Pay rise certain
Delta Airlines may have been its employees’ best Valentine: on February 14, Delta announced that it will distribute more than 1.1 billion in profit-sharing bonuses from 2017 earnings.
“This is the fourth year in a row that Delta’s profit sharing has topped $1 billion — a milestone no company in history has ever achieved,” said CEO Ed Bastian. “Delta people are the reason for our success, and Valentine’s Day is our favorite day each year as we celebrate the incredible results our people have delivered.”
In 2017, Delta Airlines raked in 5.5 billion in pretax earnings. American Airlines brought in $3.8 Billion in pre tax and United Airlines $3 Billion.
According to the Allied pilots association or APA union, Delta shares 10% of pretax profits up to $2.5 billion, and 20% above $2.5 billion. United shares 10% up to a 6.9% pre-tax margin and 20% above that margin. American shares 5% of its pretax profit, the lowest rate among US majors.
For Delta pilots, the best paid line employees at any airline, this results in quite a sizable payout. According to union figures, based on 2017 earnings and profit-sharing numbers, Delta captains will receive a whopping $29,000 to $59,000, depending on tenure. In comparison, a United captain will receive between $9,300 to $20,500 in profit-sharing bonuses, while American Airlines captains will receive a measly $3,600 to $7,500.
A union representative at American is, unsurprisingly, not happy that the other guys are getting all the money. “The profit sharing pool at Delta is an Olympics-size pool,” he said. “American’s is a kiddie-size pool.” (Not that pilots are exactly starving, in general. Their salaries have risen significantly in recent years at least for those with more seniority.)
Delta says it has paid out over $5 billion through the profit-sharing program over the last five years, and the average Delta employee will receive around $6,000 as a bonus for 2017. That’s more than 10% of average base pay for most employees. These bonuses exist despite the fact that Delta’s made quite a bit less net profit last year than the year before: about 18 percent less, with 3.6 billion in 2017 compared to 4.4 Billion.
Delta employees make about 80% more in 2018 than they did a decade ago, according to the airline.
Profit-sharing at American Airlines is a recent development: AA employment contracts before 2015 did not include any form of profit-sharing, and the airline went beyond the contract to introduce profit-sharing at the same rate that existed before American’s merger with US Airways in 2013. In addition, American Airlines also implemented a mid-contract pay increase of 8% in April 2017.
“This is the fourth year in a row that Delta’s profit sharing has topped $1 billion — a milestone no company in history has ever achieved,” said CEO Ed Bastian. “Delta people are the reason for our success, and Valentine’s Day is our favorite day each year as we celebrate the incredible results our people have delivered.”
In 2017, Delta Airlines raked in 5.5 billion in pretax earnings. American Airlines brought in $3.8 Billion in pre tax and United Airlines $3 Billion.
According to the Allied pilots association or APA union, Delta shares 10% of pretax profits up to $2.5 billion, and 20% above $2.5 billion. United shares 10% up to a 6.9% pre-tax margin and 20% above that margin. American shares 5% of its pretax profit, the lowest rate among US majors.
For Delta pilots, the best paid line employees at any airline, this results in quite a sizable payout. According to union figures, based on 2017 earnings and profit-sharing numbers, Delta captains will receive a whopping $29,000 to $59,000, depending on tenure. In comparison, a United captain will receive between $9,300 to $20,500 in profit-sharing bonuses, while American Airlines captains will receive a measly $3,600 to $7,500.
A union representative at American is, unsurprisingly, not happy that the other guys are getting all the money. “The profit sharing pool at Delta is an Olympics-size pool,” he said. “American’s is a kiddie-size pool.” (Not that pilots are exactly starving, in general. Their salaries have risen significantly in recent years at least for those with more seniority.)
Delta says it has paid out over $5 billion through the profit-sharing program over the last five years, and the average Delta employee will receive around $6,000 as a bonus for 2017. That’s more than 10% of average base pay for most employees. These bonuses exist despite the fact that Delta’s made quite a bit less net profit last year than the year before: about 18 percent less, with 3.6 billion in 2017 compared to 4.4 Billion.
Delta employees make about 80% more in 2018 than they did a decade ago, according to the airline.
Profit-sharing at American Airlines is a recent development: AA employment contracts before 2015 did not include any form of profit-sharing, and the airline went beyond the contract to introduce profit-sharing at the same rate that existed before American’s merger with US Airways in 2013. In addition, American Airlines also implemented a mid-contract pay increase of 8% in April 2017.
What a wonderful opportunity to show the nation how generous the pilot body is and how distasteful their management are for very little cost.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
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Ever wondered why Tour of Duty limits are hard limits?
It is because pilots are empowered to act in the interests of safety. If extending beyond a statutory limit, it is because the pilot accepts all liability. The statute fails to protect a pilot outside the regulatory maximum.
CAR 224: Pilot in command
(2) A pilot in command of an aircraft is responsible for: (a) the start, continuation, diversion and end of a flight by the aircraft; and
(b) the operation and safety of the aircraft during flight time; and
(c) the safety of persons and cargo carried on the aircraft; and
(d) the conduct and safety of members of the crew on the aircraft.
Strict liability as expressed in section 6.1 of the Criminal Code details who exactly is responsible for all operational decisions. It isn't little Napoleon.
A domestic pilot extending beyond 12 hours is 'courageous' indeed. For his colleagues in long haul going beyond 20 is also where angels dare!
The reams of accountants with their myriad of excel spreadsheets don't bother counting 'goodwill'. To them there is zero tangible value. But boy do they notice it when it is withdrawn.
Why pilots accept to carry strict liability by accepting less than minimum rest, sign on, TOD extensions, cancelled days off etc is a source of amusement for the the cost accountants, who right now have their weekend off, like every other weekend.
A comparison of airline executive remuneration shows just how over compensated is little napoleon.
It is because pilots are empowered to act in the interests of safety. If extending beyond a statutory limit, it is because the pilot accepts all liability. The statute fails to protect a pilot outside the regulatory maximum.
CAR 224: Pilot in command
(2) A pilot in command of an aircraft is responsible for: (a) the start, continuation, diversion and end of a flight by the aircraft; and
(b) the operation and safety of the aircraft during flight time; and
(c) the safety of persons and cargo carried on the aircraft; and
(d) the conduct and safety of members of the crew on the aircraft.
Strict liability as expressed in section 6.1 of the Criminal Code details who exactly is responsible for all operational decisions. It isn't little Napoleon.
A domestic pilot extending beyond 12 hours is 'courageous' indeed. For his colleagues in long haul going beyond 20 is also where angels dare!
The reams of accountants with their myriad of excel spreadsheets don't bother counting 'goodwill'. To them there is zero tangible value. But boy do they notice it when it is withdrawn.
Why pilots accept to carry strict liability by accepting less than minimum rest, sign on, TOD extensions, cancelled days off etc is a source of amusement for the the cost accountants, who right now have their weekend off, like every other weekend.
A comparison of airline executive remuneration shows just how over compensated is little napoleon.
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What a wonderful opportunity to show the nation how generous the pilot body is and how distasteful their management are for very little cost.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
That little Napoleon is detested by the broader populace and to many Australians is well remembered for October 201, a magnanimous gesture, that really would do a lot of good, would cause all sorts of indigestion in fort fumble as they desperately tried to circumvent it.
This from 2015
As is Joyce, whose remuneration package this year is about $12 million.But is the Qantas management team worth it when compared to the performance of peer airlines? From 2009 to 2015 Singapore Airlines made an aggregate net profit after tax of $3.5 billion; Cathay Pacific $4.8 billion; and Air New Zealand $898 million.Qantas in the same period lost $2.1 billion but its CEO earned almost 50 per cent more than Singapore Airlines' CEO.
Last edited by Rated De; 25th Aug 2018 at 12:23.
Because in this case some people are going to have to wait up to 4 years to realise a bonus that was awarded on the basis of helping the company succeed in 2017/18. If you leave in the next 4 years then no bonus for you despite you being part of the contributing force to the success. This just seems cynical and unnecessary, I for one have just had the last glimmer of good will kicked out of me, they can get F*&ked.
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What a wonderful opportunity to show the nation how generous the pilot body is and how distasteful their management are for very little cost.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
1) Choose a suitable (tax deductible) charity to donate to (drought relief / Red Cross / Smith Family / Salvation Army / Gay Pride etc.).
2) Let every media outlet in the country know that the entire pilot body wishes to donate their full bonuses to a worthy charity provided the pay freeze condition is removed.
3) Watch AJ scurrying and changing position re pay freeze, now explaining he would not stop a donation circa $6 million going to said charity and would pay the bonus he has already promised and made provision for.
4) July 1 2019 submit tax return including $2000 donation to charity. Receive additional $900 in your tax return.
For the majority of the pilot population, the difference between receiving the bonus paid or donating it all and claiming the deduction would be around $200. The value of the marketing coup and the exposure to the public of this outrageous “bonus” would be worth considerably more.
This management group is ruthless and truth or perspective does not matter to them. The problem is that we pilots can often be more hot-headed than calm and diligent about it. I have BIG reservations about directly linking a potential charity donation to the bonus and therefore EBA negotiations.
Nunc est bibendum
Agreed. I posted earlier that we shouldn’t be surprised when a snake behaves as one. That includes in response to actions by various groups of employees to shame Qantas into taking the reasonable and sensible steps they should have taken in the first place.
Having made this dumb decision now, what in Qantas previous history suggests they’ll think to themselves ‘oops, got that wrong’ instead of doubling down on their idiocy and going hard at those who point out the underlying callousness of their actions. To be honest they’re probably still trying to work out why everyone is being so ‘ungrateful’ at the largesse they’ve handed out.
The stupidity of this own goal is that as somone else pointed out, instead of the media (both mainstream and social) narrative being about a record profit (and ‘awesome management’), it’s all about this duplicitous act. It’s further confirmed in the public’s eye the image of Joyce and Qantas as being a bunch of callous dills.
Having made this dumb decision now, what in Qantas previous history suggests they’ll think to themselves ‘oops, got that wrong’ instead of doubling down on their idiocy and going hard at those who point out the underlying callousness of their actions. To be honest they’re probably still trying to work out why everyone is being so ‘ungrateful’ at the largesse they’ve handed out.
The stupidity of this own goal is that as somone else pointed out, instead of the media (both mainstream and social) narrative being about a record profit (and ‘awesome management’), it’s all about this duplicitous act. It’s further confirmed in the public’s eye the image of Joyce and Qantas as being a bunch of callous dills.
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he will feed to the media that pilots are using charity donation as a bargaining chip to avoid productivity increases in their EBA and “using the farmers/Smith Family/Salvos to hold the company to ransom when they already earn the money to make that donation without conditions attached”. The media and the incumbent government will lap that up.
I think our farmers should get the money, irrespective of the motivations appended to the reasoning in getting that money to them. The message is very clear both from company and from us; the company won’t distribute the 2k to us without signing the next ea, allegedly an act of coercion. Our response - remove the 2k from the equation so that we can “negotiate on a level playing field”. Charity seems to be the best method of removal at this point.
My 5c worth.
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Got a call from crewing. Short of resources again and have a rare weekend day off with family.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
Got a call from crewing. Short of resources again and have a rare weekend day off with family.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
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Got a call from crewing. Short of resources again and have a rare weekend day off with family.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
The family reminded me that I’ve worked the last few Christmas, Easter and most school holidays.
Would of loved to help out again and go beyond what’s required but I need pay rises and improved conditions agreed in my EBA first before I can agree to trade the “bonus” of my time off. Works both ways.
Agree with others on the donation idea. Bigger fish to fry.
They can shove the paltry one off bonus up their A&$#. I’ll be voting NO till I get a decent compounding pay rise for my hard work.
Why even bother answering the phone on a day off?
Pilots are the enablers, when goodwill is missing they count it in lost revenue:
- AOC High Capacity RPT has 'scheduled service' obligations (above a threshold of cancellations, airlines actually are in breach)
- Airport operators base their revenue forecasts of gate occupancy and aeronautical revenue on published schedule. Guess what happens when airlines don't do as published?
- ASX listing rule 3.1 works to support Corporations Act 2001 s.674 with respect to material financial disclosures that could have, if publicly known have an effect on share price.
- The ever looking the wrong way, Qantas board will have a revenue loss threshold that raises their interest, particularly with relation to Corporations Act 2001 s.674
- Sick leave, provisions are a requirement under legislative penalty. Burning sick leave provisions impact KPI.
- Pilot stuff costs them a fortune. They simply don't bother counting it as pilots are usually compliant.
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Today's Fairfax media published an article on what the Chancellors at our top Australian universities are being paid. Some of them are on an annual $1.4m AUD and most are on around $1m AUD. The Oxford University equivalent in the UK is on $616K AUD.
Sign of the times or is there something precious about our lot?
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fede...26-p4zztd.html
Sign of the times or is there something precious about our lot?
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/fede...26-p4zztd.html
Last edited by cattletruck; 27th Aug 2018 at 10:29. Reason: Added link
Today's Fairfax media published an article on what the Chancellors at our top Australian universities are being paid. Some of them are on an annual $1.4m AUD and most are on around $1m AUD. The Oxford University equivalent in the UK is on $616K AUD.
Sign of the times or is there something precious about our lot?
Sign of the times or is there something precious about our lot?
No I am not suggesting carrying a bit more fuel for mum and the kids- that would be suggesting unprotected industrial action