Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

457’s are back!

Old 6th Aug 2018, 11:26
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As has been said already, there are plenty of qualified pilots available here in Australia.

They just don’t want to pay the going rate. Let’s get in the mercenaries from overseas.

What at an absolute disgrace!
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 11:50
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Cost of living in AUS is astronomical. Not many experienced expats would take the job unless they doing it purely for a visa.

I pay 15 AUS dollars for a 300g Mediterranean crusted rump steak and fries at a top restaurant.
i will consider OZ when the price is equivalent
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 12:08
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I pay 15 AUS dollars for a 300g Mediterranean crusted rump steak and fries at a top restaurant
Wow. Must check my bottom draw for some AUS dollars! Where is that restaurant please?
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 12:46
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Our Chief Pilot (actually, scrub the pilot bit) should hang his head in shame as to how this has been allowed to happen, given the many decent people in GA that get knocked back whilst they are trying to bring in pilots from overseas.
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 12:47
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Originally Posted by Capt Fathom
As has been said already, there are plenty of qualified pilots available here in Australia.

They just don’t want to pay the going rate. Let’s get in the mercenaries from overseas.

What at an absolute disgrace!
Qualified?
Short a few ratings?
Want free training?

Will not commit and actually stay the term!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Expext to be treated as in comand, but never stood a firm foot on the way up that ladder.

Yep facts- you can not climb out of a sewer and claim to be clean.
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 12:56
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Originally Posted by jetlikespeeds
Our Chief Pilot (actually, scrub the pilot bit) should hang his head in shame as to how this has been allowed to happen, given the many decent people in GA that get knocked back whilst they are trying to bring in pilots from overseas.
A Chief Pilot these days is nothing more than a lap dog to upper management.
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 13:04
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So where is AIPA in all this , they need a seat on the recruiting board to find out why the local candidates are not making the grade, which I find absurd!
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 23:04
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Wonder if the 457 scab labour will be a 50/50 gender split?
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 23:07
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Originally Posted by Kranz
Wonder if the 457 scab labour will be a 50/50 gender split?
didn’t realise there was a picket line being crossed.
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 23:23
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Playing a bit kid devils advocate here but could this actually be a positive for those looking to join Q-Link as an FO. Correct me if I’m wrong but I thought they were only after senior DHC-8 guys (gender neutral) for C&T roles? Wouldn’t these folk then allow for an expanded intake and training of FO’s, the likes of which are currently doing GA flying around Oz? The PR aspect might be what is needed to get a suitable number of quality applicants, without that carrot I don’t think too may would be applying. At the end of the day aviation has always been an industry that has allowed Australian pilots to work internationally...
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Old 6th Aug 2018, 23:37
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What tends to be absurd, is the necessity for local Licence holders to need to jump through more regulatory hoops for check and training roles, than imported Licence holders.

Perhaps Part 61 was designed to allow everyone other than Local Licence holders to have portability of qualifications.

The common theme here is the lack of local development and training. Cadet programs are being used for nothing more than political leverage.

The importation of these “457’s” pilots should be compelled to serve 4-6 years in GA backfilling the void being left in the bush. Then, after having contributed to the grass roots communities, would the visa holder be more likely to be welcomed into the fruits of Australian living.

This is is a little like what the doctors are required to do if imported.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 00:01
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Originally Posted by stormfury
Playing a bit kid devils advocate here but could this actually be a positive for those looking to join Q-Link as an FO. Correct me if I’m wrong but I thought they were only after senior DHC-8 guys (gender neutral) for C&T roles? Wouldn’t these folk then allow for an expanded intake and training of FO’s, the likes of which are currently doing GA flying around Oz? The PR aspect might be what is needed to get a suitable number of quality applicants, without that carrot I don’t think too may would be applying. At the end of the day aviation has always been an industry that has allowed Australian pilots to work internationally...
In response, plenty of qualified drivers (with dash/ATR/metro time) holders sitting as FOs waiting for their turn in the LHS at Link. If the company decide to scrap the company time requirement for command in favour of DECs, there will be a lot of unhappy FOs.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 00:47
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Originally Posted by Brakerider


In response, plenty of qualified drivers (with dash/ATR/metro time) holders sitting as FOs waiting for their turn in the LHS at Link. If the company decide to scrap the company time requirement for command in favour of DECs, there will be a lot of unhappy FOs.
Thanks for clarifying. Would this then free up other CA to take on more of a training role? Last I heard the training throughput was the biggest obstacle to crewing at the moment.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 03:21
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Where precisely is the carefully considered, well researched and coordinated media campaign from the union leadership?

Bueller, Bueller, anyone?
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 03:30
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Originally Posted by havick


didn’t realise there was a picket line being crossed.
Havick, There cant be a picket line if there aren't qualified people to man it due to the airlines refusing to invest in training. Any picket line would only consist of wannabe pilots like myself wondering why I need to go to the US to get a job after initial training and minimum hours, while airlines here in Aus are importing labour to fill positions rather than investing in accelerating their own check and training programs and hiring locally.

Besides, the main attack from my initial comment was on the gender spread rather than the 'scab' comment.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 03:53
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https://www.seek.com.au/job/36900670?type=standout

Here's another one, which has got to be Hevilift. If they dropped the requirement for a type rating, i'm sure they could find plenty of suitable Australian applicants who are experienced on a similar type.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 04:06
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Originally Posted by wishiwasupthere
https://www.seek.com.au/job/36900670?type=standout

Here's another one, which has got to be Hevilift. If they dropped the requirement for a type rating, i'm sure they could find plenty of suitable Australian applicants who are experienced on a similar type.
Senior - retired ATR captain.

Certainly not looking for a newby here, so plenty may not be true.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 04:26
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Originally Posted by stormfury
Thanks for clarifying. Would this then free up other CA to take on more of a training role? Last I heard the training throughput was the biggest obstacle to crewing at the moment.
Few captains are interested in training at the moment, as Trainers are getting (for lack of a better word) "fisted". My bet is a lot of these 457s will be Sim Instructors, with a further chunk attempting to join as DECs that will move into training roles. I had hoped the AFAP would never allow this to happen.
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 05:19
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Originally Posted by Kranz
Havick, There cant be a picket line if there aren't qualified people to man it due to the airlines refusing to invest in training. Any picket line would only consist of wannabe pilots like myself wondering why I need to go to the US to get a job after initial training and minimum hours, while airlines here in Aus are importing labour to fill positions rather than investing in accelerating their own check and training programs and hiring locally.

Besides, the main attack from my initial comment was on the gender spread rather than the 'scab' comment.
use the scab word wisely or it will lose its’ meaning
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Old 7th Aug 2018, 05:47
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Originally Posted by Brakerider
I had hoped the AFAP would never allow this to happen.
The AFAP opposed these visas from the start. They participated in the process to point out all the flawed reasons for Qantas wanting them. Its all in the submission to the Home Affairs Minister. They have issued press releases, and continue to oppose the visas. It's the young pilots that are in GA and regional airlines that are most directly affected by this decision. Their progression to better paying jobs will be negatively impacted by this Qantas / Dutton decision

Qantas know the age demographic of their pilots, therefore they know the retirement profile. Qantas have orders for B787 aircraft, they control the delivery schedule, therefore they know the demand for training this will entail and the timing. Qantas control their recruitment, it was their decision to not hire a single pilot between 2009 and 2016. Qantaslink as recently as 2015 closed bases, force transferred pilots across the country and demoted Dash captains. When a company so comprehensively mismanages its workforce planning; they don't deserve to be rewarded for such incompetence. Unfortunately, the current government has done precisely that.

Short of removing Govenment, what do you suggest? A national strike?
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