Airnorth Cancellng Flights
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I was referring to FO jobs in Aus. The small airlines like Cobham, Air North, Skippers and until recently, Network, required 500 multi PIC for an FO job. I've worked in 3 different countries and that requirement for an FO position is only unique to regional airlines in Australia.
It's not the air force. The 150+ of civilian hours of training is waypoint to waypoint, flying the same hour A to B, over and over again. It's very limited training and severely lacking in critical areas that are not known to regulators and covered up by industry players. The instances of inexperienced co-pilots, breaking down in early events in high stress human factors scenarios goes largely unreported. I'd go as far to say it's an industry cover up.
I don't believe the risk is worth taking in Australia. I can't believe its being pushed by pilots? Here we have a small window where experience is of value and the hard lessons of other countries ( Coglan etc ) can be presented in an argument in favour of improved pay and conditions for pilots.
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I don't believe the risk is worth taking in Australia. I can't believe its being pushed by pilots? Here we have a small window where experience is of value and the hard lessons of other countries ( Coglan etc ) can be presented in an argument in favour of improved pay and conditions for pilots.
So what's the solution then? With the known shortage of GA jobs in Australia for fresh CPL's to bridge the experience gap, where is this experience going to come from?
Do we accept that the majority of new CPL's in Australia will have to go overseas to get the GA experience? Or accept that Australia is just incapable of fostering new pilots and that the majority of Airline jobs, regional and mainline will have to come from overseas?
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Do we accept that the majority of new CPL's in Australia will have to go overseas to get the GA experience?
I'd suggest companies stop resisting wage growth. Wage growth will bring home expatriates and young pilots will find a way to gain the experience.
I've just flown this week with young pilots who have "fled" Australia having flown with these "General Aviation" with jets companies. The stories are horrific. The contempt and lack of respect from management from some of these companies will only drive further shortages.
I've just flown this week with young pilots who have "fled" Australia having flown with these "General Aviation" with jets companies. The stories are horrific. The contempt and lack of respect from management from some of these companies will only drive further shortages.
The US 1500hr rule was one of the most knee jerk reactions ever. It’s caused regional airlines to basically recruit anyone with 1500 flying hours and a pulse to occupy the right hand seat of an E-jet (even people with previously disqualifying conditions like drink driving convictions are being snapped up) and then upgraded to Captain at the bare minimum 1000hrs FO time (just over a years flying) even if they believe they are not ready/competent enough for a Captaincy. If I was in the US frankly I’d avoid flying on one of their regional carriers. Not worth the risk.
Right let's sort this out. The 1500 hour was more to do with lifting pilots salaries and conditions than having experience up the front. A regional FO at the time of Colgan made 18k a year. Thats food stamp wages. Pilots couldn't afford to move out of home. They were sleeping in crew rooms. Thats what happens when you put 250 hour kids in jets. They work for nothing.
Right let's sort this out. The 1500 hour was more to do with lifting pilots salaries and conditions than having experience up the front. A regional FO at the time of Colgan made 18k a year. Thats food stamp wages. Pilots couldn't afford to move out of home. They were sleeping in crew rooms. Thats what happens when you put 250 hour kids in jets. They work for nothing.
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So what's the solution then? With the known shortage of GA jobs in Australia for fresh CPL's to bridge the experience gap, where is this experience going to come from?
Do we accept that the majority of new CPL's in Australia will have to go overseas to get the GA experience? Or accept that Australia is just incapable of fostering new pilots and that the majority of Airline jobs, regional and mainline will have to come from overseas?
Do we accept that the majority of new CPL's in Australia will have to go overseas to get the GA experience? Or accept that Australia is just incapable of fostering new pilots and that the majority of Airline jobs, regional and mainline will have to come from overseas?
I understand general aviation may not be what it was 20 years ago, but it still exists. There is no shortage of us with multi ifr that can’t seem to quite get out of ga and into an airline.
The problem is for a few of us, we don’t seem to be what HR want up the front of their aircraft. Maybe we answered a “how does that make you feel” question wrong? We have all the hour requirements, the school marks, the atpls, but the hr recruiters with all their aviation wisdom seem to think they know better.
In the past 12 months Airnorth have turned down 2 good friends of mine, that were well known great guys in ga in the NT...they are now doing command training with a much larger regional operator in Aus.
Seems the problem is Regionals not dropping standards - should they and why (well thought answers preferred).
Seems Regionals should increase pay and conditions to attract lower qualified staff - Where does this extra money come from to pay for extra pay and conditions AND extra training. (Many of the routes already have government/mining hand outs to make them viable as it is.)
Seems there is actually no shortage of pilots in Australia at all, just ones that miss a criteria to leap over the next frog.
Seems Regionals should increase pay and conditions to attract lower qualified staff - Where does this extra money come from to pay for extra pay and conditions AND extra training. (Many of the routes already have government/mining hand outs to make them viable as it is.)
Seems there is actually no shortage of pilots in Australia at all, just ones that miss a criteria to leap over the next frog.
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I think we are also starting to see a generational shift where newly qualified CPL pilots think it's their devine right to go straight to a shiny jet and uniform instead of putting in the effort and sacrifice to find jobs. No longer are they willing to door knock dropping off resumes, move around the country or do basic jobs like cleaning aircraft in order to get a foot in the door. Instead they want all the money and privllage with out sacrifice or doing any of the hard work it takes to get there.
The supply has dried up...........but the demand hasn't.
I’m in GA, all my friends are in GA. We are all “stuck” in GA.
I understand general aviation may not be what it was 20 years ago, but it still exists. There is no shortage of us with multi ifr that can’t seem to quite get out of ga and into an airline.
The problem is for a few of us, we don’t seem to be what HR want up the front of their aircraft. Maybe we answered a “how does that make you feel” question wrong? We have all the hour requirements, the school marks, the atpls, but the hr recruiters with all their aviation wisdom seem to think they know better.
In the past 12 months Airnorth have turned down 2 good friends of mine, that were well known great guys in ga in the NT...they are now doing command training with a much larger regional operator in Aus.
I understand general aviation may not be what it was 20 years ago, but it still exists. There is no shortage of us with multi ifr that can’t seem to quite get out of ga and into an airline.
The problem is for a few of us, we don’t seem to be what HR want up the front of their aircraft. Maybe we answered a “how does that make you feel” question wrong? We have all the hour requirements, the school marks, the atpls, but the hr recruiters with all their aviation wisdom seem to think they know better.
In the past 12 months Airnorth have turned down 2 good friends of mine, that were well known great guys in ga in the NT...they are now doing command training with a much larger regional operator in Aus.
I herd (admittily second hand) of a couple of e3 guys on the Embraer in the USA that apparently enquired at air north. When they herd they had to pay for their own endorsement (even though they already have one) and the conditions, they could barely contain their laughter.
I herd (admittily second hand) of a couple of e3 guys on the Embraer in the USA that apparently enquired at air north. When they herd they had to pay for their own endorsement (even though they already have one) and the conditions, they could barely contain their laughter.
If Air North offered some decent terms there would be (some) type rated guys willing to come home. They've also flown the aircraft in far more challenging conditions than Air North encounter.
I know lots of experienced Aussi pilots who would return to Oz for any flying job that offered a living wage for a family. Seems odd to me that the Oz news doesn't mention Terms and Conditions being inadequate.
To joe public, $94k to fly an E170 as an FO looks like amazing money. To anyone in the know, it’s really not.
