Jetstar EBA 2019
A_pilot, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Funnily enough when I was discussing BOC flying with one of our older resource managers (MB) his exact words to me around FRMS and possible new work rules was ‘be careful what you wish for, all our info says that we will be able to fly you more with less rest!’. I await September :-), I rarely get good rest in hotels with cleaners etc and just won’t go to work if I am not rested.
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Does anyone know If this jepp system accounts for fatigue, crew life style and wellbeing? What I’ve seen of the mirroring rosters that’s getting around it purely a financial optimizer for the company. Pairings I have seen are horrible,
Pax 6am to a hotel to operate BOC that night then pax home after arrival to drive home in peak he traffic. Another out of ADL is a 4 day trip all BOC flying, early start late finish for min rest in days off etc.
Pax 6am to a hotel to operate BOC that night then pax home after arrival to drive home in peak he traffic. Another out of ADL is a 4 day trip all BOC flying, early start late finish for min rest in days off etc.
Perhaps more is less
Tigerair ran at an $8 million loss in the first half of this year on an earnings before interest and tax basis, and a $36 million loss in 2018, adding to the Virgin Group's $653 million loss that year.
Perhaps the Tiger EBA may not be the panacea their pilots were looking for?
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From the SMH:
Tigerair ran at an $8 million loss in the first half of this year on an earnings before interest and tax basis, and a $36 million loss in 2018, adding to the Virgin Group's $653 million loss that year.
Perhaps the Tiger EBA may not be the panacea their pilots were looking for?
Tigerair ran at an $8 million loss in the first half of this year on an earnings before interest and tax basis, and a $36 million loss in 2018, adding to the Virgin Group's $653 million loss that year.
Perhaps the Tiger EBA may not be the panacea their pilots were looking for?
I think the point is, we can't really say that the Tiger deal is the new A320 benchmark in Australia as if the company goes bust in 12 months time and is wound up then what ever the EBA was is irrelevant. I can assure you that is what Jetstar will say in reaction to us saying 'we should get paid more than Tiger'. They will just say, they know how much cost they can associate with the new EBA and they won't go above that regardless of what the Tiger deal is, in their minds it will be 3%.
Issue for Tiger is the leisure market has gone backwards in the last half. First major declines since 2012. We won’t know how bad it is until full year results. QF were fairly vocal in seeing the same trend but can offset it via other revenue streams. Virgin can’t. Jetstar Domestic is nothing short of bullet proof it seems.
If this leisure revenue had simply moved downwards from VA and QF to JQ/TT then Tiger should only be getting bigger. If Tiger has gone backwards then I’d expect consolidation and Virgin to bring in the Economy Basic bucket like JetBlue.
If this leisure revenue had simply moved downwards from VA and QF to JQ/TT then Tiger should only be getting bigger. If Tiger has gone backwards then I’d expect consolidation and Virgin to bring in the Economy Basic bucket like JetBlue.
Wait, Watch and Absorb
Issue for Tiger is the leisure market has gone backwards in the last half. First major declines since 2012. We won’t know how bad it is until full year results. QF were fairly vocal in seeing the same trend but can offset it via other revenue streams. Virgin can’t. Jetstar Domestic is nothing short of bullet proof it seems.
If this leisure revenue had simply moved downwards from VA and QF to JQ/TT then Tiger should only be getting bigger. If Tiger has gone backwards then I’d expect consolidation and Virgin to bring in the Economy Basic bucket like JetBlue.
If this leisure revenue had simply moved downwards from VA and QF to JQ/TT then Tiger should only be getting bigger. If Tiger has gone backwards then I’d expect consolidation and Virgin to bring in the Economy Basic bucket like JetBlue.
The smart money is that Tiger will close, and be absorbed into Virgin, which at last glance, was north of $1.6B loss over the last 6 years. One opines that Virgin will be between nowhere and nowhere as it cannot compete with Qantas group's premium (sic) service, and cannot compete with Qantas group's low cost carrier services.
My tray table is stowed; my reclining seat/bed is now in the takeoff and landing position; and, am awaiting the onset of severe turbulence which is forecast.
Perhaps it is just a rumour, and will amount to nought. Perhaps.
And this wouldn't be the first time that a company has agreed a new employment agreement to keep the workers going until the end which was already planned for. Hopefully it is just rumour but it seems to be the sensible solution given the financial position of Virgin.
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One has to wonder where a company is struggling financially got the excess money to pay such a big pay rise for the Tiger crew, also the ATR agreement was passed with a substantial pay rise I’ve heard. Where is VA getting all this money from?!
If Tiger goes its nothing to do with pilot wages. Virgin have been talking about merging narrow body pilot EBA’s so all pilots can fly all routes with everyone.
Your management has certainly got you QF group guys brainwashed into thinking that it’s the pilot conditions or lack thereof that determine the success or failure of the company.
If Tiger does get wound up get ready for a new entrant such as Air Asia into the LCC space and then you
really will have Buckley’s and none in getting a payrise.
The new CEO (a nice change) has a magnifying glass over the financial situation. Certainly I’d expect to see some big changes coming.
All the best to JQ/QF guys, you work hard and make bucket loads of money for the company year after year I think you deserve better.
Your management has certainly got you QF group guys brainwashed into thinking that it’s the pilot conditions or lack thereof that determine the success or failure of the company.
If Tiger does get wound up get ready for a new entrant such as Air Asia into the LCC space and then you
really will have Buckley’s and none in getting a payrise.
The new CEO (a nice change) has a magnifying glass over the financial situation. Certainly I’d expect to see some big changes coming.
All the best to JQ/QF guys, you work hard and make bucket loads of money for the company year after year I think you deserve better.
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So let me get this right. The logic is just go for it, bring on a fight because Tiger will be wound up and you should get all you can before there is a new entrant?
Interesting that notions like job security and promotion are ignored to the point where the only consideration is $$. Years ago I remember a certain blue tailed carrier disappearing. One of the many nooses strangling the golden goose was inflated employee agreements, including pilots.
With a Group CEO who grounded the fleet in 2011, a soft economy, low inflation and wage rises running at less than 2% I think its a great idea that Jetstar pilots pick a fight.
Wheres Brian, does anyone know where we can find him?
Interesting that notions like job security and promotion are ignored to the point where the only consideration is $$. Years ago I remember a certain blue tailed carrier disappearing. One of the many nooses strangling the golden goose was inflated employee agreements, including pilots.
With a Group CEO who grounded the fleet in 2011, a soft economy, low inflation and wage rises running at less than 2% I think its a great idea that Jetstar pilots pick a fight.
Wheres Brian, does anyone know where we can find him?
Yawn
So if Tiger is wound up the pilots will be given an even bigger payrise as they join the Virgin Australia payroll. But those naughty Jetstar pilots should accept whatever they are given and be happy.. I’d say the chances are slim to none. But hey, everyone has their opinion.
Evertonian
The Tiger brand is damaged goods. Their EBA was agreed in order to just keep it flying until VA are ready to act, as Ollie has said. VA will regroup & restart in the LCC market & I reckon that the new entities EBA will be aligned exactly how they want it... just my 2c.
If Virgin can bite the bullet and forget the sunk costs of the last decade and get back to their roots they might have a clear path ahead. If they keep on competing in a space that is virtually non existent then they’ll keep on losing money. My two cents.
People seem transfixed on the “pay rise” aspect only and how it’s risky in a softening economy. Anything being asked for in this latest round of EBAs is merely a correction (not a pay rise) to the stagnated wage growth forced upon pilots during the last decade or so. Airlines have skimmed the cream off that wage stagnation for a very long time. Talk of company failures and the end of days in aviation is old playbook smoke and mirrors, and pretty boring.
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Wow. For a thread titled Jetstar EBA, there sure is a lot of interest in Virgin. When was the last time any worker group got their payrise by pointing at the competitor and saying "We deserve that, 'cause that's what they have???" Anybody? Bueller?
