Virgin Australia concerns
They seem to have spat the dummy on all the three routes they transferred to Tiger i.e. MEL, PER and ADL. In addition to no MEL-DPS you now have other anomalies such as flying PHE-DPS but not PER-DPS, the latter having Indonesia AirAsia (3 per day), Jetstar (3 per day) and Garuda as well. The booking engine shows the cheapest option for PER-DPS as a 15 hour trip with connection in BNE !
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I hear you guys, but why not bite the bullet and just resume the Melb-DPS service. Is it out of sheer bloody mindedness, refusal to admit they screwed up? I thought running an airline was all about bums on seats. My brother (Virgin then Tiger painted Virgin) reckons the flights from Melbourne were nearly always chockers! As a staff traveller, more often than not I couldn't get on (not Tiger, Virgin staff travel didn't apply) and had to travel with other carriers..
I still don't get it!
I still don't get it!
Confusing indeed as I'm pretty sure Air Asia pulled out of Melbourne. I could be wrong.
The big question in my mind is:
Virgin had the narrowbody DPS market to themselves for years so what planning was there to lock in those customers for the long term?
The big question in my mind is:
Virgin had the narrowbody DPS market to themselves for years so what planning was there to lock in those customers for the long term?
You guys here are all talking about DPS and market presence etc etc It looks to me that you are glossing over the reality.
Its not the volume of the market its the yield, the market to DPS from all those ports you mention is real, but the price Joe Public is willing to pay is bottom dollar.
The vast majority of the tattooed, sunburnt unwashed simply don't care, they want to save as much on the flight to spend on Bintang.
They could not tell the difference between any of the carriers you mention, except the hostie was a good sort and it cost $10 for another bourbon on JQ.... but I bet you that they know exactly the cost of TT v JQ v GA v JT in exactly the same way as my kids know the local bus schedule by memory but cant remember to clean their rooms!
If you cant make a buck at it because the cost of business in this country is so high compared to the costs of business there, whether it's economies of scale, costs of financing, equipment and labour costs. It all cost more here than there...... why would you bother if there is not the point of difference that you can extract more from the punter...... aka YEILD.
Its not the volume of the market its the yield, the market to DPS from all those ports you mention is real, but the price Joe Public is willing to pay is bottom dollar.
The vast majority of the tattooed, sunburnt unwashed simply don't care, they want to save as much on the flight to spend on Bintang.
They could not tell the difference between any of the carriers you mention, except the hostie was a good sort and it cost $10 for another bourbon on JQ.... but I bet you that they know exactly the cost of TT v JQ v GA v JT in exactly the same way as my kids know the local bus schedule by memory but cant remember to clean their rooms!
If you cant make a buck at it because the cost of business in this country is so high compared to the costs of business there, whether it's economies of scale, costs of financing, equipment and labour costs. It all cost more here than there...... why would you bother if there is not the point of difference that you can extract more from the punter...... aka YEILD.
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The whole Tiger debacle came about because the head kicker that JB employed from the states thought it would be a perfect way to threaten existing VA pilots into taking reduced employment conditions or else all the flying would go to TT.
Now he's gone and the whole debacle is blowing up in the managements face.
Now he's gone and the whole debacle is blowing up in the managements face.
Well I heard from a few sources that Tiger infact were making good money on it.
They were selling out the carts.
Cabin crew rarely got "sick" in DPS resulting in less empty ferries and cancelled flights.
The triangle is great but I think you need to be able to make money elsewhere within the business otherwise there isn't a long term.
Either way pulling out all together I think is both sad and concerning.
They were selling out the carts.
Cabin crew rarely got "sick" in DPS resulting in less empty ferries and cancelled flights.
The triangle is great but I think you need to be able to make money elsewhere within the business otherwise there isn't a long term.
Either way pulling out all together I think is both sad and concerning.
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Where have TT's slots into DPS gone?
cost $10 for another bourbon on JQ
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"Where have TT's slots into DPS gone?"
Nowhere, Virgin still own them..
Out of interest, the one and only time I flew Tiger the airfare was close to $1000 and the product was cr%p. At that price I guess they would've been making a bit of dough....
Nowhere, Virgin still own them..
Out of interest, the one and only time I flew Tiger the airfare was close to $1000 and the product was cr%p. At that price I guess they would've been making a bit of dough....
i believe VA can't take over the MEL,ADL and PER to DPS because they don't have enough airframes available. they transferred the 737's to TT from the International 737 fleet, and they can't just use the domestic 737's.
it sounds very convoluted, but that seems to be the VA way at the moment
it sounds very convoluted, but that seems to be the VA way at the moment
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Paint Stripper
Get the paint stripper out and reclaim the Virgin 737's?!
Do Tiger actually have any 737 rated crew yet? Suppose they should, it's been long enough....
TWOTBAGS;
"but the price Joe Public is willing to pay is bottom dollar."
I hear you but over the years (I first went there in '86 and lived there part time for years until recently so know it pretty well..) the type of people frequenting Bali has altered. Sure, in the old days it was surfers, families on the cheap, drunks looking for sunshine and the cheapest beer in town and that was about it. Plenty of punters to run a Tiger LCC operation or two.
However in recent times there's been a surge of far more well heeled people who frequent Seminyak, Nusa Dua and Changgu etc (i.e. would never venture to Kuta, Legian, buy bintang T shirts or wander the streets drinking same), lease Villas or live there part time and are cashed up (and not afraid to spend it). They wouldn't take a Tiger flight to Bali in a pink fit
.
For them, the Virgin product was the preferred carrier I'm guessing. I used Virgin many times and they did it pretty bloody well. I would hazard a guess those people now choose to fly Garuda (surprisingly good and a full service airline) or perhaps Jetstar.
To wind up, my guess is there is plenty of demand to sustain a decent quality/ profitable service to Denpasar from Melbourne. i.e. like there was before the great Tiger experiment. But then I'm not Virgin Management so what the hell would I know?!
Do Tiger actually have any 737 rated crew yet? Suppose they should, it's been long enough....
TWOTBAGS;
"but the price Joe Public is willing to pay is bottom dollar."
I hear you but over the years (I first went there in '86 and lived there part time for years until recently so know it pretty well..) the type of people frequenting Bali has altered. Sure, in the old days it was surfers, families on the cheap, drunks looking for sunshine and the cheapest beer in town and that was about it. Plenty of punters to run a Tiger LCC operation or two.
However in recent times there's been a surge of far more well heeled people who frequent Seminyak, Nusa Dua and Changgu etc (i.e. would never venture to Kuta, Legian, buy bintang T shirts or wander the streets drinking same), lease Villas or live there part time and are cashed up (and not afraid to spend it). They wouldn't take a Tiger flight to Bali in a pink fit
. For them, the Virgin product was the preferred carrier I'm guessing. I used Virgin many times and they did it pretty bloody well. I would hazard a guess those people now choose to fly Garuda (surprisingly good and a full service airline) or perhaps Jetstar.
To wind up, my guess is there is plenty of demand to sustain a decent quality/ profitable service to Denpasar from Melbourne. i.e. like there was before the great Tiger experiment. But then I'm not Virgin Management so what the hell would I know?!
Last edited by Mach2point7; 3rd Mar 2017 at 04:08. Reason: elaboration of routing
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Bali Debacle
I'm informed there is a serious manpower crisis within Virgin. However I'm sure there's still plenty of Bali qualified tech crew about because until very recently they were sitting idle waiting to re qualify for domestic duties..
Poor buggers must be missing the surf and cold Bintangs. Business in a couple of establishments I know in Nusa Dua would have nose dived :-(
Poor buggers must be missing the surf and cold Bintangs. Business in a couple of establishments I know in Nusa Dua would have nose dived :-(
Anyone likely to put their hand up and say " that was a poor decision I made there, I'll look into my DM process and do better in the future" ? Or is it all due to " challenging market conditions" ?