct 2021, 09:17
  #1021 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
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Wiz
Then i bet you never WENT on the tarmac without it. Been fronted by tarmac Nazis in the UK for not having my Hi-Viz zipped up, Hearing protection was an ops manual requirement at EK, and you think the JAPANESE don't stricktley enforce standars?
Never went out with the muffs, never got fronted by anyone ever.

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Old 19th Oct 2021, 10:24
  #1022 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by C441 View Post
Later in that episode there was an amusing pitch encouraging people to get vaccinated……
This one's better
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 11:21
  #1023 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by galdian View Post
Those vaccinated will move forward, those not will fall behind.
Whether right or wrong is irrelevant
Actually, I believe the “whether right or wrong” is the entire point of this thread.

I’m vaccinated, and I encourage all to do the same.

But I reject the right of my employer to mandate it, and I suggest a well-fought human rights case may support that at some time in the future.

When was the last time any of you had a beer with someone who grew up in a country with no human rights?
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 11:31
  #1024 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capn Rex Havoc View Post
Wiz

Never went out with the muffs, never got fronted by anyone ever.
From time to time I've forgotten and done a walk around without them in Australia, and never been fronted- does that mean you're talking sh1t about it being regulation in Australia?

You broke regulations and got away with it. Doesn't mean they didn't exist, and you said i was talking sh1t when i wasn't.

Appollogise.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 11:32
  #1025 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Derfred View Post
Actually, I believe the “whether right or wrong” is the entire point of this thread.

I’m vaccinated, and I encourage all to do the same.

But I reject the right of my employer to mandate it, and I suggest a well-fought human rights case may support that at some time in the future.

When was the last time any of you had a beer with someone who grew up in a country with no human rights?
Once again well said Derfred, you have a natural skill in saying it the right way.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 11:46
  #1026 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Derfred View Post
Actually, I believe the “whether right or wrong” is the entire point of this thread.

I’m vaccinated, and I encourage all to do the same.

But I reject the right of my employer to mandate it, and I suggest a well-fought human rights case may support that at some time in the future.

When was the last time any of you had a beer with someone who grew up in a country with no human rights?
Oh come on - you trying to say Oz suddenly has NO human rights because of the discussion regards vaccinations?
The world is imperfect, Oz is imperfect - but on a relative scale of horrors that happen around the world we're not doing too bad, could do better but not too bad IMHO.

So simple Q: if QF policy goes from push to shove are you going to resign in disgust to support those who desire not to be vaccinated?
I have no doubt you'll come up with a "maybe" response when a simple YES/NO to a simple question will suffice.

Cheers.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 11:54
  #1027 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 1998
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Originally Posted by galdian View Post
So simple Q: if QF policy goes from push to shove are you going to resign in disgust to support those who desire not to be vaccinated?
I have no doubt you'll come up with a "maybe" response when a simple YES/NO to a simple question will suffice.

Cheers.
No! and that's been made quite clear, Yes Australia is doing really well and that's got nothing to do with company imposed mandates. To be honest I'm grateful to you Galgian. You have shown me a way to dress up a pig as something you will support which will come in handy down the track. I wouldn't have had the insight to dream that up myself.
Toxic waste is a fertilizer.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 12:04
  #1028 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by galdian View Post
OK got me there, was looking at what 99.99% of your posts on this thread bang away at 99.99% of the time.

You want to encourage a thread drift - pretty poor one at that - fill your boots.

My comments regards 99.99% of your posts banging away 99.99% of the time regards vaccination - and your impending irrelevancy - still stand.

Cheers.
In case you didn't notice I support and encourage vaccination, go back and read. I support Public Health Orders, I do not support a private/listed company imposing such a thing upon it's existing employees, outside of a Public Health Order. Nor will I play any role in policing any such Order. I'm sure you won't either.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 13:23
  #1029 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Derfred View Post
Actually, I believe the “whether right or wrong” is the entire point of this thread.

I’m vaccinated, and I encourage all to do the same.

But I reject the right of my employer to mandate it, and I suggest a well-fought human rights case may support that at some time in the future.
It’s definitely an interesting question to consider, what you’re saying. Currently the courts up to the Supreme Court in NSW have ruled that under the present circumstances, some - not all, but some - employers can make vaccination a condition of employment. QF and healthcare being some examples of those employers. They also make the point that, from the legal perspective, no-one is being forced to vaccinate, they aren’t being grabbed and held down and jabbed; any individual is free to tender their resignation and walk away unvaccinated. Whether they choose to do that is a choice they make. I think the courts see it as similar to having a driving licence; you don’t have to have one, unless you voluntarily want to carry out some activity, driving in this case, and it’s not an infringement on a right as there are other ways to get around - walk, Uber, taxi, bicycle and so on.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 13:47
  #1030 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by De_flieger View Post
It’s definitely an interesting question to consider, what you’re saying. Currently the courts up to the Supreme Court in NSW have ruled that under the present circumstances, some - not all, but some - employers can make vaccination a condition of employment. QF and healthcare being some examples of those employers. They also make the point that, from the legal perspective, no-one is being forced to vaccinate, they aren’t being grabbed and held down and jabbed; any individual is free to tender their resignation and walk away unvaccinated. Whether they choose to do that is a choice they make. I think the courts see it as similar to having a driving licence; you don’t have to have one, unless you voluntarily want to carry out some activity, driving in this case, and it’s not an infringement on a right as there are other ways to get around - walk, Uber, taxi, bicycle and so on.
And the Greta Thundburg (?) blah blah blah award for the day - how many maybe/ifs/perhaps/sort ofs can be contained within a single paragraph that starts nowhere - yet ends behind from where it started?

Impressive effort. Congrats.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 14:20
  #1031 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by galdian View Post
And the Greta Thundburg (?) blah blah blah award for the day - how many maybe/ifs/perhaps/sort ofs can be contained within a single paragraph that starts nowhere - yet ends behind from where it started?

Impressive effort. Congrats.
Huh? Didn't realise I'd managed to piss in your weeties so thoroughly, especially as I agree with your last few posts here. Also I can't see a single occurrence of an "if", "but", "maybe" or "sort of".

You want the short version: I think the implications of company vaccine requirements are interesting to consider the pros and cons of, but the courts have upheld them in these circumstances.

Or as someone said a few posts back, regarding the non-vax mob:
Questions of legality of company directives may be taken to court but I'm guessing will not fall the way of the non-vax brigade.

You've had a good run, dominated the conversation, I suspect you'll be left to yelling at clouds and largely ignored in the very near future.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 15:16
  #1032 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by De_flieger View Post
They also make the point that, from the legal perspective, no-one is being forced to vaccinate, they aren’t being grabbed and held down and jabbed; any individual is free to tender their resignation and walk away unvaccinated. Whether they choose to do that is a choice they make.
That’s an interesting human-rights insight when you view it from the perspective of virtually every employer (or the government) making a vaccination a pre-requisite for a job.

No, you don’t need a vaccination, you are free! But good luck getting a job, or being allowed to go to a supermarket to buy food, or being allowed to have your children attend a school. Australians are free citizens!

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Old 19th Oct 2021, 15:26
  #1033 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by De_flieger View Post
Really? Where? Can you show me an Australian health service making this admission? Or is this another one of those "I heard it from someone who posted it on twitter" type "facts" that get posted here, in the hope that by spreading them around a variety of forums, people see them in numerous locations and feel like they might be true? That's one technique used to spread disinformation.
NSW Health made the admission back in August but it was not widely reported, possibly because of the age-old fact that good news doesn't sell as many newspapers. According to NSW Health not as many people have died of coronavirus as was previously reported to the population. It's hard to believe they were ignorant of the facts so it would seem they lied intentionally.

In Vic and Qld and in several jurisidictions in the USA and UK they admitted much earlier in the year that they were doing the same but as already pointed out you won't read about it in most of the mainstream media where most people seem to get their "information."

Originally Posted by De_flieger View Post
Have errors been made? Sure, in any large system there will be errors. That's not the same as systemic fraud.
This wasn't an error, it was deliberately deceptive reporting. The health dept is there to give us the true picture of the threat, not inflate it and incite fear.

Originally Posted by De_flieger View Post
There's no incentive to claim a death is due to covid or otherwise in Australia though.
Of course there's an incentive. There are billion$ of incentives. Wake up, man.

Last edited by Mullah Kintyre; 19th Oct 2021 at 15:41.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 17:53
  #1034 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by skygeek View Post
We also should apply similar rules to other public areas adjusted for local specifics. Until we do that and continue being content with half-measures things won't get back to normal and it will be difficult to enjoy our lives again.
Location: EUSSR Your location speaks volumes about who you are. I always thought that pilots are the most spineless, uncritical, and self-disrespecting conformists in society. It was fine as long as you and your kind could only destroy the culture and conditions in your own decaying profession, but now you are moving along to promote a fascist vaccine apartheid for the entire society based on the bullshit the media makes you believe.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 22:44
  #1035 (permalink)  
 
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Ladies and gentlemen, some of you seem to have forgotten the first rule of forums (fora?) such as this.

Don't feed the trolls!
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 22:50
  #1036 (permalink)  
 
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NSW Health made the admission back in August but it was not widely reported, possibly because of the age-old fact that good news doesn't sell as many newspapers. According to NSW Health not as many people have died of coronavirus as was previously reported to the population. It's hard to believe they were ignorant of the facts so it would seem they lied intentionally.
Hardly anyone dies from covid, again this is like Aids, you don't die from it, it complicates existing conditions that might otherwise be survivable. Heart failure is a commonplace complication from virus infection, the virus can stress the heart above normal levels and then a pre-existing deformity is exposed and you die. Hence the healthier you are the less likely you are to die from viral infections. This is in the same way flu & covid leads to pneumonia, you die from the pneumonia, the underlying condition is flu/covid. The UK has a lot of study subject matter on this due to the high amount of deaths there. If you already have emphysema you will die from that with complications from covid, you could have survived another 5 years who knows.

The nature of a virus is that it does not want to kill you, you are food for it, the host is integral to it's survival. It just kills because it overwhelms the hosts system to keep it alive and to survive in the host it has to be strong to avoid being instantly kicked by the immune system. Because it relies on evolution as to whether it survives in you, it can be pot luck what it does to the host to survive.

The question to be asked is, "would that person have died from that illness, then and there, had they not had covid" if the answer is yes, then covid not a factor, if no then covid was a factor. In almost all cases the nature of covid makes it a contributory factor in at least 80% of deaths with covid (overseas studies). The UK separates with and from into separate categories so it's clear and what they found was not much significant change from what was being recorded.

If the numbers were so out of whack then they would be revised, but they have not, showing there's a high chance that covid was a significant reason they died on that day.
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Old 19th Oct 2021, 22:50
  #1037 (permalink)  
 
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**** me, does everyone refuse all the required shots for destinations you fly to because it might impinge on your friggin human rights as well?
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Old 20th Oct 2021, 02:37
  #1038 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
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OHS or whatever they call it in other countries is what determines what safety gear you have to work with, from hearing protection if its noisy to hard hats on worksites, to hi-vis if collision dangers to sunglasses and sunscreen in outdoor occupations. Most of it is common sense, and you wont be entering most construction sites without minimum OHS gear. Not sure why this is so hard to understand, watch the block all the tradies have to do OHS induction. Just about every country has this.

By the way if you are stupid enough to ignore the rules and get injured on worksite you can expect some pushback for work-cover claims etc... So its nice to say how cool you are to ignore a hivis or hearing protection rule, just remember when you go to claim for that loss they will remember.

Again this site is really just highlighting how stupid people can be, just to be righteous or principled.

Masks and Vaccinations are under the health Act, not workplace OHS.
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Old 20th Oct 2021, 02:38
  #1039 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
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Originally Posted by level_change View Post
Location: EUSSR Your location speaks volumes about who you are. I always thought that pilots are the most spineless, uncritical, and self-disrespecting conformists in society. It was fine as long as you and your kind could only destroy the culture and conditions in your own decaying profession, but now you are moving along to promote a fascist vaccine apartheid for the entire society based on the bullshit the media makes you believe.
Yeah , blindly complying with standard operating procedures, legislated rules and regulations, required standards in the simulator, occupational health and safety, equal opportunity legislation, CRM etc. etc.
Come to think of it my whole career infringed my personal rights.
Wish I had been exposed to the powerfully intellectually persuasive arguments of anti-vaxxers earlier !!
Would have been so liberating!!
No career but at least I would have been free !!!
Oh, wait a minute…….
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Old 20th Oct 2021, 02:57
  #1040 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
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Anddddd that is Australia in a nutshell. But even then, they would never enforce it..... Seriously - you can't see what a Nanna, pussy state Australia has become.
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