Qantas 787 recruitment for cadetship
Dragon: great question.
The 787 EBA is about lowering the opportunity to make over time.
The 787-9 and the 777-X if they get them, will do the long haul and ultra long haul flying, and you watch, the A380 and the last of the 747's will be re deployed to the Asian routes (medium to short haul) thereby nullifying all overtime.
The 787 EBA is about lowering the opportunity to make over time.
The 787-9 and the 777-X if they get them, will do the long haul and ultra long haul flying, and you watch, the A380 and the last of the 747's will be re deployed to the Asian routes (medium to short haul) thereby nullifying all overtime.
So, if I'm correct how are they going to allocate who to what aircraft? Anyone got some thoughts?
I guess if they need 10 bodies to start on a day to crew whatever plane they'll pull the next ten out of the hat (or the hold pool). I don't think "I want to wait for a bigger aircraft" is going to elicit a positive response.
When the team at the top decides what planes they are going to fly on what routes I'd be amazed if they considered the overtime payments going to the 4 pilots.
If they feel they can fill 500 seats to a destination at a particular time of day then the 380 will fly it. They won't put a 250 seat aircraft on the route just to save a few thousand dollars.
Equally they won't stuff 500 seats into a market that can't support it or desires frequency rather than pure capacity (Asia) just to avoid overtime.
I think there are much bigger issues which determine which aircraft will fly where, than overtime. I doubt we are as important as we might think we are.
Regarding who gets allocated to which aircraft, in the past they have allocated new entrants on the same day based on how many hours they had on starting. I've seen them start crew a day early or late just so as to have them allocated to the aircraft they want if the hours wouldn't have achieved the desired outcome.
If they feel they can fill 500 seats to a destination at a particular time of day then the 380 will fly it. They won't put a 250 seat aircraft on the route just to save a few thousand dollars.
Equally they won't stuff 500 seats into a market that can't support it or desires frequency rather than pure capacity (Asia) just to avoid overtime.
I think there are much bigger issues which determine which aircraft will fly where, than overtime. I doubt we are as important as we might think we are.
Regarding who gets allocated to which aircraft, in the past they have allocated new entrants on the same day based on how many hours they had on starting. I've seen them start crew a day early or late just so as to have them allocated to the aircraft they want if the hours wouldn't have achieved the desired outcome.
Nunc est bibendum
Yeah. We still didn't solve the day 1 lottery if we recruit some to the 330, the next month to the 380 and then the month after to the 787 followed by another 380 course.
Nunc est bibendum
The practicalities of that when a S/O has been checked out for 6 months on the 787 and S/Os are required on the A380 is going to behold. It's got double training and inefficiency written all over it.
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Prior to recruitment from outside the group , open up to JQ , plenty of Airbus experience with training required to 330/380 , even 787 by the time the QF airframes arrive. Recruit into JQ and save the retraining. Additional required , off the street.
I'd love to see opportunities open up across the group.
Unfortunately pilot groups aren't that progressive. Management teams would prefer a new hire off the street verse the consequential training.
Unfortunately pilot groups aren't that progressive. Management teams would prefer a new hire off the street verse the consequential training.
What about the MOU?
I'm no expert on that because it doesn't really affect me but I'd assume that the JQ guys could use it to come over?
It wouldn't be attractive to some but the more senior guys could use it to go over to QF if there was an attractive slot to take?
I'm no expert on that because it doesn't really affect me but I'd assume that the JQ guys could use it to come over?
It wouldn't be attractive to some but the more senior guys could use it to go over to QF if there was an attractive slot to take?
Also I don't think QF thought it through enough but the award is still there and there is nothing that requires QF to put all new hires on the 787.
Word has it that they'll require SO's this year and they will go to existing types.
Word has it that they'll require SO's this year and they will go to existing types.
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Wingspar, the MOU is based on group seniority starting in 2004.
MOU seniority numbers in Qantas (~2004) are not senior enough for widebody FO, whereas all eligible JQ Pilots (former Impulse pilots, <2004) are Captains, mostly on the 787.
This 'one-sidedness' is purely a result of rapid expansion in one carrier, and stagnation in the other.
MOU seniority numbers in Qantas (~2004) are not senior enough for widebody FO, whereas all eligible JQ Pilots (former Impulse pilots, <2004) are Captains, mostly on the 787.
This 'one-sidedness' is purely a result of rapid expansion in one carrier, and stagnation in the other.
Prior to recruitment from outside the group , open up to JQ , plenty of Airbus experience with training required to 330/380 , even 787 by the time the QF airframes arrive. Recruit into JQ and save the retraining. Additional required , off the street.
Thing is, S/O's only get a Co-Pilot, or now 'Cruise Pilot' (or some such), Rating.
In comparison to a Command endorsement the training is reduced somewhat, so it doesn't matter where you come from (i.e. 320 or 787 qualified), in most (no, probably all according to CAsA) instances you'd probably still be required to do the same training anyway.
Additionally, in any JQ to QF LWOP agreement (for clarification, thats LWOP NOT associated with the MOU) you'd still be joining at the bottom of the Seniority list (just like the QF S/O's did when they went across to JQ). If you want to come across, chuck in an application and have a crack. The end result is almost the same as what you are saying, only JQ entrants would have to resign rather than keep their seniority in JQ.
The only issue is that by the sounds of what ROH111 has posted, the rumour I posted earlier of a shortage on your side of the fence is not unfounded. Would there perhaps be a 'Gentlemens' agreement to prevent QF from giving you the nod and causing further red faces over there?
Thing is, S/O's only get a Co-Pilot, or now 'Cruise Pilot' (or some such), Rating.
In comparison to a Command endorsement the training is reduced somewhat, so it doesn't matter where you come from (i.e. 320 or 787 qualified), in most (no, probably all according to CAsA) instances you'd probably still be required to do the same training anyway
In comparison to a Command endorsement the training is reduced somewhat, so it doesn't matter where you come from (i.e. 320 or 787 qualified), in most (no, probably all according to CAsA) instances you'd probably still be required to do the same training anyway
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It would have to be a "ladies agreement" given the current JQ Chief Pilot and head of QF recruiting are certainly not gentleman.....
I would encourage all group pilots to apply if they are interested.
A potential employer can't discriminate based on your previous employment. Ie, in this case, a suitably qualified and experienced pilot from JQ or Qlink has to be considered on the same merits as one from Rex or Alliance.
I would encourage all group pilots to apply if they are interested.
A potential employer can't discriminate based on your previous employment. Ie, in this case, a suitably qualified and experienced pilot from JQ or Qlink has to be considered on the same merits as one from Rex or Alliance.
I'd be quite concerned if a QF group pilot didn't get into mainline.
After all, they are considered safe to fly multi million dollar aircraft in other parts of the group doing the same job.
Hopefully their previous service will count towards long service leave and staff travel
After all, they are considered safe to fly multi million dollar aircraft in other parts of the group doing the same job.
Hopefully their previous service will count towards long service leave and staff travel
Goblin
QF pilots have been asking for a group opportunity list for eleven and a half years. There has been no appetite for it from any of the stakeholders with anything to lose. I can't see that changing.
Have a chat to the Ansett 737 contractors about your last point.
QF pilots have been asking for a group opportunity list for eleven and a half years. There has been no appetite for it from any of the stakeholders with anything to lose. I can't see that changing.
Have a chat to the Ansett 737 contractors about your last point.
Last edited by Fatguyinalittlecoat; 8th Jan 2016 at 14:16.
start shaving those beards boys