VA pilots worried about employment 2021
I’ve got just as many friends in Virgin/Tiger as I do in Qantas/Jetstar.
We will ALL be back scoffing at feeder fix estimates and requested levels before you know it.
Love you all guys. Even if you lie through your teeth and speak like blithering idiots on the radio
We will ALL be back scoffing at feeder fix estimates and requested levels before you know it.
Love you all guys. Even if you lie through your teeth and speak like blithering idiots on the radio
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The whole situation seems incredibly surreal. But for the fact that QF is now caught up in it, its AN all over again.
i particularly feel for the former Ansett staff now at VA, nobody deserves to go through this twice.
the government will look after votes, it will avoid setting a precedent.
i particularly feel for the former Ansett staff now at VA, nobody deserves to go through this twice.
the government will look after votes, it will avoid setting a precedent.
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Now in the sandpit, but one who was fairly young in 2001 and went through the AN "experience", I only hope that VA can somehow succeed and that Scurrah can find a way out of this to keep this company afloat. 
I think that's it for VA. With the states closing their borders and existing position of the company, it is possibly the final straw. My family and I are in a real difficult position, financially. What a crazy world.
Best wishes to all of us.
I’m sure the Government will not Privatise VA but will assist both Airlines financially.
What really sticks in my gall is the utter hypocrisy of AJ when he bleats about “having to compete against the Government “ if they did privatise VA.
Ansett had to compete with the Government owned Airlines until 1990 and sure they didn’t like it very much but got on fairly well until it’s demise.
Seems like AJ has forgotten this or reckons he could not cope with it.
He sure wants his cake and be able to eat it as well.
Time to sit back and hope this all passes quickly enough to be able to restart both Airlines and also Businesses throughout Australia without too much pain.
Reckon there’s going to be a big rethink on trading with China given their failure to implement lock downs in Wuhan as was advised much earlier by a Doctor than they did.
Hard times ahead but we can and will get through this and it will turn out to be better for all “on the other side “.
Best wishes to all in the Airlines and elsewhere as well.
You will survive.
What really sticks in my gall is the utter hypocrisy of AJ when he bleats about “having to compete against the Government “ if they did privatise VA.
Ansett had to compete with the Government owned Airlines until 1990 and sure they didn’t like it very much but got on fairly well until it’s demise.
Seems like AJ has forgotten this or reckons he could not cope with it.
He sure wants his cake and be able to eat it as well.
Time to sit back and hope this all passes quickly enough to be able to restart both Airlines and also Businesses throughout Australia without too much pain.
Reckon there’s going to be a big rethink on trading with China given their failure to implement lock downs in Wuhan as was advised much earlier by a Doctor than they did.
Hard times ahead but we can and will get through this and it will turn out to be better for all “on the other side “.
Best wishes to all in the Airlines and elsewhere as well.
You will survive.
Something else people forget, the AN/TN cabal INSISTED on QF and other international airlines offering pro-rata fares ... i.e. equivalent KM charge... but they abjectly REFUSED to do so for Qantas and other international airlines in return... Nope, you want interline to their network you pay the full, inflated, featherbedded and immovable fare.
AN and TN were not in competition, they were two mollycoddled, protected duopoly members. They wouldn't have known what competition was if it'd hit them in the face and both of them proved it when Compass started, by graciously offering the required to two gates... one on one pier and the other on the end of the second pier, about a kilometre apart. Qantas did the pushbacks because the domestics refused to.
So, we'll have no lectures about competition between AN and TN thanks.
As for the point AJ was making, rightly or wrongly, was that both airlines should be treated equally and the government should not nationalise a carrier which has mismanaged its balance sheet for more than 10 years. I sincerely hope VA survives and QF but it would seem a bit unfair if the government shelled out billions to save VA and QF got nothing and for maintaining a strong balance sheet it emerged weakened.
Knowing Australian culture and society the way I do, I think Alan Joyce’s actions over the last few days could seriously backfire on him.
We don’t kick people when they are down here Alan. What we do is hold our hand out.
99.9% of QF staff would be deeply embarrassed by this latest effort.
Spirit of Australia he’s got it back to front.
We don’t kick people when they are down here Alan. What we do is hold our hand out.
99.9% of QF staff would be deeply embarrassed by this latest effort.
Spirit of Australia he’s got it back to front.
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AerialPerspective, brilliant post. That is absolutely accurate, succinct and correct.
Bettergetreal; sadly you are wrong. Australians pride themselves on helping mates and being there for each other, but when you see fist fights over turd paper in a shopping isle and a child dying in hospital becasuse he couldn’t get basic medication because a bunch of selfish panicking ***** have stripped the chemist store bare buying excess supplies that will last them through a nuclear winter, you realise the Australian ‘mateship’ is long gone.
Make no mistake, like it or not, COVID-19 should be the least of people’s concerns. The economic fabric of the entire globe is disintegrating. This is an event that cannot be compared to 1919, 1987, 2008 and so on. There will be ‘no return to normality’ once this is finished. When things return the world will be a different landscape - economically, politically, society as a collective.
Bettergetreal; sadly you are wrong. Australians pride themselves on helping mates and being there for each other, but when you see fist fights over turd paper in a shopping isle and a child dying in hospital becasuse he couldn’t get basic medication because a bunch of selfish panicking ***** have stripped the chemist store bare buying excess supplies that will last them through a nuclear winter, you realise the Australian ‘mateship’ is long gone.
Make no mistake, like it or not, COVID-19 should be the least of people’s concerns. The economic fabric of the entire globe is disintegrating. This is an event that cannot be compared to 1919, 1987, 2008 and so on. There will be ‘no return to normality’ once this is finished. When things return the world will be a different landscape - economically, politically, society as a collective.
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AerialPerspective, brilliant post. That is absolutely accurate, succinct and correct.
Bettergetreal; sadly you are wrong. Australians pride themselves on helping mates and being there for each other, but when you see fist fights over turd paper in a shopping isle and a child dying in hospital becasuse he couldn’t get basic medication because a bunch of selfish panicking ***** have stripped the chemist store bare buying excess supplies that will last them through a nuclear winter, you realise the Australian ‘mateship’ is long gone.
Make no mistake, like it or not, COVID-19 should be the least of people’s concerns. The economic fabric of the entire globe is disintegrating. This is an event that cannot be compared to 1919, 1987, 2008 and so on. There will be ‘no return to normality’ once this is finished. When things return the world will be a different landscape - economically, politically, society as a collective.
Bettergetreal; sadly you are wrong. Australians pride themselves on helping mates and being there for each other, but when you see fist fights over turd paper in a shopping isle and a child dying in hospital becasuse he couldn’t get basic medication because a bunch of selfish panicking ***** have stripped the chemist store bare buying excess supplies that will last them through a nuclear winter, you realise the Australian ‘mateship’ is long gone.
Make no mistake, like it or not, COVID-19 should be the least of people’s concerns. The economic fabric of the entire globe is disintegrating. This is an event that cannot be compared to 1919, 1987, 2008 and so on. There will be ‘no return to normality’ once this is finished. When things return the world will be a different landscape - economically, politically, society as a collective.
The world's environment is fragile but the world's economy is more so! What's the point of having a healthy planet of its species are dying from an economic disaster!
Stay safe everyone.
Berealgetreal, what is the problem with what AJ said? He’s not kicking anyone when they are down. We are down too. He’s just saying the federal government can’t save VA and then not do the same for QF. I for one agree with him. To be honest this may be the best thing that could have happened to VA. They will now probably get some kind of bailout. QF will get the same, but if this hadn’t of happened VA would have gone broke, I’m sure of it. We are all in the ****. Stop throwing stones.
Come on guys, you can’t all change your names to Chicken Little.
Get a grip, It’s not the World’s first rodeo at Pandemics, World Wars, terrorism
This will be fun to come back to in 6 months
Now if the internet goes down OMFG!!!!!!!
Get a grip, It’s not the World’s first rodeo at Pandemics, World Wars, terrorism
This will be fun to come back to in 6 months
Now if the internet goes down OMFG!!!!!!!
Last edited by ozbiggles; 23rd Mar 2020 at 00:35.
Alan Joyce’s bloodthirst for Virgin collapse
Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce has never been one to waste a crisis. And since the novel coronavirus completely shuttered the travel industry, you’d expect an airline boss to feel a little jumpy.
Nevertheless, Joyce’s performance on Friday morning television – in which he warned the Morrison government against bailing out ‘‘the badly managed companies which have been badly managed for 10 years’’, i.e. Virgin Australia – was exceptionally inelegant.
He was overreacting to a comment piece in that day’s The Australian which imagined that ‘‘some companies may end up having to be nationalised, if even only temporarily’’ and that ‘‘Virgin could be one example’’ because ‘‘there is no way [the government] will allow Australia to return to a virtual single-carrier environment in a post-virus world’’.
Joyce’s initial comments on Sky – that Canberra ‘‘can’t pick winners and losers;
whatever aid is given to one particular company... has to be given to everybody in that sector’’ – would’ve sufficed perfectly. But Joyce’s shortcoming has always been in craving a needless fight.
On a conference call with prorogued Qantas employees later the same day, their CEO reportedly urged them (with their abrupt surfeit of spare time) to petition their federal MPs against this supposed bailout of Virgin.
It’s a low-quality way for the national carrier to conduct itself in the tumult of the worst health and economic crisis Australia
has ever seen. Such is Joyce’s bloodthirst for his competitor’s death rattle.
For lucrative reasons. After the collapse of Ansett in 2001, Qantas CEO Geoff Dixon creamed off $4.4 billion in net profits (after tax) in seven years as a virtual monopoly (even despite the highest oil prices in history), until Joyce replaced him in 2008.
By Joyce’s seventh year, he’d delivered $2.6 billion of accumulated losses and was begging Tony Abbott to pick winners and losers by extending him a $3 billion loan guarantee. And after 11 years, Joyce has accumulated net profits of only $1.75 billion – a factoid easy to forget when you see his remuneration ($92 million and counting), but crucial to remember when he critiques
other companies ‘‘which have been badly managed for 10 years’’.
Six years since he asked the federal government to save him, Joyce now reckons that ‘‘when good companies have managed their position very well, the government should let them manage their way through this’’.
His sudden aversion to any Commonwealth assistance is astonishing but welcome. Qantas could scarcely accept public cash only five months since his chairman Richard Goyder boasted that ‘‘at the end of this latest buyback, we’ll have bought back almost one-third of our shares since 2015 – the most of any company in the ASX All Ordinaries’’.
Yep, that’s $3.2 billion of excess cash
(on top of dividends) it returned to shareholders, or almost how much passenger revenue Qantas will suddenly forgo this March, April and
May. Handing it over (while reducing its own share count) massively juiced the airline’s share price and total shareholder returns, upon which Joyce’s bonuses are explicitly calculated. Thus management is incentivised not to save cash for a rainy day – nor, indeed, to reinvest profits productively, as Treasurer Josh Frydenberg pleaded in August.
It’s marvellous news that Qantas still has ‘‘plenty of bandwidth to last a very, very long time’’ through the corona crisis. And we’d be the last to pretend that Virgin’s relative financial infirmity is anything but its own doing. Joyce can be forgiven his lapse of judgment in these times of cognitive overload, but let’s not shoehorn post-crisis competition policy into his tactical manoeuvrings for advantage.
Where is Goyder , where’s the board, the arrogance of him he should be sacked. Qantas has been price gouging for years without Virgin they would be out of control. I work for Qantas I am embarrassed and ashamed.
Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce has never been one to waste a crisis. And since the novel coronavirus completely shuttered the travel industry, you’d expect an airline boss to feel a little jumpy.
Nevertheless, Joyce’s performance on Friday morning television – in which he warned the Morrison government against bailing out ‘‘the badly managed companies which have been badly managed for 10 years’’, i.e. Virgin Australia – was exceptionally inelegant.
He was overreacting to a comment piece in that day’s The Australian which imagined that ‘‘some companies may end up having to be nationalised, if even only temporarily’’ and that ‘‘Virgin could be one example’’ because ‘‘there is no way [the government] will allow Australia to return to a virtual single-carrier environment in a post-virus world’’.
Joyce’s initial comments on Sky – that Canberra ‘‘can’t pick winners and losers;
whatever aid is given to one particular company... has to be given to everybody in that sector’’ – would’ve sufficed perfectly. But Joyce’s shortcoming has always been in craving a needless fight.
On a conference call with prorogued Qantas employees later the same day, their CEO reportedly urged them (with their abrupt surfeit of spare time) to petition their federal MPs against this supposed bailout of Virgin.
It’s a low-quality way for the national carrier to conduct itself in the tumult of the worst health and economic crisis Australia
has ever seen. Such is Joyce’s bloodthirst for his competitor’s death rattle.
For lucrative reasons. After the collapse of Ansett in 2001, Qantas CEO Geoff Dixon creamed off $4.4 billion in net profits (after tax) in seven years as a virtual monopoly (even despite the highest oil prices in history), until Joyce replaced him in 2008.
By Joyce’s seventh year, he’d delivered $2.6 billion of accumulated losses and was begging Tony Abbott to pick winners and losers by extending him a $3 billion loan guarantee. And after 11 years, Joyce has accumulated net profits of only $1.75 billion – a factoid easy to forget when you see his remuneration ($92 million and counting), but crucial to remember when he critiques
other companies ‘‘which have been badly managed for 10 years’’.
Six years since he asked the federal government to save him, Joyce now reckons that ‘‘when good companies have managed their position very well, the government should let them manage their way through this’’.
His sudden aversion to any Commonwealth assistance is astonishing but welcome. Qantas could scarcely accept public cash only five months since his chairman Richard Goyder boasted that ‘‘at the end of this latest buyback, we’ll have bought back almost one-third of our shares since 2015 – the most of any company in the ASX All Ordinaries’’.
Yep, that’s $3.2 billion of excess cash
(on top of dividends) it returned to shareholders, or almost how much passenger revenue Qantas will suddenly forgo this March, April and
May. Handing it over (while reducing its own share count) massively juiced the airline’s share price and total shareholder returns, upon which Joyce’s bonuses are explicitly calculated. Thus management is incentivised not to save cash for a rainy day – nor, indeed, to reinvest profits productively, as Treasurer Josh Frydenberg pleaded in August.
It’s marvellous news that Qantas still has ‘‘plenty of bandwidth to last a very, very long time’’ through the corona crisis. And we’d be the last to pretend that Virgin’s relative financial infirmity is anything but its own doing. Joyce can be forgiven his lapse of judgment in these times of cognitive overload, but let’s not shoehorn post-crisis competition policy into his tactical manoeuvrings for advantage.
Where is Goyder , where’s the board, the arrogance of him he should be sacked. Qantas has been price gouging for years without Virgin they would be out of control. I work for Qantas I am embarrassed and ashamed.
More cuts coming
The airline said this morning it “expects a material reduction in its domestic capacity” in light of federal and state government measures to crack down on the spread of coronavirus
Berealgetreal, what is the problem with what AJ said? He’s not kicking anyone when they are down. We are down too. He’s just saying the federal government can’t save VA and then not do the same for QF. I for one agree with him. To be honest this may be the best thing that could have happened to VA. They will now probably get some kind of bailout. QF will get the same, but if this hadn’t of happened VA would have gone broke, I’m sure of it. We are all in the ****. Stop throwing stones.
The mis management has been guided by the board and chairwoman. Anyone whom disagreed divested their share holdings (Air NZ) or was promptly shown the door (JT). The current chairwoman is silent.
Do tell how It can survive any length of time. When 5.7billion came in revenue they still managed to “burn” effectively 1 million a week.
The Naysayers continued to tell us, nah it’s all good we have 1 billion in cash.
You’ll burn that 960million $ AUD pretty quick on leases and other commitments/debt I assume are written in USD.
The rot continues today Non EBA staff only being asked to take one month LWOP at “their”leisure over the next 6months, whilst frontline staff are stood down.
That’s great I’m glad the social team has been “stood up”
FFS cupcakes all round Yeahhhhhh it’s international women’s day, yup that’s what’s important when we are drowning throw us another bull**** distraction to get behind.
The icing on the cake is QQ still flying wet leases with with VA crew and airframes grounded.
Who cares about Joyce, save your own company.
i have to agree with what your saying, even as an employee I don’t agree with taxpayers propping up VA. Why should they VA is totally stuffed financially - this is not the employees doing, how is it not trading insolvent right now?
The mis management has been guided by the board and chairwoman. Anyone whom disagreed divested their share holdings (Air NZ) or was promptly shown the door (JT). The current chairwoman is silent.
Do tell how It can survive any length of time. When 5.7billion came in revenue they still managed to “burn” effectively 1 million a week.
The Naysayers continued to tell us, nah it’s all good we have 1 billion in cash.
You’ll burn that 960million $ AUD pretty quick on leases and other commitments/debt I assume are written in USD.
The rot continues today Non EBA staff only being asked to take one month LWOP at “their”leisure over the next 6months, whilst frontline staff are stood down.
That’s great I’m glad the social team has been “stood up”
FFS cupcakes all round Yeahhhhhh it’s international women’s day, yup that’s what’s important when we are drowning throw us another bull**** distraction to get behind.
The icing on the cake is QQ still flying wet leases with with VA crew and airframes grounded.
Who cares about Joyce, save your own company.
The mis management has been guided by the board and chairwoman. Anyone whom disagreed divested their share holdings (Air NZ) or was promptly shown the door (JT). The current chairwoman is silent.
Do tell how It can survive any length of time. When 5.7billion came in revenue they still managed to “burn” effectively 1 million a week.
The Naysayers continued to tell us, nah it’s all good we have 1 billion in cash.
You’ll burn that 960million $ AUD pretty quick on leases and other commitments/debt I assume are written in USD.
The rot continues today Non EBA staff only being asked to take one month LWOP at “their”leisure over the next 6months, whilst frontline staff are stood down.
That’s great I’m glad the social team has been “stood up”
FFS cupcakes all round Yeahhhhhh it’s international women’s day, yup that’s what’s important when we are drowning throw us another bull**** distraction to get behind.
The icing on the cake is QQ still flying wet leases with with VA crew and airframes grounded.
Who cares about Joyce, save your own company.
Couldn’t agree more!!!