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Qantas Recruitment

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Old 17th May 2018, 01:26
  #1461 (permalink)  
 
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One of the best things about the whole Qantas pilot situation is choice (tempered by seniority and time).
When first hired you are allocated a type, now that type should be 787 but occasionally other types due to the company filling required places.
From then on you choose where and on what type you wish to be and any movement off your current position is awarded by seniority on what you choose to type into your LOP, (letter of preference).
737 first officer positions in Perth or Adelaide available virtually immediately if you CHOOSE!
Some pilots will want the fast promotion through the ranks and choose 737 in the West until a command, others will choose to stay longhaul as SO or FO for a long time to live in the city of their choice. For some it is : “if it’s not Boeing I aint going”, for some it is the joy of eating a crew meal on a table! Thank goodness everyone has various ideas of a perfect lifestyle as even the trips on each type have some variance.
Pay varies through types and ranks for a number of reasons, 12 year increments on established long haul types being one reason, overtime on long routes being another. Longhaul FOs are paid 65% of Captain, SOs 50%, not too hard to figure out, payrates are public.
Again, seniority permitting : it is your choice where, when and what you fly.

If you don’t think this if a fit system then don’t f$&&(*& join and THEN bitch about it, you don’t even need to interview with Qantas if you don’t choose!
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Old 17th May 2018, 01:34
  #1462 (permalink)  
Keg

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Originally Posted by cessnapete View Post
How does an A330 S/O (Cruise only Co-Pilot?) get more pay than a B737 F/O? The 737 pilot is part of the 2 man operating crew at all stages of the flight, makes operational decisions, is qualified for T/Os and landings during route flying, and takes over from Capt if incapacitated etc.
When the 767 F/Os were demoted to the A380 they took a 4% hit on the hourly rate and picked up about 30% overtime for a big pay rise. It has always been thus. When I became a 767 F/O in Ď97 i was earning in the vicinity of 1/3 less than my colleagues who remained as 744 S/Os.

Improvements since then have dramatically decreased the chances of this happening but keep in mind QF have a 12 Year scale so the numbers become distorted quite quickly when a large swathe of your workforce has had little opportunity for promotion from 2009- 2016. Certainly the new S/Os on years 1 and 2 pay arenít earning more than a 737 F/O. Those employed in August 16 are only max of year three pay and would be unlikely to as well even if theyíre on the A380.

So if QF want to keep their S/O pay down the key is to be promoting people to F/O and Captain more quickly. Something they didnít realise when they made movement to JQ prohibitively difficult.
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Old 17th May 2018, 02:15
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I’d also say that the those high salary’s for SO’s will more than likey be a thing of the past for most new joiners now. The 744 is being retired and the A380 would be full, especially now that the 744 looks like it will RIN in some form, and the change in the flying program for that type. Those that choose to stay on the A380 (if they can survive the RIN), will hold onto all the positions available with very little numbers leaving the gravy train. So I’d suspect that people choosing the 737 will increase, as it will really be the only option available.
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Old 17th May 2018, 03:23
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Originally Posted by ADawg View Post
Remember the literature stated "we don't hire second officers, we hire future captains"

I guess QF never thought to define "future" lol

10 years is a long time for anything.

Good luck to them - you should always run your own race in this world.
Future is 20 years plus, widebody east coast is 25 plus.
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Old 17th May 2018, 03:47
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron View Post

They donít. As such, the rest of your post is irrelevant.

As has been outlined earlier in the thread 737 F/Oís are making $200-240K
with an hourly rate of $196.60 i assume the above wage includes allowances and flying 90 hours a month?
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Old 17th May 2018, 03:55
  #1466 (permalink)  
 
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Dragon Man

No, those numbers are correct for about 75hrs and don’t include allowances. There are 13 bidperiods per year.

Last edited by SandyPalms; 17th May 2018 at 12:04.
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Old 17th May 2018, 04:04
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<div style="text-align:left;">Thanks</div>
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Old 17th May 2018, 07:17
  #1468 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by donpizmeov View Post
I will never understand why some pilots will be upset that others get paid more than themselves. No wonder this industry is in a downward spiral .
And I can't believe that some people on this thread call themselves Pilot's (and QF pilots to boot). Bloody disgraceful.
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Old 17th May 2018, 07:58
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No wonder most of Virgin have their applications in then
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Old 18th May 2018, 04:02
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Originally Posted by cessnapete View Post
The Cruise only pilot has no defined part in the aircraft operation, no Normal ,Abnormal or Emergency Checklist procedures involve a third man. Presumably if any in flight emergencies occur with the Capt in rest, he is immediately called, and retakes the front seat with the trained F/O, and the S/O again becomes an observer.
If the S/O is in the seat when the proverbial happens, then he completes whatever checklist/ECAM/EICAS actions are necessary with the other pilot, whether he is the Captain or an FO. The bloke who is off duty may be called back, or he may not, but if I arrive back on the cockpit I expect the procedures to be complete.

And, having had major event when operating 3 man, the SO made himself extremely useful whilst carrying out the jobs that you dismiss.
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Old 18th May 2018, 07:00
  #1471 (permalink)  
 
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Hello

Hii friends nice topic
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Old 18th May 2018, 23:15
  #1472 (permalink)  
 
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haha, love how angry you are
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Old 21st May 2018, 07:33
  #1473 (permalink)  
 
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Is this the right place to ask, how long do you have to wait to hear back after qlink have done a reference check....
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Old 22nd May 2018, 14:09
  #1474 (permalink)  
 
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Spent years in GA in Aus and PNG, 1.5 years flying regionals in USA and currently flying the A321 in Europe. I am wanting to come back to Aus with my family eventually and so considering either going to China first or coming back sooner.

If one were to join QF tomorrow, what progression and ballpark salaries could be expected over the next 3-5 years assuming the market remained the same? If not wanting to stay an SO forever, whatís the current time to FO and then Captain if you are happy to move to junior base/fleet as required?

Thanks
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Old 22nd May 2018, 15:44
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Originally Posted by FL240 View Post
Spent years in GA in Aus and PNG, 1.5 years flying regionals in USA and currently flying the A321 in Europe. I am wanting to come back to Aus with my family eventually and so considering either going to China first or coming back sooner.

If one were to join QF tomorrow, what progression and ballpark salaries could be expected over the next 3-5 years assuming the market remained the same? If not wanting to stay an SO forever, whatís the current time to FO and then Captain if you are happy to move to junior base/fleet as required?

Thanks
Others may have more accurate figures but I would suggest Perth 737 F/O within 12 months (or potentially sooner after joining for those with jet experience) at AU$170-200K plus Superannuation.

Progression to widebody F/O or narrowbody CMD after that could take a lot of years (could be 12-15+), unless QF rapidly expand their fleet, which they are currently not showing any signs of doing.

Movement to East Coast 737 F/O possible after a couple of years depending on movement and recruitment.

Things have improved recently but we currently have guys who joined the airline single and are now missing their kidís 16th birthday because theyíre doing their final F/O check on a widebody.
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Old 22nd May 2018, 21:55
  #1476 (permalink)  
 
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Whilst there are people who will get FO slots almost immediately, they will then spend a long time in that seat.

Assuming the airline neither expands nor contracts, then the average time in each seat will be related to the proportion of pilots in each rank. So, as it is probably roughly 33% each, then the average career would be one third in each seat. So, I'd suggest that the 12 year SO is very much the average...and the 7 year wide body Captains are very much ancient history/mythology at this point.

The uneven recruitment has built lots of bumps into that though, and the people who joined in the expansion of around 1985 are hitting retirement age.
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Old 22nd May 2018, 22:00
  #1477 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Derfred View Post


Others may have more accurate figures but I would suggest Perth 737 F/O within 12 months (or potentially sooner after joining for those with jet experience) at AU$170-200K plus Superannuation.

Progression to widebody F/O or narrowbody CMD after that could take a lot of years (could be 12-15+), unless QF rapidly expand their fleet, which they are currently not showing any signs of doing.

Movement to East Coast 737 F/O possible after a couple of years depending on movement and recruitment.

Things have improved recently but we currently have guys who joined the airline single and are now missing their kidís 16th birthday because theyíre doing their final F/O check on a widebody.
Cheers, good to have an idea so we can discuss where to from here
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Old 22nd May 2018, 22:05
  #1478 (permalink)  
34R
 
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Whilst time to FO on a widebody will never be quick, I'm not sure looking at those recently promoted and comparing time frames is entirely useful.

16+ years encompassing a period of no recruitment for nearly 8 years wouldn't have helped.

It will be interesting to see time to promotion time frames in 5 years when the suggested attrition rates are expected to begin to bite....
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Old 22nd May 2018, 22:45
  #1479 (permalink)  
 
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Consider also that the number of retirements over the next ten years will be far greater than the last ten. There are still a number of pilots going to 65 (and beyond) but according to recent figures I saw, the average retirement age has been around 62 - and there are many reaching that age in the next ten years. The demise of the 744 may well accelerate that further.

I'd be interested to see a breakdown of Pilot's ages at the minute. I suspect there'd be say 40% in the 50+ bracket, 40% in the 35-50 bracket and only a relative few in the under 35 bracket. That suggests that a young person (say 25-early 30's) joining now may have a longish period in the S/O and junior F/O (ie: PER or ADL based) ranks, not long in the middle and a good period as a Captain.
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Old 23rd May 2018, 08:04
  #1480 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 34R View Post
Whilst time to FO on a widebody will never be quick, I'm not sure looking at those recently promoted and comparing time frames is entirely useful.

16+ years encompassing a period of no recruitment for nearly 8 years wouldn't have helped.

It will be interesting to see time to promotion time frames in 5 years when the suggested attrition rates are expected to begin to bite....
34R
Long way to relocate, but in UK, my Airline in last couple of years recruiting DEP F/O direct on A380/B744/787/777. Wide Body F/O from day one!!
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