QF Group possible Redundancy Numbers/Packages
Maybe the risk analysis coupled with TRE feedback at training meetings has finally made them nervous?
I haven’t thought about flying an aeroplane for close to 12 months now. I certainly haven’t opened a manual. I’ve had better things to do, namely focus my efforts on my family and the people who now pay my salary. It’s going to be interesting to see how things go if and when I get back to work.
I haven’t thought about flying an aeroplane for close to 12 months now. I certainly haven’t opened a manual. I’ve had better things to do, namely focus my efforts on my family and the people who now pay my salary. It’s going to be interesting to see how things go if and when I get back to work.
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Maybe the risk analysis coupled with TRE feedback at training meetings has finally made them nervous?
I haven’t thought about flying an aeroplane for close to 12 months now. I certainly haven’t opened a manual. I’ve had better things to do, namely focus my efforts on my family and the people who now pay my salary. It’s going to be interesting to see how things go if and when I get back to work.
I haven’t thought about flying an aeroplane for close to 12 months now. I certainly haven’t opened a manual. I’ve had better things to do, namely focus my efforts on my family and the people who now pay my salary. It’s going to be interesting to see how things go if and when I get back to work.
Nunc est bibendum
I know that from the discussions I’ve had with a few different people the LWOP aspect hasn’t even rated a mention. They were in fact quite conscious of the impact the PPP would have on people’s employment. Various iterations were being considered including it being just a weekend thing that people could fit in around their employment or be able to do whilst just taking an extra day or so off from their current work. Of course stupid lock down rules complicate things considerably and I don’t know how or why it ended up as the current system.
To suggest it’s intent or even secondary effect is to force people onto LWOP? I think that just demonstrates once again that pilots tend to jump at shadows.
I fear this year will feel longer and harder than last year as frustrations over what is occurring (or not occurring) increase. The PPP has already increased the level of angst for some as they work through what it means from them without more information. Theories such as the above will only increase the level of angst for some.
Be nice to each other. Take care. Happy New Year to all.
During our restructuring meetings with management it was voiced to us that Flying Operations were disappointed that flight crew were not keeping up with online courses, downloading manual updates etc, they put out several emails suggesting people use the 'break' to bone up on manual and SOP knowledge. I was amazed that they were surprised how when people are not getting paid they didn't want to carry out work tasks. Now I know there are some aerosexual's out there who get off on reading manuals but personally I do work related stuff when I am at work, if I am not working or being paid I don't even open my Company Ipad. I had no issues going back after 6 months, but do they really expect us to carry on with work related tasks when we are stood down on no pay?
The PPP is aimed at crew who are standing up once every 4-6 months. IE those that still want the flying when it comes around. For those who have been stood down longer than 6-7 months (IE, those who have opted out of flying completely because of their new employment status), they do the new training courses as now outlined in the TACM whenever they decide to stand up and fly.
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The whole thing is a can of worms. People may be jumping at shadows about the company’s motives, but we’ve already seen during the pandemic how keen they are to force the LWOP option onto people to save a few measly bucks.
Nunc est bibendum
No objections to your first paragraph TL. I understand that. I’m hopeful and quietly confident that the aims of the PPP are honourable and won’t disadvantage people who aren’t able to organise the time off their new employment to do it. I’m also hopeful that they may be able to sort out some flexible arrangements/ modes of delivery for it.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
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No objections to your first paragraph TL. I understand that. I’m hopeful and quietly confident that the aims of the PPP are honourable and won’t disadvantage people who aren’t able to organise the time off their new employment to do it. I’m also hopeful that they may be able to sort out some flexible arrangements/ modes of delivery for it.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
Regarding the FSO my manager basically said since I’m only stood down I can be recalled with 14 days notice for the PPP. If that’s unachievable then my options are LWOP.
No objections to your first paragraph TL. I understand that. I’m hopeful and quietly confident that the aims of the PPP are honourable and won’t disadvantage people who aren’t able to organise the time off their new employment to do it. I’m also hopeful that they may be able to sort out some flexible arrangements/ modes of delivery for it.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
However, if those further down the list (who haven’t flown yet) are able to take leave from their secondary employment to stand up and fly for a month, wouldn’t that mean they’d able to take leave for the PPP also?
As a side note, no one was ‘forced’ onto LWOP. Many on here advocated strongly against taking it unless you had something else up your sleeve already.
Qantas wants all the flexibility in the world, but aren’t willing to pay for it. It can’t go on like this indefinitely.
It would be an interesting argument whether an employer has the right to demand an employee complete a duty which then results in mandatory quarantine.
There are various human rights that protect an individual from being detained including for the case of disease control. I understand that a crew member may be prepared to waive these rights if they wish to work however I’m not sure that an employer could enforce a work contract that would, as a result of crossing a border whilst working, create a situation where the employee is forced into detention thereby having their human rights breached.
If anyone knows the answer I’d love to hear it.
There are various human rights that protect an individual from being detained including for the case of disease control. I understand that a crew member may be prepared to waive these rights if they wish to work however I’m not sure that an employer could enforce a work contract that would, as a result of crossing a border whilst working, create a situation where the employee is forced into detention thereby having their human rights breached.
If anyone knows the answer I’d love to hear it.
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The big problem comes when leave is not available from your secondary employer, perhaps due to length of service or staffing levels. Do you risk that full time job which will see you through the next year, for what is effectively now a casual position at QF offering one month of work every so often? And from a financial perspective, the secondary employment might pay poorly which means the need to stay “attached” to QF in order to dip into leave as required, especially once JobKeeper ends.
Qantas wants all the flexibility in the world, but aren’t willing to pay for it. It can’t go on like this indefinitely.
Qantas wants all the flexibility in the world, but aren’t willing to pay for it. It can’t go on like this indefinitely.
This is 3rd wave , it will be devastating and there will be lay-offs .
The QF group will rebuild slowly and off the street over the next few years , and will be on a if you don’t like it leave contract ! As long as they don’t go broke !!
The QF group will rebuild slowly and off the street over the next few years , and will be on a if you don’t like it leave contract ! As long as they don’t go broke !!
We look after a severely immunocompromised close family member, if I am forced to stand up that will result in travel to anywhere there is community transmission and/or involves subsequent quarantine, I will direct them to my lawyer. If they say fine, go on LWOP, I will direct them to my lawyer for discrimination as every other pilot under the agreement has not been directed to take LWOP. I don't see how they can direct some to LWOP whilst leaving others just stood down. If they want me to come back to work, I will come back full-time as per the agreement, else I will stay stood down. I will take LWOP, if every single stood down pilot takes LWOP.
The The I think you will find you are not “stood up” your stand down is cancelled and you would be required to return to work as per your contract. If you didn’t wish to return to work then you would have a few options; a) take annual or long service leave, b) take LWOP, c) resign. The company can’t force you to do any of the above (they may suggest it’s in your best interest) but if you are not taking any of those options you will have to do what you are contractually obliged too or face disciplinary action. No conspiracy there just how they would see it.
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I believe ultimately it would be more complex than that or otherwise you’re a casual employee not a full time permanent employee as the concerned individual is.
Nunc est bibendum
Rather than jump at shadows, how about we do the right thing here by engaging firstly with your Base Ops managers re your concerns. After that, having taken some notes as to their response to your concerns, engage with the AIPA exec re any ongoing issues.
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If you’re LH yeah I’d be bloody worried. SH will come back hard again all this will be knocked on the head by March in time for Easter holidays.
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Are you honestly confident in this not occurring again and states being locked down? Same risk, same result.
