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Qantas selling Jetstar 787s

Old 13th Feb 2020, 14:44
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Qantas selling Jetstar 787s

Qantas has begun seeking buyers for three Boeing 787-8s currently used by Jetstar on “loss-making” routes, in a move that could prove very costly for pilots.

Although there had been speculation Qantas would retain the Dreamliners for its own use, the six-year-old jets are being touted by Qantas aircraft sales manager Martin Schembri to *potentially interested parties.


Last edited by 1a sound asleep; 13th Feb 2020 at 15:00.
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 19:10
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Because the story is that to reconfigure to a more humane cabin would cost too much. Getting another new aeroplane from Boeing at the original deeply discounted price is allegedly better value. In the meantime, the 330 fleet is slowly decomposing.

Obviously this could just be a ploy to put the wind up the JQ pilots. Who knows what price Schembri gives interested parties?
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 21:42
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Originally Posted by Australopithecus View Post
Because the story is that to reconfigure to a more humane cabin would cost too much. Getting another new aeroplane from Boeing at the original deeply discounted price is allegedly better value. In the meantime, the 330 fleet is slowly decomposing.

Obviously this could just be a ploy to put the wind up the JQ pilots. Who knows what price Schembri gives interested parties?
There plenty of rumours doing the rounds on sale of Jetstar 787s. It most definitely to throw some uncertainty during eba negoitions.


I also heard those aircraft approaching 30,000hrs flight time. The paint flaking off the wings and upper fuselage now a big problem. As 787 cannot fly with any bare carbon fibre exposed to sunlight and exposure to uv light. The amount of silver tape being applied has got to ridiculous levels and casa growing increasingly unhappy for it to pass over to next d checks. The fancy silver paint maybe coming home to roost.

Next one. Current Jetstar 787 lack of crew rest facilities not going to cut it in new era of FRMS on the longer routes over 9 hrs so being replaced with new aircraft 787-9í with proper rest facilities and more business class seats or 350,s

Anyone whoís thinks the orange cancer going to be sold off or bastardise too much is dreaming. They currently got some of the cheapest hardest working pilots around. They donít even have have to feed them they flying a 787 carrying 335pax and often 10,000 kg of freight for the mothership. AJ moves them around all over the place on routes because he can. I am sorry the cancer here to stay. Just in remission at the moment!

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Old 13th Feb 2020, 22:51
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How many cycles/hours is a 787 airframe good for? Do we know or is there an extended life test article somewhere? QF may be showing very good sense in getting rid of these airframes now before structural issues appear.

My limited understanding is that damage to carbon composites accumulates and once laminates start separating the degradation accelerates partly due to what is called “the free edge problem” in Engineering stress analysis terms, it’s akin to the phenomenon of wood splitting along grain lines.

Furthermore, my perhaps dated understanding is that you can never repair damaged carbon to 100% of initial strength, no matter how much you spend, but that may not be true these days if there have been new advances in adhesives and bonding.
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 23:38
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So, a transfer of pilots to the A320, and no outside recruitment to JQ for months to come?
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 23:50
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So, a transfer of pilots to the A320, and no outside recruitment to JQ for months to come?
If A321neos (approx 220 seats) replace 787s (335 seats) on Asia routes, starting with DPS, you'll see an increase in pilot numbers, in markets where seat volumes are maintained.
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 00:00
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Originally Posted by Sunfish View Post
How many cycles/hours is a 787 airframe good for? Do we know or is there an extended life test article somewhere? QF may be showing very good sense in getting rid of these airframes now before structural issues appear.

My limited understanding is that damage to carbon composites accumulates and once laminates start separating the degradation accelerates partly due to what is called ďthe free edge problemĒ in Engineering stress analysis terms, itís akin to the phenomenon of wood splitting along grain lines.

Furthermore, my perhaps dated understanding is that you can never repair damaged carbon to 100% of initial strength, no matter how much you spend, but that may not be true these days if there have been new advances in adhesives and bonding.
Google is your friend

https://www.aerospacetestinginternat...e-testing.html
The Boeing 787ís carbon composite structure can take over three times the stresses of its design lifetime, according to recently reported test results.A five-year fatigue test simulated more than 160,000 take-offs and landings, more than the design life of 44,000 cycles, says a report in Aviation Week and Space Technology.
Fatigue life testing is SOP for a new aircraft - something you should know...
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 00:15
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The whole thing sounds like a wind-up. It is all about pressuring pilots to sign up to the new EBA or they'll be made redundant or demoted. "The beatings will continue until morale improves".
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 00:20
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Originally Posted by Goat Whisperer View Post
If A321neos (approx 220 seats) replace 787s (335 seats) on Asia routes, starting with DPS, you'll see an increase in pilot numbers, in markets where seat volumes are maintained.
Good luck getting the slots.


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Old 14th Feb 2020, 01:26
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Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
Google is your friend

https://www.aerospacetestinginternat...e-testing.html

Fatigue life testing is SOP for a new aircraft - something you should know...
132,000 cycles? Thatís barely 180 years in airline service. Pfft.
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 01:33
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There is no DPS slots. Forget it. Unless they take some from their loss making Singaporean offshoot.

The only one with Bali slots up their sleeve is Virgin. And I understand they are fully utilizing them from next month with a new route from Melbourne and extra frequencies east coast.

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Old 14th Feb 2020, 01:50
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Originally Posted by wheels_down View Post
There is no DPS slots. Forget it. Unless they take some from their loss making Singaporean offshoot.

The only one with Bali slots up their sleeve is Virgin. And I understand they are fully utilizing them from next month with a new route from Melbourne and extra frequencies east coast.
they got extra slots for the JQ97/98 flight from Melbourne (now sometimes 3 times per day in peak seasons)

the hiring of local cabin crew is also rumoured to be a political move to get more slots.
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 02:23
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TDracer:
Fatigue life testing is SOP for a new aircraft - something you should know..
I know that. What I didn’t know was they were completed in 2015, four years after introduction into service, which is normal.

I also don’t know what issues were found. There are usually a few. Reliability is not a “one off” fatigue test, there needs to be ongoing surveillance.
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Old 14th Feb 2020, 06:52
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Originally Posted by Australopithecus View Post
132,000 cycles? Thatís barely 180 years in airline service. Pfft.
And itís far from certain that airframes will be exhibiting signs of structural damage by then anyway. Thereís a good chance that CF airframes will turn out to be ďfor everĒ purchases.

So for some design types the sales Airbus and Boeing are delivering now might be the last ones they ever build. Itíll take some significant reason such as major efficiency improvements, size (which seems to be the factor behind these sales), or something else fundamentally desirable to prompt airlines to buy new aircraft. Otherwise refurb of fully depreciated airframes is likely to be value for money.
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Old 19th Feb 2020, 23:05
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Itís funny that with todayís half year profit announcement there wasnít a single mention of even possibly selling any Jetstar 787s, even though the possibility of moving some A320s to the Network was deemed worthy of note.
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Old 20th Feb 2020, 03:42
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Originally Posted by Banana_man View Post
Itís funny that with todayís half year profit announcement there wasnít a single mention of even possibly selling any Jetstar 787s, even though the possibility of moving some A320s to the Network was deemed worthy of note.
They had forgotten that threat in their eagerness to issue their latest propaganda.
Bet the bonuses arent under threat.
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Old 20th Feb 2020, 05:20
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Not a great time to be selling used aircraft probably. Might be a few cheap jets coming out of China soon.
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Old 21st Feb 2020, 04:39
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron View Post
Not a great time to be selling used aircraft probably. Might be a few cheap jets coming out of China soon.
this message was reiterated in yesterdayís half year results Q&A when a question was asked about the JQ 787s.

if they canít get the price they want the aircraft will remain in the Jetstar fleet.
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Old 21st Feb 2020, 05:59
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It's nothing more than an industrial relations ploy.
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Old 21st Feb 2020, 06:16
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It also mentions they are removing 2 A320s in the results. I assume to mining.

So say back half of this year
2xA320s
3x787s
2 A321s being swapped out with 2 new machines.

Pulling more % capacity out than Tiger recently announced.

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