The way we were - Ansett, TAA, Qantas
Or F**** O"G**** blowing the hapless cyclist over at Rottnest Island?
Join Date: May 2008
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C'mon Rod they were not that bad. Yes, very short range which did cause some problems. Hot as hell in the summer in Queensland and were not designed for Australian operations especially BNE-MSA-DWN.
I still remember the 8 leg days BNE-ROK-MKY-TSV-CNS returns.
We were lucky to go on the B727 at that time.
Hope your enjoying your retirement? Like to catch up sometime.
I still remember the 8 leg days BNE-ROK-MKY-TSV-CNS returns.
We were lucky to go on the B727 at that time.
Hope your enjoying your retirement? Like to catch up sometime.
I have hesitated for some time to post as I did not wish to interrupt or derail these wonderful reminisces, stories and banter. I agree totally that the “way we were” is significantly different to the way we are. My limited exposure, via being a pax, has seen a different culture emerge. Undoubtedly part of the change has been bought about by the tightening of the purse strings by the bean counters which has a significant flow on effect to all parts of the industry, from the baggage handlers to the drivers. It is such a pity that the moral of the workers is not considered by management not only in respect to their “happiness” but also how this impacts on your profit, which is your passengers. The last thing I wish to be confronted by is a surly (probably justifiably so) check in member 
(take this any way you wish too) to an unenthusiastic attendant with a less than welcoming demeanour. Admittedly flying is no longer the privilege of the well-off nor a once or twice in lifetime experience with this becoming more and more just a transport industry and arguably reflective of just being a “bus” but also the type of clientele that have to be dealt with. There is no doubt in my mind that a smile begets a smile which goes onto manners, attitude etc. Now for someone to put up with a less than desirable passenger is more of a “ how much of a percentage is this load made up of undesirables” as opposed to do we have one or two of those on this trip.
Which leads into my next bit. The cultural change is not only due from internal (miss) management but from society itself. It appears to be wholly acceptable to be rude, ignorant and totally unpleasantly demanding in today’s society. Unfortunately this like the “way it was’ will not change due to “if you don’t know what it was like how do you know the way it should be”. How do the new employees have any idea of how the attitude was to help when you could, even if it was the opposition, to the pax not knowing what the standard of travel was when all they have been exposed to is the current standard.
It would appear to me to be a one way street and we can only, those of us that know, whimsically wish for the way it was.
(take this any way you wish too) to an unenthusiastic attendant with a less than welcoming demeanour. Admittedly flying is no longer the privilege of the well-off nor a once or twice in lifetime experience with this becoming more and more just a transport industry and arguably reflective of just being a “bus” but also the type of clientele that have to be dealt with. There is no doubt in my mind that a smile begets a smile which goes onto manners, attitude etc. Now for someone to put up with a less than desirable passenger is more of a “ how much of a percentage is this load made up of undesirables” as opposed to do we have one or two of those on this trip.Which leads into my next bit. The cultural change is not only due from internal (miss) management but from society itself. It appears to be wholly acceptable to be rude, ignorant and totally unpleasantly demanding in today’s society. Unfortunately this like the “way it was’ will not change due to “if you don’t know what it was like how do you know the way it should be”. How do the new employees have any idea of how the attitude was to help when you could, even if it was the opposition, to the pax not knowing what the standard of travel was when all they have been exposed to is the current standard.
It would appear to me to be a one way street and we can only, those of us that know, whimsically wish for the way it was.
finestkind;
I totally agree with your post. Times have changed for Management, worker and also the general public. Perhaps my experience may give a little insight into why I think this has happened.
After many years in aviation, I took a Coach Driving position for almost 10 years. When I started, the vast majority of passengers were regular travellers and the elderley. Mainly, I did the direct route to/from London and the fare was around the 12-15 UK pound mark. I would welcome every passenger on board whilst checking their ticket. If they had baggage, the passenger would place it in the hold themselves (obviously I would do so for those that were unable). All passengers would at least acknowledge you but the vast majority would have some conversational interaction with you.
I ended up having to leave the job due to having to do much more within the job and also having to put up with a rapid decrease in the attitude of the passengers. Why did this happen? Firstly the increased workload. When I started, it was the passengers responsibility to load their luggage. That then changed to still be the passengers responsibility but the driver may assisted if required. Then it was driver would assit and finaly it was the drivers responsibility to load all baggage. This increased the time taken to have all baggage and passengers loaded for the scheduled departure time. The Internet became available so that passengers could get their ticket from home instead of having to physically go to an Agent/Office to buy one. Then the bean counters decided to make ticket costs less by reducing a number of seats a lot cheaper (some down to UK pound 1). Then they decided that they would advertise the trip as a "shuttle" service of 'turn up and ride.' Now we started getting many passengers who turned up without a ticket. Each driver had an 'emergency' ticket book which previously might have been used maybe twice a year at the most. Now, we are faced with up to an average of 15 passengers who we had to write out tickets for and collect the money. Most of these passengers would be expecting to pay the UK pound 1 for their trip even though this was advertsised as only available on the Internet and in advance. Consequently us drivers were having to do much more just prior to departure whilst still trying to get an on-time departure. Our passengers were now having to wait longer for their baggage to be loaded, tickets issued and then being boarded. It doesn't take long now for the 'cultural' change to head in the wrong direction. The drivers are getting more stressed, the passengers are more stressed and the downward spiral continues. It ended up so bad that several drivers were physically assaulted for not giving people the UK pound 1 fares. Few passengers would even acknowledge the driver, let alone converse with him. The regular passengers started going by train and we were left with passengers who wanted the world for nothing and drivers who became totally dis-interested in their job. Yes, I had already had well over 40 years of Customer Service, so should have been able to 'ride the storm,' but I couldn't and shouldn't have had to anyway. I'm retired now and yes, the good old days were much better, pride in your job, respect for your Management and most of all, respect for your customers.
I totally agree with your post. Times have changed for Management, worker and also the general public. Perhaps my experience may give a little insight into why I think this has happened.
After many years in aviation, I took a Coach Driving position for almost 10 years. When I started, the vast majority of passengers were regular travellers and the elderley. Mainly, I did the direct route to/from London and the fare was around the 12-15 UK pound mark. I would welcome every passenger on board whilst checking their ticket. If they had baggage, the passenger would place it in the hold themselves (obviously I would do so for those that were unable). All passengers would at least acknowledge you but the vast majority would have some conversational interaction with you.
I ended up having to leave the job due to having to do much more within the job and also having to put up with a rapid decrease in the attitude of the passengers. Why did this happen? Firstly the increased workload. When I started, it was the passengers responsibility to load their luggage. That then changed to still be the passengers responsibility but the driver may assisted if required. Then it was driver would assit and finaly it was the drivers responsibility to load all baggage. This increased the time taken to have all baggage and passengers loaded for the scheduled departure time. The Internet became available so that passengers could get their ticket from home instead of having to physically go to an Agent/Office to buy one. Then the bean counters decided to make ticket costs less by reducing a number of seats a lot cheaper (some down to UK pound 1). Then they decided that they would advertise the trip as a "shuttle" service of 'turn up and ride.' Now we started getting many passengers who turned up without a ticket. Each driver had an 'emergency' ticket book which previously might have been used maybe twice a year at the most. Now, we are faced with up to an average of 15 passengers who we had to write out tickets for and collect the money. Most of these passengers would be expecting to pay the UK pound 1 for their trip even though this was advertsised as only available on the Internet and in advance. Consequently us drivers were having to do much more just prior to departure whilst still trying to get an on-time departure. Our passengers were now having to wait longer for their baggage to be loaded, tickets issued and then being boarded. It doesn't take long now for the 'cultural' change to head in the wrong direction. The drivers are getting more stressed, the passengers are more stressed and the downward spiral continues. It ended up so bad that several drivers were physically assaulted for not giving people the UK pound 1 fares. Few passengers would even acknowledge the driver, let alone converse with him. The regular passengers started going by train and we were left with passengers who wanted the world for nothing and drivers who became totally dis-interested in their job. Yes, I had already had well over 40 years of Customer Service, so should have been able to 'ride the storm,' but I couldn't and shouldn't have had to anyway. I'm retired now and yes, the good old days were much better, pride in your job, respect for your Management and most of all, respect for your customers.
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Time to breath some life back into this excellent thread.....here is a painting I did recently. Qantas operated B707 aircraft from 1959 to 1979. As a kid of the 60s and 70s in Sydney I remember the teacher having to stop talking while one of these would scream overhead, shaking the school and leaving a carpet of black smoke behind.
(*For art geeks ....it's acrylic on stretched canvas 30cm x 60cm)
[IMG]
[/IMG]
(*For art geeks ....it's acrylic on stretched canvas 30cm x 60cm)
[IMG]
[/IMG]
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Looking forward to returning to Japan soon but in the meantime continuing the never ending search for a bad bottle of Red!
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Very nice Aye Ess!
If you ever have same size prints made of it, please put me down for one.
Come on Dora-9; Let's have the story!
If you ever have same size prints made of it, please put me down for one.
Or F**** O"G**** blowing the hapless cyclist over at Rottnest Island?
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As a kid of the 60s and 70s in Sydney I remember the teacher having to stop talking while one of these would scream overhead, shaking the school and leaving a carpet of black smoke behind.
When I moved to Melbourne to start work as an Apprentice in 1963 I lived at first in a boarding house in Niddrie, to be near the Engine Shop in Keilor Road, my only memory of that place was the building shaking and not being able to hear the TV or anyone talking whenever a DC6 went over on approach to or after taking off from Essendon Airport.
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"whenever a DC6 went over on approach to or after taking off from Essendon Airport."
By pure chance I happened to end up under the DC?3? that was landing at Essendon on I think last Sunday. Very nice seeing it slowly fly around.
By pure chance I happened to end up under the DC?3? that was landing at Essendon on I think last Sunday. Very nice seeing it slowly fly around.
Vale Mike Hayes
For those PPruners who don't follow the Fragrant Harbour forum, I must sadly report that Mike Hayes passed away in the US recently. He flew for MMA in 1967-1968, then Ansett 1968-1988 (Brisbane-based), before going initially to Transcorp in HK and then to Cathay.
Always good company and possessing a devastatingly dry wit, he will be greatly missed...
Always good company and possessing a devastatingly dry wit, he will be greatly missed...
Join Date: Oct 2003
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I joined the same MMA intake.
He was a BIG lad to say the least, a special seat and seat back had to be made to fit him in the DC-3 seat and have room to get under the control column.
Blooddy old age is upon us all.
He was a BIG lad to say the least, a special seat and seat back had to be made to fit him in the DC-3 seat and have room to get under the control column.
Blooddy old age is upon us all.
Yes, Phil - but he was younger than both of us!
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Speaking of those comments concerning...'call me captain', while flying for a rather successful Asian airline many years ago, one of our captains was discussing something in the office with a European secretary. She kept addressing him as "Des", (not his real name). After the Chinese staff had departed from the office, he said to her,"Freda, I think that whilst in the company of the Chinese staff, you should address me as 'Captain'", then he departed. Some time later, by the poolside of one of the many clubs in town - with Chinese waiters milling around - the captain came across Freda and her Scottish magistrate husband, George...She introduced Des to her husband. "Hello, Des"..."Hello George", replies Des. She moves a little closer to him and quietly says, "Des...In the presence of the Chinese staff, I think you should address him as 'Your Worship'"....Fortunately, we didnt have too many pilots like this one...
Last edited by Granpa; 15th Apr 2014 at 06:35. Reason: Placed out of context.
Looks way better then than now! A far cry from today when switching to MEL Ground to be told "hold position, your parking bay is occupied"...20 minutes later....waiting, waiting....
A site you may be interested in
I have recently found the following site;
Aussie Airline Uniforms and Collectibles.
As the title says, it's about Aussie Airlines uniforms but also contains much more information. If you're on this forum you'll probably find something of interest on the site and may even be able to help with questions re uniforms, badges etc. Darren who runs the site, is very approachable and easy to get on with and he's constantly updating the site as new info comes in.
Paul
Aussie Airline Uniforms and Collectibles.
As the title says, it's about Aussie Airlines uniforms but also contains much more information. If you're on this forum you'll probably find something of interest on the site and may even be able to help with questions re uniforms, badges etc. Darren who runs the site, is very approachable and easy to get on with and he's constantly updating the site as new info comes in.
Paul
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To add to this thread about Australian Airlines.
On the subject of days gone by in Aussie Aviation, I have a website dedicated to many of the Airlines referenced in the thread. I have Airline uniforms and nostalgia from the last 4 decades. Check it out at Aussie Airline Uniforms and Collectibles.