Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

Virgin 3.0

Old 6th Apr 2021, 06:17
  #1441 (permalink)  
 
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Virgin have said they won’t be participating in Tasman flights aside the Queenstown seasonal until November.

Reason being the NGs more profitable on Domestic in the short term.

Possibly wise move. Chances of no interruptions on the Tasman border is probably zero for the next half.
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Old 6th Apr 2021, 06:41
  #1442 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wheels_down View Post
Virgin have said they won’t be participating in Tasman flights aside the Queenstown seasonal until November.

Reason being the NGs more profitable on Domestic in the short term.

Possibly wise move. Chances of no interruptions on the Tasman border is probably zero for the next half.
Apparently their post-administration reduced fleet is now basically fully utilised which is good news for VA staff.

Rumour has it that they are in negotiations with lessors who currently have ex-VA 738s parked in various deserts about reactivating under new leases. Chances are lease rates will be a bit lower than what the lessors previously got but they'll be better than having them parked earning nothing.
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Old 6th Apr 2021, 06:48
  #1443 (permalink)  
 
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Bain leases its aeroplanes at a flying hourly rate for VA.
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Old 6th Apr 2021, 08:56
  #1444 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by big buddah View Post
What?, clearly you have no insight into how the VANZ operation ran, the NZ operation was profitable without doing NZ domestic until it was changed to VAI. Then all the CASA complexities increased the crew from 120 to 200+. The great project Church, was to save $5m a year in AOC costs instead it cost over $50m to implement and added $5m a year to the overheads, plus all the lost operational benefits of having an NZ AOC.
NZ domestic was only done for a few years and was dropped 11+ years ago.
Explain to me how you can do a return from the east coast, with an NZ departure time of 0700am? or the 6pm departure from the east coast without overnighting? The two times that meet most of the connecting traffic and demand, you can't, so yes you can do returns from Aus but they won't be at any suitable times for the market.
There's a reason why Qantas and Jetstar have NZ based crew.
Ahh project Church, another mess of the past. The alleged benefits realisation never really turned to reality did they. "increased flying times, greater crew flexility, reduced cost base...."
Reality added complexity, additional constraints and lower crew utilisation.

Plenty of awkward looks around the room from resource planning, netops, and the rest during project close for that fiasco. Shame those same people are still there...

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Old 6th Apr 2021, 09:28
  #1445 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by didrechambers77 View Post
Ahh project Church, another mess of the past. The alleged benefits realisation never really turned to reality did they. "increased flying times, greater crew flexility, reduced cost base...."
Reality added complexity, additional constraints and lower crew utilisation.

Plenty of awkward looks around the room from resource planning, netops, and the rest during project close for that fiasco. Shame those same people are still there...
Give it time give it time. Another piece of Commercial legacy deadwood no longer has a role at VA and just left, so perhaps Network Ops and resource planning deadwood will be the next lot of FOD to be moved on to greener pastures? Mrs Jayne still has some house cleaning to do as some of the cockroaches are very very quick to hide and are hard to find. Speaking of which, I noticed that another ex VA has-been, Rob Sharp, has landed a gig as Secretary Transport NSW. Yes they all seem to land on their feet - Sharp, Scurrah, Borghetti, Godfrey. All had a crack at the VA title and all have come away losers. They are names that should be long forgotten along with Aggs (not long to go now), Swift, Huttner, Highfield, Sherrard, Pen, and Andrew David?


Last edited by Paragraph377; 6th Apr 2021 at 11:16.
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Old 6th Apr 2021, 09:46
  #1446 (permalink)  
 
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Don’t forget MM.

What a joke the whole thing was.
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Old 7th Apr 2021, 00:36
  #1447 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 1A_Please View Post
Apparently their post-administration reduced fleet is now basically fully utilised which is good news for VA staff.

Rumour has it that they are in negotiations with lessors who currently have ex-VA 738s parked in various deserts about reactivating under new leases. Chances are lease rates will be a bit lower than what the lessors previously got but they'll be better than having them parked earning nothing.
Was already reported mid March.

The 737s in question were just returned/ferried back to the USA. Bain will be paying to ferry those 737s back from the USA to Australia with a revised lease agreement.

https://www.smh.com.au/business/comp...15-p57ax4.html
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Old 7th Apr 2021, 04:02
  #1448 (permalink)  
 
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The 737s in question were just returned/ferried back to the USA. Bain will be paying to ferry those 737s back from the USA to Australia with a revised lease agreement.
Dan, the ferry costs would be less than one week's lease payments at the old rate.If the frames have been sitting there for even a couple of months, the negotiations commence based on the new very different market, VA is way ahead.
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Old 7th Apr 2021, 04:04
  #1449 (permalink)  
 
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Would all leasing companies want to play ball considering many were left short changed out of the administration?

It wouldn’t be the first creditor (or Corp customers) telling them to fark off when they tried renegotiating again.
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Old 7th Apr 2021, 06:17
  #1450 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wheels_down View Post
Would all leasing companies want to play ball considering many were left short changed out of the administration?

It wouldn’t be the first creditor (or Corp customers) telling them to fark off when they tried renegotiating again.
The lease companies did not do too badly. The headline losses they reported was because accounting standards show the total lease liability over the life of the lease. VA were not months behind in their lease payments so the losses to lessors were not inordinate and having the planes sitting in the desert makes for a bigger loss.

Most leasing companies would be happy to talk to Bain about new leases particularly as the lease companies don't have to provide incentives for repainting and refitting, in theory the planes are almost good to go. If it meant getting the planes earning money again sooner, some lessors may even finance getting the 737s back downunder.
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Old 8th Apr 2021, 01:00
  #1451 (permalink)  
ebt
 
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Yep, the bankers will forgive many sins if it means that money comes through the door, and it reduces their costs compared to trying to on-lease an aircraft to another lessee. There aren't too many airlines looking to add 737NGs to their fleets in a hurry, and given that most of the VA frames will have been making good money in the past, taking a bit of a haircut on the lease rental to get them back into the fleet is not too bitter a pill for most to swallow. It's much better to explain to the shareholders why there is less rental revenue coming in, rather than having to justify why their assets are gathering dust in the desert and still racking up interest payments.
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Old 8th Apr 2021, 02:39
  #1452 (permalink)  
 
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Would leasing companies want to get their aircraft on line and out of the Arizona desert? I would say so.

On line with a company who conveniently require no config/cabin changes or even paintjob? I reckon yes.

Part of the reason that leasing is so popular is that the assets are so easy to get back if the lessee fails to pay. It's much harder to tow a mining truck or other heavy machinery back to its country of origin.
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Old 8th Apr 2021, 23:38
  #1453 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
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3 previously returned (leased) 737-800's from Virgin Mk 1 will be ferried back to Brisbane in the next 2-3 weeks ex Goodyear, AZ to re-join the fleet as Virgin Australia Mk 2 begins to ramp up operations.

The first one will arrive early next week, departing the US on Saturday.

Last edited by TheRealGeoffThomas; 9th Apr 2021 at 11:44.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 02:24
  #1454 (permalink)  
 
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At least 3 of the ex-VA 737s stored in Arizona will be returning to Aus in the next few weeks.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 03:25
  #1455 (permalink)  
 
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This is a question of genuine interest, what will make the operation profitable this time around? i.e where have the savings been made? I hope Virgin 3.0 is successful and a lot of my colleagues get jobs secured, I am just struggling to see what is different this time apart from a load of debt being written off.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 03:51
  #1456 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ollie Onion View Post
This is a question of genuine interest, what will make the operation profitable this time around? i.e where have the savings been made? I hope Virgin 3.0 is successful and a lot of my colleagues get jobs secured, I am just struggling to see what is different this time apart from a load of debt being written off.
By having a much lower cost base. By only operating routes that are profitable. By having a management team that is incentivised to run a profitable airlines.

They will save a heap of coin by not chasing Qantas and leasing aircraft at the worlds most expensive rates (think a330 and ATR).

They’re almost going back to the profitable virgin blue days and undoing the money drain ideas that were bought in by previous management.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 03:55
  #1457 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ollie Onion View Post
This is a question of genuine interest, what will make the operation profitable this time around? i.e where have the savings been made? I hope Virgin 3.0 is successful and a lot of my colleagues get jobs secured, I am just struggling to see what is different this time apart from a load of debt being written off.
I would say primarily the fact that they are completely recapitalised through administration. Also terminating the dud contracts in the process will help.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 03:57
  #1458 (permalink)  
 
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Hmmm..

By having a management team that is incentivised to run a profitable airlines.
It cracks me up that employees are supposed to be efficient, fuel-wise, schedule-aware, safe, timely, motivated, compliant, engaged, SOP and, in the bargain, thankful for the privilege of the job.

On the other hand, management seem to need to be “incentivised” to do the job well.🙄
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 04:11
  #1459 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Jetsbest View Post
It cracks me up that employees are supposed to be efficient, fuel-wise, schedule-aware, safe, timely, motivated, compliant, engaged, SOP and, in the bargain, thankful for the privilege of the job.

On the other hand, management seem to need to be “incentivised” to do the job well.🙄
It’s a real shame but that’s big business unfortunately. The PE owners will squeeze everything out of the place to maximise their pay day.
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Old 9th Apr 2021, 05:43
  #1460 (permalink)  
 
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ACCC gives final approval to Virgin-Alliance partnership for regional routes: https://www.executivetraveller.com/n...es-partnership
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