So you need a new fleet Leigh?

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Originally Posted by Don Diego

Hey GG, I went JQ once as a punter and never again, it was the WORST flight I have ever done. I will happily pay the asking price for any other airline to be rid if that s&%t.

That’s the business model, you don’t want to fly on the bogan bus, fork out and fly QF. It’s the same company! It’s the reason JQ will never become the JetBlue of Australia, if it gets too good (or rather less sh!t) people will start wondering why they’re paying extra to fly QF.

But the average punter will just go for the cheapest airfare most times.

[Don Diego]

Hey ECAM, there was no QF on that route at the time so then one looks elsewhere and never looks back!!! Great business model.

[Chocks Away]

Further to Project Sunrise ... good luck
From another article : " Joyce also pointed out that Qantas is the only airline in the world which could order a significant number of Ultra-long-haul aircraft as there was no other major market which is as remote as Eastern Australia" ...
This comment just shows his caliber What an extremely naive and ignorant comment. How about Air EnZed's fine example? ... LAN (Chile)/ LATAM; SA Airways; Finnair; Aerolinas Argentinas... the list goes on.
Happy Landings

[Rated De]

Originally Posted by Chocks Away

Further to Project Sunrise ... good luck
From another article : " Joyce also pointed out that Qantas is the only airline in the world which could order a significant number of Ultra-long-haul aircraft as there was no other major market which is as remote as Eastern Australia" ...
This comment just shows his caliber What an extremely naive and ignorant comment. How about Air EnZed's fine example? ... LAN (Chile)/ LATAM; SA Airways; Finnair; Aerolinas Argentinas... the list goes on.
Happy Landings

That there long ago ceased to be investigative journalism is in part reason why these statements go unchallenged.
It is fanciful that the industry seriously allows such rubbish to be printed.

" Joyce also pointed out that Qantas is the only airline in the world which could order a significant number of Ultra-long-haul aircraft as there was no other major market which is as remote as Eastern Australia"

With the A380 development cost exceeding $9.5 billion, then Little Napoleon will need to buy a whole lot of aircraft to 'bind' the manufacturers.
Outside the Australian, home field myopia Qantas is a small insignificant airline, Jetstar even less so.

[Rated De]

“We are obviously having to talk about the regulator, about changing the regulations or having the regulations suitable for this long-haul flying and what does it mean for fatigue risk management for both pilots and cabin crew and how is the company going to manage that,” Joyce said.“So there shouldn’t be anything that is uniquely difficult about it. It’s typically what we have done when we have extended the operation each other time.” “You are designing something that is very different. You are designing something for 21 hours,” Joyce explained.


So Little Napoleon which is it?
As far as your duty of care to your employees, it is simply an 'incremental change', but for customers it is very different.
Extrapolating fatigue and health outcomes on a linear basis is not statistically valid is it?

Will be interesting to see what 'science' supports an exemption.

[dragon man]

Originally Posted by Rated De

“We are obviously having to talk about the regulator, about changing the regulations or having the regulations suitable for this long-haul flying and what does it mean for fatigue risk management for both pilots and cabin crew and how is the company going to manage that,” Joyce said.“So there shouldn’t be anything that is uniquely difficult about it. It’s typically what we have done when we have extended the operation each other time.” “You are designing something that is very different. You are designing something for 21 hours,” Joyce explained.


So Little Napoleon which is it?
As far as your duty of care to your employees, it is simply an 'incremental change', but for customers it is very different.
Extrapolating fatigue and health outcomes on a linear basis is not statistically valid is it?

Will be interesting to see what 'science' supports an exemption.

The reality is he doesn’t care and will say what ever is necessary to get what he wants.

[Rated De]

Originally Posted by dragon man

The reality is he doesn’t care and will say what ever is necessary to get what he wants.

Of course not, but an astute pilot representative body 'leader' will be ensuring that the distinction is made clear to Little Napoleon.

[gtseraf]

Originally Posted by Rated De

Of course not, but an astute pilot representative body 'leader' will be ensuring that the distinction is made clear to Little Napoleon.

Unfortunately any leader needs to be supported by the whole pilot group. This industry's history, worldwide, has many instances of leaders doing their best to achieve a certain goal but not being supported by the "troops", despite the "verbal support" of said troops. Any issue needs to have the complete support of all the pilots to have any chance of success, sadly, it would appear that this point has been recognised by the employers and they will use any tactics to ensure this does not occur.

[Rated De]

Originally Posted by gtseraf

Unfortunately any leader needs to be supported by the whole pilot group. This industry's history, worldwide, has many instances of leaders doing their best to achieve a certain goal but not being supported by the "troops", despite the "verbal support" of said troops. Any issue needs to have the complete support of all the pilots to have any chance of success, sadly, it would appear that this point has been recognised by the employers and they will use any tactics to ensure this does not occur.

That is fair commentary.
Perhaps the behaviour of the Stream Lead predecessor set a low bar.

That the incumbent is also a very junior 'aspirational' makes it easy to manipulate agendas. Having been shown some of his 'musings' which he attempts to pass as erudite, they are very similar to numerous Qantas press releases, suggesting that perhaps the first thing he gave Little Napoleon when 'negotiating' a new type was a CV.

[dragon man]

Originally Posted by rated de

that is fair commentary.
Perhaps the behaviour of the stream lead predecessor set a low bar.

That the incumbent is also a very junior 'aspirational' makes it easy to manipulate agendas. Having been shown some of his 'musings' which he attempts to pass as erudite, they are very similar to numerous qantas press releases, suggesting that perhaps the first thing he gave little napoleon when 'negotiating' a new type was a cv.

👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

[Beer Baron]

some of his 'musings' which he attempts to pass as erudite

Well if that’s not the pot calling the kettle black, then I don’t know what is.

[wheels_down]

Why don’t they spin off Jetstar?

The business is ripe for a spin off and is relatively stable. Obviously QF could retain a 20% odd holding to maintain its collaboration.

Enormous upside for QF as a business and it’s fleet/debt plans if this was to occur. Would essentially kill of Virgin.

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Have a listen to how many times Joyce says ‘dual brand strategy’ during the next annual profit statement. I don’t think JQ will be sold off under his reign.

[crosscutter]

Originally Posted by wheels_down

Would essentially kill of Virgin.

That is the last thing Qantas want. Nothing better for business than a weak competitor in a duopoly.

[Rated De]

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

Have a listen to how many times Joyce says ‘dual brand strategy’ during the next annual profit statement. I don’t think JQ will be sold off under his reign.

As originally pitched to the Dixon era management, the likely elements were to wedge domestic competitors; either follow QF on yield and brand (spend) or follow JQ on unit cost.The unit cost argument is spurious as scant detail exists on JQ. No segment breakdown is forthcoming; noone can see it other than internal managers how things really look. Similarly, former CFO Gregg detailed the competitive wage tension in the 'group' a JQ model would create is a matter for public record. That the JQ fleet accelerated with Little Napoleon and the fossil if likely a result of an IR focus and the desire to drive unit cost outcomes.
The fact that all low fare airlines, no matter what their unit (labour) cost struggle with yield is well known. Their customers are 'price loyal' not usually brand, thus any attempt to raise price and yield is often not successful.
Further, Little Napoleon wants all and sundry to know he created JQ. Factually, he was at Ansett when the concept was pitched to and accepted by, senior Qantas management. This is the hero myth.

The JQ model has merit at a smaller scale. It has little relevance internationally and the lack of transparency is suggestive that subjective management discretion is applied to 'who pays for what'.
Taking Qantas' own figures at face value, JQ can only achieve 29% of the revenue flying 48% of the ASK. Not only is scale an issue but it is evident that the business lacks the ability to do anything than offer 'low fares'.

Whilst Little Napoleon sits in the big chair, there is zero possibility that how much effective subsidy occurs will ever be known. It remains opaque and the accounting standards are exploited (not illegally) to ensure that a little from column A and a little from column B keeps the accounts opaque and thus eye pleasing to the less than curious!

[dragon man]

The bottom line IMO is that Jetstar should be folded into mainline, what were leisure routes 15 years ago are no longer. Running two outfits with seperate management, AOCs, training Department’s etc is just crazy . You buy a Qantas ticket you get the same conditions and service every where. Won’t happen, I know.

[Chris2303]

Originally Posted by dragon man

The bottom line IMO is that Jetstar should be folded into mainline, what were leisure routes 15 years ago are no longer. Running two outfits with seperate management, AOCs, training Department’s etc is just crazy . You buy a Qantas ticket you get the same conditions and service every where. Won’t happen, I know.

So then we go back to a monopoly on NZ domestic routes and JQ pull off the AKL-RAR route to name but one.

Is that what we really want?

[Rated De]

Originally Posted by dragon man

The bottom line IMO is that Jetstar should be folded into mainline, what were leisure routes 15 years ago are no longer. Running two outfits with seperate management, AOCs, training Department’s etc is just crazy . You buy a Qantas ticket you get the same conditions and service every where. Won’t happen, I know.

The duplication relates to everything. In order to firewall the labour groups, most structures, with the exception of treasury and aircraft sourcing have to be duplicated, right down to boarding pass readers at the branded gate.
There represented a unique opportunity circa 2003 to re-equip Qantas and set the airline on a course different to the current trajectory.

Qantas could easily have re-furbished the 734 and 763 into high density 'QantasLite' and used the same sunk cost (paid for by the taxpayer) to serve leisure markets. This was tried yet abandoned with Australian Airlines.
The mess that currently sees costs duplicated hidden by opaque accounts, is neither efficient nor replicated anywhere else in the industry. There is a reason why.

[dragon man]

Duplication but different fleets domestically, madness. Different booking systems , fuel policies, the list is endless the savings huge. As long as the CEO is an inbred Qantas person who is mainlining the Qantas koolaid nothing will happen. Eventually the job will be so big that it can never happen, maybe we are already there.

[Global Aviator]

Not duplicated anywhere else in the industry

Virgin/Tiger?

Hmmmmmm...