Fake management at JQHQ
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Join Date: Oct 2010
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Fake management at JQHQ
Everyone outside of the purple circle is in open revolt. As an outsider, I have never heard of so much disdain for a management team. It doesn’t matter who you talk to the story is the same, the criticisms are the same. Jetstar is departing from normal flight, the phugoid gets more out of control day by day. New bat**** crazy ideas get rolled out on a weekly basis. The generals duly implement the plan. Communicated appropriately by yammer, Facebook, the weekly crap, a note from Georgie.
This can only end in tears, if a management team is so disconnected, so reviled by the front line, they cannot lead. They are openly laughed at, pet projects and jobs for the golden children open up festering wounds. The old Ansett jobs for the boys has been described as amateur in comparison to the wholesale corruption taking place now.
The results from the previous engagement survey were not released, as the year long polishing effort yielded insufficient improvement. Best to bury it and pretend it never existed. The Nile is managements favourite river (denial).
Anywhoo enjoy the crazy ride while it lasts. The day of reckoning cannot be far off.
This can only end in tears, if a management team is so disconnected, so reviled by the front line, they cannot lead. They are openly laughed at, pet projects and jobs for the golden children open up festering wounds. The old Ansett jobs for the boys has been described as amateur in comparison to the wholesale corruption taking place now.
The results from the previous engagement survey were not released, as the year long polishing effort yielded insufficient improvement. Best to bury it and pretend it never existed. The Nile is managements favourite river (denial).
Anywhoo enjoy the crazy ride while it lasts. The day of reckoning cannot be far off.
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Its all b##**** and propaganda as the real 'frontline' workers know. I don't think anyone takes their job seriously there, how can you? Just show up, tick the boxes, take plenty of fuel, go home, then enjoy life. Wait for the next opportunity to leave/retire. Simple as that, problem for all these hot shots at the top, once they leave JQ or we leave JQ and see them in public, they're nobodies and will be treated as such! 
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JQ management are only interested in working us into early graves in order to improve their bonuses. I won't be filling out their BS engagement survey. The only feedback they need is fatigue OSCARs. Can't believe they're still rostering back to back back of the clocks.
I'm not so sure it's just JQ... VA is just as bad... they make a point of appointing people who know nothing... do a survey of people as to who would be the least capable appointee for a position and they will get the job... when someone with talent and experience does walk in the door it's an endless string of belittling, interrupting during meetings, grandstanding, trying to pick a minuscule item and overblow it while ranting and raving about it to the equally useless boss - a combination of sucking up and trying to belittle and marginalise someone who is supposed to be a colleague only to protect yourself from scrutiny and cover up the general populace's total lack of ability, competence or knowledge of the industry they are in... to the point where the well qualified end up gaining the respect of the frontline people but either get engineered out, leave of their own accord in preference to banging their head against the wall any longer or end up being loved by their subordinates and hated by their peers for screaming bull--- at every chance and being the only frontline attuned voice of reason.
Thus, I don't think it's any different in VA. Management, like politics these days, seems to attract the least qualified wank3rs that are capable of BSing their way in... very few that can be respected these days.
I know this from let's just say. someone I know well, went in there, was treated with absolute lack of respect, talked over at meetings, belittled in front of subordinates, backhand ridicule and when that person reacted sometimes (for the most remaining professional) by understandably letting loose with a well targeted and blistering response to the cheers of the front line, that just further entrenched the hatred of the person by the peer level people who just couldn't stand anyone who had graduated kindergarten having any sort of responsibility. Incompetence, blame shifting, in one case a person who should have retired years before doing absolutely nothing but throwing crap at others to cover up their own inactivity - just beyond belief even for the not always well run companies many of us started with back many years ago. Some of the stories absolutely would turn people pale of egregious incompetence rewarded by promotion and yes, even at higher levels, people entrusted with advancing the company negotiate deals that cost it millions more... too much to cover, JQ not at all unique.
Thus, I don't think it's any different in VA. Management, like politics these days, seems to attract the least qualified wank3rs that are capable of BSing their way in... very few that can be respected these days.
I know this from let's just say. someone I know well, went in there, was treated with absolute lack of respect, talked over at meetings, belittled in front of subordinates, backhand ridicule and when that person reacted sometimes (for the most remaining professional) by understandably letting loose with a well targeted and blistering response to the cheers of the front line, that just further entrenched the hatred of the person by the peer level people who just couldn't stand anyone who had graduated kindergarten having any sort of responsibility. Incompetence, blame shifting, in one case a person who should have retired years before doing absolutely nothing but throwing crap at others to cover up their own inactivity - just beyond belief even for the not always well run companies many of us started with back many years ago. Some of the stories absolutely would turn people pale of egregious incompetence rewarded by promotion and yes, even at higher levels, people entrusted with advancing the company negotiate deals that cost it millions more... too much to cover, JQ not at all unique.
Last edited by AerialPerspective; 21st Mar 2017 at 09:20. Reason: added content
I think your comments could be applied to every airline ATM.
With regard to GS, I think her time in QF management she was well regarded after the debacle that was JG. AC was promoted above his abilities and then promoted again.
I won't say anything bad against the women promoted in QF, but I will say I doubt they were all the best candidate on the day. There has been a desire to promote women and it has been long coming but at the end of the day the best person should get the job.
At the end of the day, almost all management are in there for the right reasons. It's a crap job and they do more hours than any of us would offer for not much more pay.
It should be like the US presidency. 8 years max.. if you haven't delivered some positive change you had your chance. There are lots of people who could and should be given the chance.
The AN ppl at JQ had their chance. Time to move on
With regard to GS, I think her time in QF management she was well regarded after the debacle that was JG. AC was promoted above his abilities and then promoted again.
I won't say anything bad against the women promoted in QF, but I will say I doubt they were all the best candidate on the day. There has been a desire to promote women and it has been long coming but at the end of the day the best person should get the job.
At the end of the day, almost all management are in there for the right reasons. It's a crap job and they do more hours than any of us would offer for not much more pay.
It should be like the US presidency. 8 years max.. if you haven't delivered some positive change you had your chance. There are lots of people who could and should be given the chance.
The AN ppl at JQ had their chance. Time to move on
Personally I think it is a power game from the top. Promote people in positions below you who then rely on you because they are incompetent or never had the experience/qualifications to get the job on their own merits. They also won't be challenging for your position.
I wasn't aware of that one, no, I was talking about someone else but there are plenty of examples... it's got to be the worst at the moment. QF actually make a profit and whether it's because of the ingrained process driven operational culture at QF that it continues to act mostly like a 'real' airline along with having the best systems for passenger delivery I don't know but the other mob definitely don't and they definitely don't like people with experience. Some ex AN people there who knew what they were doing also but were always under siege. The most toxic environment I've seen. That is the real reason why VA doesn't make money. Dysfunctional, scared of knowledge and competence, idiots keep remaining because they make those above them look good. Do tell about the HF Mgr though, what was the story???
It is an unfortunate sign of the times that managers are judged on the "x factor" popularity ratings.
Now by that I don't mean that a manager should be hated, despised or universally a tool, rather it is a job where the best you can hope for is to be considered fair and consistent.
If everyone loves you then you are probably not making the hard decisions that must be made from time to time in those jobs, if you are universally hated then you are again not doing the job properly as it requires empathy, understanding and compassion.
If a manager does the job properly there will be elements on one side who are utterly pissed off with you, because you have not pandered to their self interest, a big group in the middle who are ambivalent "he/she is ok, they seem fair" and then the other extreme who are apostles - again for probably the wrong reasons.
These jobs are not popularity competitions, or shouldn't be, but the holder of said position should be fair, consistent and balanced - a post match review should determine some decisions favoured the pilots, some favoured the company, some suited neither I.e. They did what was best for as many people as they could.
They should look after their staff, particularly those in need (sick, troubled by personal issues etc), and do so without a big song and dance - the person involved will know you have positioned yourself between them and the people trying to mess with them, but it should be practically invisible to the majority of the troops. There shouldn't be a big "look at me I have done this for blogs" message.
Alas, my view of the world and how managers should fit in it isn't in step with the modern management paradigm. Certainly seems to not be the way of the world in either JQ or VA based on the messages above.
Now by that I don't mean that a manager should be hated, despised or universally a tool, rather it is a job where the best you can hope for is to be considered fair and consistent.
If everyone loves you then you are probably not making the hard decisions that must be made from time to time in those jobs, if you are universally hated then you are again not doing the job properly as it requires empathy, understanding and compassion.
If a manager does the job properly there will be elements on one side who are utterly pissed off with you, because you have not pandered to their self interest, a big group in the middle who are ambivalent "he/she is ok, they seem fair" and then the other extreme who are apostles - again for probably the wrong reasons.
These jobs are not popularity competitions, or shouldn't be, but the holder of said position should be fair, consistent and balanced - a post match review should determine some decisions favoured the pilots, some favoured the company, some suited neither I.e. They did what was best for as many people as they could.
They should look after their staff, particularly those in need (sick, troubled by personal issues etc), and do so without a big song and dance - the person involved will know you have positioned yourself between them and the people trying to mess with them, but it should be practically invisible to the majority of the troops. There shouldn't be a big "look at me I have done this for blogs" message.
Alas, my view of the world and how managers should fit in it isn't in step with the modern management paradigm. Certainly seems to not be the way of the world in either JQ or VA based on the messages above.
Other than KD which other senior manager has resigned? BITW kva is back in sydney as one of the FDMs or whatever its called now and probably enjoying a better quality of life.
Things won't change at JQ until all the Flt Ops Managers are on the seniority list and not on contract. In QF you won't find a manager who is not on the seniority list. In JQ it can and will be used against you if you are on a Management contract and you don't toe the line or the CP just doesn't like you.
It would seem that the current JANZ CEO is just as ineffective as the last one in exerting any influence as to how the airline is run. I would have thought that one Deepwater Horizon on a resume would be enough.
Things won't change at JQ until all the Flt Ops Managers are on the seniority list and not on contract. In QF you won't find a manager who is not on the seniority list. In JQ it can and will be used against you if you are on a Management contract and you don't toe the line or the CP just doesn't like you.
It would seem that the current JANZ CEO is just as ineffective as the last one in exerting any influence as to how the airline is run. I would have thought that one Deepwater Horizon on a resume would be enough.
Snakecharma,
Don't go bringing your logic, reason and good management practices over here, you know there's no place for that at JQ
Lookleft,
"One Deepwater horizon on your resume"
gold
Remember folks, easter's just around the corner, beware the ides of March.
(Although its in April this year)
Don't go bringing your logic, reason and good management practices over here, you know there's no place for that at JQ
Lookleft,
"One Deepwater horizon on your resume"
gold
Remember folks, easter's just around the corner, beware the ides of March.
(Although its in April this year)