300 Qantas pilots to get the chop ???
AIPA is in my opinion in deep poo. When approx. 60 % ( a guess) of Qantas long haul members are likely to lose 30% of their take home pay due to the RIN then IMO one of the first places that they will tighten their belts is with AIPA membership.
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On another forum you will see some distinct cracks forming in the QF pilot solidarity front.
Looks like AIPA might be spending more and more time holding their own line together. Just what the Company wants!
Looks like AIPA might be spending more and more time holding their own line together. Just what the Company wants!
The company are painting us in a corner with vague interpretations and misleading information (think Q14 Q&A RIN, it's purely a loaded and antagonistic Q&A to get a response) to force us to run off to FWA and do their dirty work for them (the company don't want to be seen as the ones to lodge the grievance to FWA, they want to be seen as the victim). The more individual grievances presented on a fractured front to FWA will just highlight the companies position that the current WD is unworkable and how costly this RIN process will be. Ultimately FWA will consider the viability and the financial strain placed upon the employer so there will be more chance that the pendulum will swing well and truly to the companies favour and then we can kiss goodbye any opportunity to negotiate from our current base (present WD) for efficiencies for offsets in the future.
Don't forget the company already have a blueprint of an award that they would like us to adopt, and the front cover is coloured Orange and Silver, we have been seeing it coming for a while but I think it's now at our door.
Lets not jump the gun and remove our elected representatives from the table, lets not rush off to FWA, let's stay in the game.
Don't play into the companies hands.
Last edited by Stalins ugly Brother; 21st Jun 2014 at 10:02.
CS
Angryrat
Good news, Angryrat. As of last Monday the count was definitely 30. It is entirely probable that by 1700 Friday the count would be 40+.
I'm surprised that some office wallah wasn't detailed to broadcast the final numbers at 1701 Friday by one of the many available channels. While it matters not at all to those taking the VR, the headcount sure matters to those worrying about their longhaul future, such as yourself. Another unnecessary weekend of worry. Just because some nine to fiver thinks that Monday morning is a continuation of Friday afternoon. Unacceptable in today's 24/7 world.
expressions of interest closed this arvo at 5pm. latest I heard was in the low twenties
Thanks CS. Was hoping for more like 30-40. Looks like 15 years will get me a back seat
I'm surprised that some office wallah wasn't detailed to broadcast the final numbers at 1701 Friday by one of the many available channels. While it matters not at all to those taking the VR, the headcount sure matters to those worrying about their longhaul future, such as yourself. Another unnecessary weekend of worry. Just because some nine to fiver thinks that Monday morning is a continuation of Friday afternoon. Unacceptable in today's 24/7 world.
My info is from a closer source than AIPA and I'm satisfied it was correct at that time. I know of one withdrawal during the week. I also know of more than one addition.
The point is - why are we all still guessing and why were approximate 'yet to be finally confirmed' numbers not released Friday? Not names and not final dates, which still need some fine tuning next week.
The point is - why are we all still guessing and why were approximate 'yet to be finally confirmed' numbers not released Friday? Not names and not final dates, which still need some fine tuning next week.
To the protagonists who are in raptures with the thought of AIPA's possible demise.....you haven't worked it out yet have you.
If and possibly when and or AIPA is defeated to the levels you want, QF IR will reload the gun and take on the next in the queue. There is no end game.
So to the AFAP members, JPC members, members of the essendon footy club, members of the royal family, members of whatever organisation you think or want to have represent you....please consider!
If and possibly when and or AIPA is defeated to the levels you want, QF IR will reload the gun and take on the next in the queue. There is no end game.
So to the AFAP members, JPC members, members of the essendon footy club, members of the royal family, members of whatever organisation you think or want to have represent you....please consider!
Tuner 2, you say,
If the AFAP is so great then why was VIPA formed and and why did it take hundreds and hundreds of VA members? If AIPA is so anti Jetstar pilots why does it still have hundreds of JQ members? Yeah, so the AFAP advertises the MBF as a big reason to join, we don't hear so much about the amazing industrial results like losing legal challenges to destroy MOU agreements made well before self-interested pilots even joined JQ, do we?
One would have thought that as AFAP is representing JETSTAR PILOTS then there is no other interest than self interest in Jetstar. They cannot save the world from climate change nor is it their brief to wipe your backside
If the AFAP is so great then why was VIPA formed and and why did it take hundreds and hundreds of VA members? If AIPA is so anti Jetstar pilots why does it still have hundreds of JQ members? Yeah, so the AFAP advertises the MBF as a big reason to join, we don't hear so much about the amazing industrial results like losing legal challenges to destroy MOU agreements made well before self-interested pilots even joined JQ, do we?
One would have thought that as AFAP is representing JETSTAR PILOTS then there is no other interest than self interest in Jetstar. They cannot save the world from climate change nor is it their brief to wipe your backside
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Banjo, yes, indeed, I couldn't agree more. My post was really a response to those saying "there already is one pilot union in Australia - the AFAP" - yet the AFAP with reference to JQ really just set out to 'tear up' (or at least, seriously water-down) an MOU signed by themselves back in 2004. Thus my point was that perhaps there really isn't "one pilot union for all" so long as we have the supposed 'original and one union for all' acting that way.
They love sticking their nose in where it isnt wanted too. How are the AFAP meant to represent VARA and VAA, particularly if it came to integration (and conflicting interests) down the track. VARA have a perfectly good Association structure as it is. 
Complete thread drift I know. I can say though that as long as there are multiple Union structures across the Qantas Group then self interest will always win out. Managements wet dream.
Complete thread drift I know. I can say though that as long as there are multiple Union structures across the Qantas Group then self interest will always win out. Managements wet dream.
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Surely with the industry completely FD in this country at present, perhaps each union could lay down arms and find a common good to fight for? I'm sure the members of each want that, perhaps it's the upper echelon of each union that have self serving interests...
Just sayin...
Fuel-Off
D in this country at present, perhaps each union could lay down arms and find a common good to fight for? I'm sure the members of each want that, perhaps it's the upper echelon of each union that have self serving interests...Just sayin...
Fuel-Off
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What a great idea, fuel off...
It would require some pretty massive leadership from a few people...as well some serious compromises on a couple of issues. Possible? Yes. Likely? Probably not. Hope I'm proved wrong by someone.
It would require some pretty massive leadership from a few people...as well some serious compromises on a couple of issues. Possible? Yes. Likely? Probably not. Hope I'm proved wrong by someone.
Nunc est bibendum
The point is - why are we all still guessing and why were approximate 'yet to be finally confirmed' numbers not released Friday? Not names and not final dates, which still need some fine tuning next week.
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Would everyone just settle down.
Having read some qrewroom posts of late, especially some complaining anout their loss of displacement rights etc.. People need to chill out.
All this "Reduction In Numbers " exercise is: Alan's creative way to go to fair work and say.. We as a company are losing millions. As a result of Qf practices, this is the RIN process, and this is the 100 million dollar pricetag.
Fair Work will say; "We'll, that is insane! How do you think you should let pilots go..
How that is done, is everyones guess.
As for QF pilots being made CR and moving to JQ on QF pay and conditions : You will find JQ's doors will be closed the same week you are made CR.
Having read some qrewroom posts of late, especially some complaining anout their loss of displacement rights etc.. People need to chill out.
All this "Reduction In Numbers " exercise is: Alan's creative way to go to fair work and say.. We as a company are losing millions. As a result of Qf practices, this is the RIN process, and this is the 100 million dollar pricetag.
Fair Work will say; "We'll, that is insane! How do you think you should let pilots go..
How that is done, is everyones guess.
As for QF pilots being made CR and moving to JQ on QF pay and conditions : You will find JQ's doors will be closed the same week you are made CR.
Fair Work will say; "We'll, that is insane! How do you think you should let pilots go.
Fair Work are much more likely to say 'this process was part of your log of claims, remember? The one that smacked down on to our doormat that we had to arbitrate. Get your own house in order. Suck it up'.
Don't expect it next week either. The wallah I spoke of refused to even give an indication of how many captains had put in an EOI.
Last edited by Captain Gidday; 21st Jun 2014 at 23:10.
Nunc est bibendum
I agree with Captain Gidday. FWA handed down this WD less than 2 years ago. I can't see them likely to trash their own handiwork so quickly.
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Originally Posted by keg
I agree with Captain Gidday. FWA handed down this WD less than 2 years ago. I can't see them likely to trash their own handiwork so quickly.
"Never let a [self generated] crisis go to waste"! Expect the "we would follow the rules, but it will bankrupt us" argument to be the sole "extraordinary circumstances".
Entirely engineered to fail, which leads to cynphil:
Originally Posted by cynphil
I wouldn't be to quick to assume they won't throw out the baby with the bath water....with reference the WD....Remember the outcome of the Jetconnect inquiry!!!
The trick will be to create a very time sensitive imperative in an attempt to rush the inquiry through with unseamly haste. Slowing the process & concentrating on how we got here is the best strategy for pilots affected. This is not a lay down Misère for Alan.
