300 Qantas pilots to get the chop ???
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FBN,
How about some of these fat pig snout in the trough executives start leading by example and trimming their remuneration by about 30-50% in line with other airline executives! then we will talk.
Until then F#%k off!
How about some of these fat pig snout in the trough executives start leading by example and trimming their remuneration by about 30-50% in line with other airline executives! then we will talk.
Until then F#%k off!
Flyboat North.
Ever seen how you ring bark a tree? You can slowly chop around until it dies a slow death.
That is what Alan has done. The economies of scale have been reduced to this point, where there are now massive inefficiencies because people aren't flying.
Never before has qantas posted such poor results when everyone was flying a far greater network that you have now.
And to make matters worse, he is accelerating the process in the domestic network. He will never learn.
Example, how many times are jetstar aircraft operated within ten minutes of a qantas aircraft?
Lets research that one.
Its destroying yield in both entities.
Back to international,Brand new 787s operating sectors less than half full. A great return on investment. Have you compared their salaries to the equivalent in Qantas, i.e. 330 rates. You may be surprised or be calling for large scale wage decreases in that organisation as well to support your arguments.
The business strategy is wrong. People have had a choice, and they are flooding away internationally and domestically because what Alan and the board are serving up has left a bitter taste in their mouths.
Yet they continue.
Ever seen how you ring bark a tree? You can slowly chop around until it dies a slow death.
That is what Alan has done. The economies of scale have been reduced to this point, where there are now massive inefficiencies because people aren't flying.
Never before has qantas posted such poor results when everyone was flying a far greater network that you have now.
And to make matters worse, he is accelerating the process in the domestic network. He will never learn.
Example, how many times are jetstar aircraft operated within ten minutes of a qantas aircraft?
Lets research that one.
Its destroying yield in both entities.
Back to international,Brand new 787s operating sectors less than half full. A great return on investment. Have you compared their salaries to the equivalent in Qantas, i.e. 330 rates. You may be surprised or be calling for large scale wage decreases in that organisation as well to support your arguments.
The business strategy is wrong. People have had a choice, and they are flooding away internationally and domestically because what Alan and the board are serving up has left a bitter taste in their mouths.
Yet they continue.
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Yes I have compared the Jetstar V Qantas pilots wages
At Jetstar an FO on the 330 who absolutely pushes for all overtime will sometimes crack $200K as compared to the QF FO less flying and with a little overtime reaching $300K
The QF guys on the 330 are miles in front of the Jetstar guys on every metric wages, rosters, always having an SO tagging along, allowances etc etc etc
And really on forums such as this the QF guys have sneered at and taunted the Jetstar guys for a decade - telling them they are on "sh*t money" etc etc
At Jetstar an FO on the 330 who absolutely pushes for all overtime will sometimes crack $200K as compared to the QF FO less flying and with a little overtime reaching $300K
The QF guys on the 330 are miles in front of the Jetstar guys on every metric wages, rosters, always having an SO tagging along, allowances etc etc etc
And really on forums such as this the QF guys have sneered at and taunted the Jetstar guys for a decade - telling them they are on "sh*t money" etc etc
Flyboat-----you are so full of crap you must be able to taste it by now?
As a CX Capt I earn roughly the same as my QF counterpart. According to my JQ mates on the 330 they earn similar as well. Tiger LCC Captains earn good coin now as well as do the 777 guys at Virgin.
QF ain't that far ahead anymore, yes a little ahead but not enough to bankrupt the Airline.
Now Alan earns a truckload more than my CEO, how's about we start from the very top then?
A little research and you would know that.
Now sod off Alan stop **** stirring just for the fun of it and take Livvy with you.
Oh, and try telling the passengers on QF 32 that the Captain and crew are paid too much...
As a CX Capt I earn roughly the same as my QF counterpart. According to my JQ mates on the 330 they earn similar as well. Tiger LCC Captains earn good coin now as well as do the 777 guys at Virgin.
QF ain't that far ahead anymore, yes a little ahead but not enough to bankrupt the Airline.
Now Alan earns a truckload more than my CEO, how's about we start from the very top then?
A little research and you would know that.
Now sod off Alan stop **** stirring just for the fun of it and take Livvy with you.
Oh, and try telling the passengers on QF 32 that the Captain and crew are paid too much...
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Wow I am just so intimidated by your personal abuse, it really
says a lot about where you are intellectually.
Nobody here can win this argument on the numbers and on the facts.
Fact One: BA 747 Captains clear $165K QF 747 Captains clear $240K
You are paid 50% more
Fact Two: Average QF 330 FO salaries are $300K , average Jetstar 330 FO
salaries are $200K
You are paid 50% more
We could go on and on stating verifiable data , airline after airline from the developed world , but what was that phrase "there is nobody as blind as those who refuse to see" (feel free to correct)
For you guys it is always "da management" "da management" and no "respect" , there is no "respect" - it gets repeated like bad re-runs of America's Hardest Prisons
says a lot about where you are intellectually.
Nobody here can win this argument on the numbers and on the facts.
Fact One: BA 747 Captains clear $165K QF 747 Captains clear $240K
You are paid 50% more
Fact Two: Average QF 330 FO salaries are $300K , average Jetstar 330 FO
salaries are $200K
You are paid 50% more
We could go on and on stating verifiable data , airline after airline from the developed world , but what was that phrase "there is nobody as blind as those who refuse to see" (feel free to correct)
For you guys it is always "da management" "da management" and no "respect" , there is no "respect" - it gets repeated like bad re-runs of America's Hardest Prisons
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At Jetstar an FO on the 330 who absolutely pushes for all overtime will sometimes crack $200K as compared to the QF FO less flying and with a little overtime reaching $300K
I can tell you right now your research is well off the mark and your already tattered integrity is now well and truly shattered. I also noticed you conveniently left out mentioning BAs pension fund when comparing salaries, if you are going to compare, compare whole packages, it just makes you look more incompetent.
I don't understand why low breeds like you jump on forums like this and sprout this BS when we at the coal face know exactly how much our other colleagues earn?
Your simply an idiot. Take your lack of integrity and go back to your dormitory and keep on dreaming of that Diploma of business management 101 and leave the discussion to the ones in the know.
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I am a Captain on the 330, I only just crack $300K.
(all allowances included)
F/Os are on 65% of my pay rate so I cannot see how FBNs figures can be even close.
Regarding BA figures, perhaps he doesn't know there is a difference between £ and $??
His "Facts" are not, in fact, anything like facts!
(all allowances included)F/Os are on 65% of my pay rate so I cannot see how FBNs figures can be even close.
Regarding BA figures, perhaps he doesn't know there is a difference between £ and $??
His "Facts" are not, in fact, anything like facts!
For goodness sakes guys.
A380 Capt $380+, F/O $270+, S/O 220+
A330 Capt $300+, F/O $200+, S/O 140+
It's basic maths when you multiply 160 hrs x Pay Rate X 6.5 bid periods (approx 40 hrs O'Time for S/O's on A380 per bid period, a bit less for Capt's and F/O's). Add on training stuff (sim's, EP's and the like) and allowances ($15K ish) and Super. This is how you get to the above figures.
Obviously some will earn more if they are senior enough to get the high overtime trips, and some will earn more if they chase extra flying.
737 Captains earn about $220K at the minimum, and if they work their backsides off $300K+
Flyboat, you have no idea.
A380 Capt $380+, F/O $270+, S/O 220+
A330 Capt $300+, F/O $200+, S/O 140+
It's basic maths when you multiply 160 hrs x Pay Rate X 6.5 bid periods (approx 40 hrs O'Time for S/O's on A380 per bid period, a bit less for Capt's and F/O's). Add on training stuff (sim's, EP's and the like) and allowances ($15K ish) and Super. This is how you get to the above figures.
Obviously some will earn more if they are senior enough to get the high overtime trips, and some will earn more if they chase extra flying.
737 Captains earn about $220K at the minimum, and if they work their backsides off $300K+
Flyboat, you have no idea.
I'm a 747 Captain. Gross last year no allowances $331,000. So if you can show me a 330 FO earning $300,000 in Qantas il eat my hat. Admit your wrong then piss off.
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TE: So what you are suggesting is that an FO on the 330 is earning the same as an SO on the A380
I have one thing to say - "NO BALL"
Remember it was your own man Barry Jackson , who told a radio interviewer back in 2011 that A380 Capts were "only" averaging $415K pa
I have one thing to say - "NO BALL"
Remember it was your own man Barry Jackson , who told a radio interviewer back in 2011 that A380 Capts were "only" averaging $415K pa
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average Jetstar 330 FO salaries are $200K
my group cert says otherwise by some margin, and i've worked my share. you could prolly nudge it if you gave it a go, but average it aint.
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yes Waren I know the number is a tad high , realistically the Jetstar 330 average would be $175K , to get to $200k would require a shed load of OT
Really only makes the differential higher, just take a look at the base wage data Jetstar 330 FO $120K (approx) Qantas 330 FO - $190K (approx)
So whether you are looking at base data , or average total it is really just ducks and drakes, whatever way you look at it the Qantas 330 guys earn 50% more.
Just like the Qantas 747 pilots earn 50% more than than BA 747
What btw is the overnight allowance for Jetstar pilots in Japan ?
Really only makes the differential higher, just take a look at the base wage data Jetstar 330 FO $120K (approx) Qantas 330 FO - $190K (approx)
So whether you are looking at base data , or average total it is really just ducks and drakes, whatever way you look at it the Qantas 330 guys earn 50% more.
Just like the Qantas 747 pilots earn 50% more than than BA 747
What btw is the overnight allowance for Jetstar pilots in Japan ?
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Tailwheel,
It is not about a difference of opinion.
FBN is just being immature, abusive and a troll.
Maybe in the decades to come he will reflect on his shortcomings .. maybe not, but in the meantime he needs to be given his own solo sandbox.
I am so happy he is on my ignore list.
N
It is not about a difference of opinion.
FBN is just being immature, abusive and a troll.
Maybe in the decades to come he will reflect on his shortcomings .. maybe not, but in the meantime he needs to be given his own solo sandbox.
I am so happy he is on my ignore list.
N
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i'm not arguing against your principle but if youre gonna throw numbers around they need to be there or thereabouts. i dont know what the japan allowances are but i believe the contract is a matter of public record.
and i've said this bit before…
i had the jq cp on the flightdeck once a couple years ago and qf wages come up. regarding the 330 operation he made the point that for the jq sched as it was then, they ran both contracts in parallel thru the computer and the qf come out about a third dearer.
he said it was mostly down to the myriad of conditions that went with them, not just the higher base pay.
something i think aipa have offered to come to the table about and got roundly told to f off.
and i've said this bit before…
i had the jq cp on the flightdeck once a couple years ago and qf wages come up. regarding the 330 operation he made the point that for the jq sched as it was then, they ran both contracts in parallel thru the computer and the qf come out about a third dearer.
he said it was mostly down to the myriad of conditions that went with them, not just the higher base pay.
something i think aipa have offered to come to the table about and got roundly told to f off.
Last edited by waren9; 28th May 2014 at 08:21.
Nowhere can it be seen that Barry Jackson made that comment....What is this guy smoking? A troll and typical of discussion these days. If I can do it cheaper I will get the job. What a ********! If pilot groups in Aus got together then Flyboat North would realise that Jetstar Captains are earning over $400K. I agree with noip because in ten years time old Flyboat North will look stupid(if not already). Remember the job you undercut today will be yours in 10 years time, think about it.
To quote News.com.au from 2011, this was the statement:
"The highest paid captain of an A380 gets $536,000 - an increase of more than $40,000 on last year - and the average A380 captain's wage is only $415,000. AIPA president Captain Barry Jackson said Qantas pilots' pay was around the middle of international rates and far less than CEO Alan Joyce's $5 million pay packet."
The above quote was attributed to 'leaked' AIPA documents.
On the subject of AJ's CEO package I note with interest a financial times article that states:
"The American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organisations found CEOs in the Fortune 500 made an average 380 times the average worker’s pay in 2011"
So on this measure if AJ earns $5,000,000 then the average worker would earn around $13,500. There is a lot of talk on here that the Qantas CEO gets paid way to much, but it would seem on the world scale of CEO pay packets his is actually quite low in comparison to other big companies.
"The highest paid captain of an A380 gets $536,000 - an increase of more than $40,000 on last year - and the average A380 captain's wage is only $415,000. AIPA president Captain Barry Jackson said Qantas pilots' pay was around the middle of international rates and far less than CEO Alan Joyce's $5 million pay packet."
The above quote was attributed to 'leaked' AIPA documents.
On the subject of AJ's CEO package I note with interest a financial times article that states:
"The American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organisations found CEOs in the Fortune 500 made an average 380 times the average worker’s pay in 2011"
So on this measure if AJ earns $5,000,000 then the average worker would earn around $13,500. There is a lot of talk on here that the Qantas CEO gets paid way to much, but it would seem on the world scale of CEO pay packets his is actually quite low in comparison to other big companies.