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Qantas’ search for female pilots has led to more workplace harassment - Quartz

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Qantas’ search for female pilots has led to more workplace harassment - Quartz

Old 20th Nov 2019, 02:19
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The USA has at least five organisations promoting women in aviation and they have been around for decades. With all of the effort they put in to get more women in the pointy end, no US airline has more than 7% female pilots.

There are no barriers to entry for women wanting to fly in the USA and the airlines here have recruited women for 40 years.

With all of this effort the amount of female pilots cant break 10% at a US major.

Maybe, just maybe ladies dont really want to do it as much as men?
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Old 20th Nov 2019, 09:41
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Was Little Napoleon leading International Men's Day?

International Men's Day 19 November 2019.

Where was Little Napoleon, singing the praises of his workforce, a substantial number being men?

Nothing not a peep..


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Old 20th Nov 2019, 17:56
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I think by his actions he’s proven to love men in general..I have no issues there
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Old 20th Nov 2019, 19:13
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Originally Posted by Rated De
International Men's Day 19 November 2019.

Where was Little Napoleon, singing the praises of his workforce, a substantial number being men?

Nothing not a peep..
Oh boo hoo
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Old 20th Nov 2019, 21:24
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Originally Posted by Rated De
The best way to fix alleged discrimination.....is err with more discrimination.
more positive discrimination, positive......!
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Old 20th Nov 2019, 22:24
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Originally Posted by Climb150
The USA has at least five organisations promoting women in aviation and they have been around for decades.
Those organisations don’t control airline recruitment. I believe US major airline recruitment for a long time had been a bit of a closed shop. A lot of it dominated by ex military pilots who would recruit their buddies first and foremost.

With recent shortages this may be changing, it may be better to look at ratios in relation to younger and more recent demographics for a more accurate picture.
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Old 20th Nov 2019, 22:44
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So when United ask what your "Women in Aviation" membership number is they are just messing around? You obviously know very little about these types of organisations so maybe do a bit more research before posting again.
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 20:06
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This thread and many others appear to have made todays front page, Herald Sun.
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 20:39
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Unfortunate as most of what is said is correct and that will bring the house down on me I’m sure.
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 20:52
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Originally Posted by PoppaJo
This thread and many others appear to have made todays front page, Herald Sun.

Behind a paywall, can you post the text?
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 20:56
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Qantas pilots target female colleagues, new CEO Vanessa Hudson in vile leaked discussions

Leaked comments from an online chat forum have sparked criticism of Qantas’ “ingrained” sexist culture.
Suzan Delibasic and Mark Buttler2 min read
August 1, 2023 - 8:42PM Leaked discussions between Qantas pilots reveal disparaging comments at the expense of female colleagues. Picture: NCA NewsWireQantas pilots have used a “blokey” online chat forum to criticise their new boss, make crude jokes about women and moan about female pilots “spawning offspring”.
The Herald Sun can reveal a Qantas chatroom with dozens of employees is saturated with disparaging humour at the *expense of women.
It is believed the forum is moderated by a Qantas captain.
In posts dating back to 2018, the resentment of those involved at management is clear in a high number of comments obtained by the Herald Sun. Qantas CEO designate Vanessa Hudson was criticised in the online comments as well as other female colleagues. Picture: NCA NewswireA Qantas insider said it showed the airline’s “sexist” culture was “ingrained” and institutionalised, thriving unchecked.
One contributor posts about women having an “advantage” over men in every area.
“They can go off, run their breeding program or get a cushy job in the office at twice the pay of the other full time *office staff,” the post said.
It’s understood the post has been removed and the incident reported to the airline’s human resources department.
In another offensive post, a member of the group expresses similar sentiments.
That man wrote of “a rapid influx of female pilots of a certain age group spawning offspring and then wanting flexible work arrangements”. Qantas pilots have used a ‘blokey’ online chat forum to make misogynistic comments about women.Qantas targets for gender representation also come under attack, with one commenter arguing more qualified male pilots will be rejected in favour of women with lower skill levels.
He urges training and assessment standards be uniformly applied.Some of the comments complained of women having ‘much more advantage’.A recent post referring to the announcement of pilot scholarships for 50 female students criticises the company’s new chief executive Vanessa Hudson.
“Interesting the day we get a female CEO announced is the day we get advised of this overt discrimination,” he wrote.
The Herald Sun understands two of the pilots in the group are no longer with Qantas and a third is not flying while under investigation.
Qantas chief pilot Dick Tobiano said the comments were unacceptable and did not reflect the airline’s values.
“We have many talented female pilots at Qantas and we want to encourage a lot more of them. Aviation hasn’t been good at that historically and clearly some outdated thinking still exists in some pockets,” Mr Tobiano said.
Seven per cent of Qantas pilots are women and 15 per cent are female at QantasLink, compared with a figure of about five per cent worldwide. The carrier’s academy has about 20 per cent women on board.
It comes after a Qantas pilot who fought for gender equality announced last year she was suing the airline for discrimination and sexual harassment.
Davida Forshaw lodged proceedings in the Victorian Federal Court, claiming she had been sexually harassed by male colleagues. She alleged her *career was hindered by male superiors who made inappropriate remarks and advances.
In February, Qantas applied to the Federal Court to throw out her case.
Ms Forshaw alleged she was told to dye her hair and wear a push-up bra if she wanted to succeed.
In documents filed in court, Qantas described her allegations as “an abuse of the court process
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 21:01
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Sky News just had a debate on this one. Commentator said something along the lines of questioning people’s competence which is unfair. Remove the quota hiring campaign and you wouldn’t have that unfair problem. As a female Captain said to me only recently ‘the company has caused this mess’.

Last edited by PoppaJo; 1st Aug 2023 at 21:16.
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 21:59
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Originally Posted by PoppaJo
Sky News just had a debate on this one. Commentator said something along the lines of questioning people’s competence which is unfair. Remove the quota hiring campaign and you wouldn’t have that unfair problem. As a female Captain said to me only recently ‘the company has caused this mess’.
They have indeed caused it. Of the women I’ve flown with, most are there by pure hard work and almost all of them despise the way in which airlines have used their “plight” as females in a male dominated world for a points scoring exercise. Quotas denigrate those who succeed because it makes their hard work and dedication to the job virtually invisible.

It reminds me of a trip some months back where a man of indigenous extraction (if I am allowed to say that) I happened to be sitting next to while paxing, turned to me during the welcome to country PA and said “do they really think we give a sh!t!?”. Sorry if that opens up another controversial can of worms here but could these managers have gotten it any more wrong with their woke facade?

Respect isn’t about sucking up to someone, it’s about removing barriers to their success and acknowledging them for what they are capable of, and then getting out of their way.

This article has obviously cherry picked the most offensive comments to sell a few papers.
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Old 1st Aug 2023, 22:07
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Return of service obligation.




A picture paints a thousand words.
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 02:31
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Originally Posted by Troo believer
Return of service obligation.




A picture paints a thousand words.
Just wow.
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 03:42
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Originally Posted by PoppaJo

Remove the quota hiring campaign and you wouldn’t have that unfair problem.
For mainline the amount of female recruits is similar to the amount of female applicants. You only need to look at the photos of the new hires each month to see women make up only a fraction of new hires.
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 04:00
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Originally Posted by dr dre
For mainline the amount of female recruits is similar to the amount of female applicants. You only need to look at the photos of the new hires each month to see women make up only a fraction of new hires.

hopefully this is because they are hiring the best people for the job. Not a quota.
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 04:10
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Originally Posted by ROH111
hopefully this is because they are hiring the best people for the job. Not a quota.
There’s been monthly courses started this year with zero women, and courses with women in a slightly higher proportion than exist in the industry. But overall it averages to about 10% which is roughly the same percentage of female pilots in the industry at the moment.
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 04:33
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Originally Posted by dr dre
For mainline the amount of female recruits is similar to the amount of female applicants.
That statement implies that female recruits -> guaranteed employment, versus male recruits -> compete on merit...
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Old 2nd Aug 2023, 04:47
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
That statement implies that female recruits -> guaranteed employment, versus male recruits -> compete on merit...
I’ll clarify what I meant:

Roughly 10% of pilots in the Australian aviation industry are female.

Roughly 10% of new hires to mainline in the last year have been female.

I’m told there were around 2000 applicants for 400 positions over the first two years of post Covid recruitment. So on rough figures 200 of the applicants would have been female, and 40 of the new hires would have been female.

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