I demand to be an Airline Pilot - Tell em they're dreaming
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Agree, in todays modern cockpit its all about human factors, basic airmanship and piloting skills. Some people here seem to want to go back to the days of using WAC charts and plotters!
Does the OP realise that 'those damned millenials' are approaching 40 now with family, kids and a mortgage?
Stuck in the RHS waiting for more investment advice from the entitled snowflake in the left that won't listen to anyone but himself reflecting that 3 mill in super ain't enough
Why don't you do what I did...
Stuck in the RHS waiting for more investment advice from the entitled snowflake in the left that won't listen to anyone but himself reflecting that 3 mill in super ain't enough
Why don't you do what I did...
(Funny how you can always pick the posters who have done the miles and those who are making it up...........)
If you despise airline flying so much then why the need to come here and continuously tell everyone how much you hate it and warn youngsters about how much you hate it?
Does the OP realise that 'those damned millenials' are approaching 40 now with family, kids and a mortgage?
But we also have a situation where younger pilots, who's career progression will be delayed, may feel resentment for what has happened. Them taking a hit to their careers to keep an older generation alive, but not seeing anything in return. And not just in aviation, the worst hit industries in this crisis (retail, hospitality) are dominated by younger and casual workers. I predict it will be a big source of friction all over society.
Awwww, poor lookleft, did I say something on JB about religion that upset you?
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Super Cecil,
Not wanting to hijack the thread, but I have worked as Garbage collector, worked in an abottoir (5 years) GA for 5 years and in Airlines.
The Abottoir was actually a pretty fun job if your not a snowflake and don’t mind a bucketload of blood....but it is an abottoir after all.
Just saying I actually enjoyed the abottoir....better enjoying a bucketload of blood than wishing you should have applied a bucketload of kero to avoid you undershooting the runway in a jet.....
Not wanting to hijack the thread, but I have worked as Garbage collector, worked in an abottoir (5 years) GA for 5 years and in Airlines.
The Abottoir was actually a pretty fun job if your not a snowflake and don’t mind a bucketload of blood....but it is an abottoir after all.
Just saying I actually enjoyed the abottoir....better enjoying a bucketload of blood than wishing you should have applied a bucketload of kero to avoid you undershooting the runway in a jet.....
Awwww, poor lookleft, did I say something on JB about religion that upset you?
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After 30 years in the industry myself working on the ground for a major airline then for an airport operator being married to an ex hostie who was later an airline res centre manager I have had a lot of time in the industry. As well as my son who worked for a ground handling agent & my brother-in-law flew as a flight attendant for 37 years, I feel I am qualified to comment on the immediate future of the industry. Unfortunately with the way business has carried on with electronic conferencing country & even worldwide I think a lot of businesses will decide to conduct future meetings remotely which will result in a lot less business class & even economy class flying & a lot less hotel expenses. If this is correct ( & I hope I am wrong ) the industry will take a long time to recover with a lot of casualties in regard to carriers & as a result their staff be that air or ground crew & subsequent general airport staff will be affected in a huge way.
And energy management? It is also not uncommon to witness those incapable of pulling the thrust levers to idle in the upper 30's and only adding it when stabilized on final approach. Traffic permitting of course.
One might find themselves someday flying a Boeing or Airbus operating like a J3 Cub. It's best to know how to do that when it suddenly arises and no time to review the QRH or the casual banter of CRM which works wonderful most of the time.
After 30 years in the industry myself working on the ground for a major airline then for an airport operator being married to an ex hostie who was later an airline res centre manager I have had a lot of time in the industry. As well as my son who worked for a ground handling agent & my brother-in-law flew as a flight attendant for 37 years, I feel I am qualified to comment on the immediate future of the industry. Unfortunately with the way business has carried on with electronic conferencing country & even worldwide I think a lot of businesses will decide to conduct future meetings remotely which will result in a lot less business class & even economy class flying & a lot less hotel expenses. If this is correct ( & I hope I am wrong ) the industry will take a long time to recover with a lot of casualties in regard to carriers & as a result their staff be that air or ground crew & subsequent general airport staff will be affected in a huge way.
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Super Cecil , Its a bit rich for those who have never done it to pass judgement on airline flying.
I did 10 years in GA before jagging a slot in an airline and don’t regret a minute of it.
But compared to a multi- crew ,state of the art RPT jet and comprehensive cyclic training regime they are simply not comparable.
Sorry but you wont find too many people who have actually done it who say it is.
My only regret is this debacle will lead me to an early retirement
Its been a privilege.
I did 10 years in GA before jagging a slot in an airline and don’t regret a minute of it.
But compared to a multi- crew ,state of the art RPT jet and comprehensive cyclic training regime they are simply not comparable.
Sorry but you wont find too many people who have actually done it who say it is.
My only regret is this debacle will lead me to an early retirement
Its been a privilege.
Bonegi1 , I here you. One of the big issues of the decades long chase to the bottom , driven mostly by bean counters , means the work/life style balance has definitely deteriorated in my time in the game. Its the single biggest reason that I would caution young people against an airline career.
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Both statements are true , Super Cecil.
I have had the good fortune of experiencing the best years of the aviation industry.
But everybody in the industry knows that over the last 20 years there has been a relentless chase to the bottom at every level.
Flight Attendants, baggage handlers, front of counter staff and low cost carrier Pilots have all had their terms and conditions smashed.
The travelling public has become addicted to cheap airfares and don’t think for a second how that has been possible.
Now big fat chickens are coming home to roost.
Many positions like Flight Attendants , baggage handlers were casualized. Now there are all screwed.
Low cost operators work on wafer thin margins and small if any cash reserves. Zero resilience. Now they are screwed.
And yet some posters still bitch and moan at the shocking cost of airfares on carriers that price their services properly.
The industry as a whole will come out of this back to where it was at the end of the GFS. Zero net profit since WW2.
This shake up was always going to happen. Now it has and many people will suffer.
Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else.
I have had the good fortune of experiencing the best years of the aviation industry.
But everybody in the industry knows that over the last 20 years there has been a relentless chase to the bottom at every level.
Flight Attendants, baggage handlers, front of counter staff and low cost carrier Pilots have all had their terms and conditions smashed.
The travelling public has become addicted to cheap airfares and don’t think for a second how that has been possible.
Now big fat chickens are coming home to roost.
Many positions like Flight Attendants , baggage handlers were casualized. Now there are all screwed.
Low cost operators work on wafer thin margins and small if any cash reserves. Zero resilience. Now they are screwed.
And yet some posters still bitch and moan at the shocking cost of airfares on carriers that price their services properly.
The industry as a whole will come out of this back to where it was at the end of the GFS. Zero net profit since WW2.
This shake up was always going to happen. Now it has and many people will suffer.
Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else.
Last edited by George Glass; 13th Apr 2020 at 05:01.
I have friends in business and they are complaining that their ‘zoom’ meetings just don’t cut it. You don’t pick up on the subtleties of communication, ie poker face, which is what business is all about really. They have said they will go back to face to face meetings, which includes interstate and international travel as a soon as possible. Hopefully for our sake, their opinion is the majority.
I have friends in business and they are complaining that their ‘zoom’ meetings just don’t cut it. You don’t pick up on the subtleties of communication, ie poker face, which is what business is all about really. They have said they will go back to face to face meetings, which includes interstate and international travel as a soon as possible. Hopefully for our sake, their opinion is the majority.
Physical face-to-face is likely to remain an essential business tool
Many (25?) years ago I was involved in looking at the cost-effectiveness of meetings / decision-making using video vs audio vs face-to-face vs email, and combinations of these.
Face-to-face was highest value / highest-cost.
Video was better than audio was better than email etc.
Optimum value for money was a combination of F2F & video. F2F even added value to subsequent video sessions.
The cost of technology will have reduced, but the high-value of the personal contact via F2F is probably still an essential business tool
Many (25?) years ago I was involved in looking at the cost-effectiveness of meetings / decision-making using video vs audio vs face-to-face vs email, and combinations of these.
Face-to-face was highest value / highest-cost.
Video was better than audio was better than email etc.
Optimum value for money was a combination of F2F & video. F2F even added value to subsequent video sessions.
The cost of technology will have reduced, but the high-value of the personal contact via F2F is probably still an essential business tool
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Both statements are true , Super Cecil.
I have had the good fortune of experiencing the best years of the aviation industry.
But everybody in the industry knows that over the last 20 years there has been a relentless chase to the bottom at every level.
Flight Attendants, baggage handlers, front of counter staff and low cost carrier Pilots have all had their terms and conditions smashed.
The travelling public has become addicted to cheap airfares and don’t think for a second how that has been possible.
Now big fat chickens are coming home to roost.
Many positions like Flight Attendants , baggage handlers were casualized. Now there are all screwed.
Low cost operators work on wafer thin margins and small if any cash reserves. Zero resilience. Now they are screwed.
And yet some posters still bitch and moan at the shocking cost of airfares on carriers that price their services properly.
The industry as a whole will come out of this back to where it was at the end of the GFS. Zero net profit since WW2.
This shake up was always going to happen. Now it has and many people will suffer.
Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else.
I have had the good fortune of experiencing the best years of the aviation industry.
But everybody in the industry knows that over the last 20 years there has been a relentless chase to the bottom at every level.
Flight Attendants, baggage handlers, front of counter staff and low cost carrier Pilots have all had their terms and conditions smashed.
The travelling public has become addicted to cheap airfares and don’t think for a second how that has been possible.
Now big fat chickens are coming home to roost.
Many positions like Flight Attendants , baggage handlers were casualized. Now there are all screwed.
Low cost operators work on wafer thin margins and small if any cash reserves. Zero resilience. Now they are screwed.
And yet some posters still bitch and moan at the shocking cost of airfares on carriers that price their services properly.
The industry as a whole will come out of this back to where it was at the end of the GFS. Zero net profit since WW2.
This shake up was always going to happen. Now it has and many people will suffer.
Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else.
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The more things change, the more they stay the same.
Yet again, its not just the new men dreaming of being an Airline Pilot, but also many actual Airline Pilots.
Which is a shame.
George -
"Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else."
Funnily enough George, thirty years ago I got the same advice, from an ex air force Cathay pilot.
Yet again, its not just the new men dreaming of being an Airline Pilot, but also many actual Airline Pilots.
Which is a shame.
George -
"Thirty years ago I would have recommended an aviation career in a heart beat.
Now , young people ,go and do something else."
Funnily enough George, thirty years ago I got the same advice, from an ex air force Cathay pilot.
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Boom and bust. Those that have been around a while might remember a time when most domestic airline pilots were unemployed, when things started moving again there were many pilots and only a few jobs. Those that went back to work first were on half the money they were before, the rest had to follow if they wanted a job. Some refused and flew the rest of their careers overseas.
With the governments current industrial relations mentality can anybody see airlines offering jobs back to pilots at the same pay?
With the governments current industrial relations mentality can anybody see airlines offering jobs back to pilots at the same pay?
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The first thing ScoMo will do is decimate IR laws that’s a given, he maybe the golden child atm, but he is still a IR Slasher at heart. I hate him with a vengeance. And that hate is real....
Cec, I'm thinking that when the boys went back in 89 they actually went back on more money, efficiency gains as well?
AoA, when a waiter can be paid more on a Saturday or Sunday than a health care worker, I'm thinking the IR laws should be torn up and a new start eh?
AoA, when a waiter can be paid more on a Saturday or Sunday than a health care worker, I'm thinking the IR laws should be torn up and a new start eh?