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MERGED: Alan's still not happy......

Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

MERGED: Alan's still not happy......

Old 15th Dec 2013, 22:18
  #1041 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Aus
Posts: 139
Rumour of an announcement tomorrow of JQ 787 operating Mel-Akl 4 times per week. Seems they are network planning with a dart board at the moment.
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Old 15th Dec 2013, 22:38
  #1042 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2011
Location: BNE
Posts: 15
is QF ff worth anything is QF international folds ?

doubt if ff programme is actually worth anything without QF international.

OK, it's a database of 10 million email addresses of which probably 1/2 to 3/4 (wild guess) are active regular flyers.

Most people I come into contact with get their QF points from credit cards not flying & don't fly QF except when using points.

Last edited by BNEA320; 15th Dec 2013 at 22:41. Reason: typo
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Old 15th Dec 2013, 23:13
  #1043 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 315
The foreign ownership cap is 49%, but the current actual foreign ownership of QF is currently around what, 35%?

It's not like angel investors from overseas are lining up around the block to buy another 10-15% of what's essentially a basket case, so how is changing the QSA going to help QF raise cash? Or am I missing something really obvious?
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Old 15th Dec 2013, 23:55
  #1044 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2011
Location: BNE
Posts: 15
sense of entitlement is part of the problem

QF is heading down Holdens part.

Not sure if the following is true (was emailed this, last night) but Qantas/Ansett were simply cost plus airlines until deregulation, which no longer works.


High wages stall Holden engine
by: Grace Collier
Illustration: Sturt Krygsman Source: TheAustralian
ONLY $150 million a year will save Holden? Rubbish. The Holden Enterprise Agreement is the document that has utterly sunk Holden's prospects. It defies belief that someone in the company isn't being held to account for it.
Holden's management masks a union culture beyond most people's comprehension. Employment costs spiralled way beyond community standards long ago. Neither "pay freezes" nor more money will save Holden, but getting the Fair Work Commission to dissolve the agreement and put all workers on the award wage might be a start.
In 1991, the pre-enterprise bargaining award wage of a Holden entry level process worker was $462.80 a week. In 1992, Holden began enterprise bargaining and now a worker at that same classification level has a base rate of $1194.50 a week, a 158 per cent increase, or a compound increase of 4.4 per cent year on year for 22 years. Right now, base wage rates for process workers in the Holden enterprise agreement are in the $60,000 to $80,000 per year range and in recent times, "hardship payments" of $3750 were given to each worker.
The modern award for such workers mandates base rates in the $37,000 to $42,000 range. This means that before we add any of the shift penalties, loadings, 26 allowances and the added cost of productivity restrictions, Holden begins each working day paying its workforce almost double what it should. After you add in the other employment costs, I estimate Holden's workforce costs it somewhere close to triple the amount it should.
Many people who work at Holden don't actually work for Holden; they work for the union. Occupational health and safety people are given 10 days' paid time off a year to be trained by the union. Most companies do not allow unions to train their OH&S people because the knowledge is used to control the workplace to the benefit of the union.
Union delegates are also allowed up to 10 paid days a year for union training in how to be effective union delegates and two of these delegates are entitled to an extra Holden sponsorship of one paid month off to "further their industrial and/or leadership development".
Holden's rules on hiring casuals are shocking and unheard of in today's market. The agreement forbids Holden from hiring casuals except when a "short-term increase in workload, or other unusual circumstances occurs". If this situation arises Holden has to "consult and reach agreement" with the union. Further, "Engagement of the agreed number of casual personnel will be for the agreed specified tasks and the agreed specified periods." If any of this changes, Holden must get union agreement again. After three months of continuous full-time work a casual must be made permanent. It is impossible to run a business like this.
An ex-employee from Adelaide, on condition of anonymity, consented to an interview yesterday. He described the workforce as "over-managed", with one team leader for every six workers on the production line, when one for every 25 workers would suffice.
He said "some of us workers felt it wasn't necessary to get paid what we were getting paid to do the jobs we were doing", adding that their work is probably worth about "20 bucks an hour". A few years back, mates took redundancy packages in the order of "$280k plus". Workers are "like sheep" that blindly follow the union leadership. At induction, new workers are ushered into one-on-one meetings with the union rep who heavies them into joining. "It is made clear that if you don't join the union you will be sacked," he said. Union representatives "don't actually do any work for Holden", but rather make themselves full-time enforcers of union control.
He says workers are drug tested before hiring, but "only have to stay off it for a few weeks, get in the door and then you'll be right". Workers caught taking drugs or being drug-affected at work are allegedly put on a fully paid rehabilitation program, with special paid time off of about four weeks duration, before being let back into the workforce.
Australian workplaces have a zero tolerance for drug use, with instant dismissal the remedy, but at Holden "the union won't let the company sack" any workers caught dealing, taking or being on drugs. "If they did a random drug test tomorrow they'd probably have to sack 40 per cent of the workforce," he adds.
If the Holden scenario were playing out in a privately owned business, proper cost-cutting strategies would be used. If you have the will and can hire the skill, there are many ways to cut labour costs. The workers can be given a couple of years notice of significant wage drops and can receive lump sum payouts of entitlements to help bring down family debt.
Of course, these strategies are only ever used by business people who have no one else to bail them out. It seems Holden would rather leave the country than dissolve its enterprise agreement. The union thinks members are better off jobless than on award wages. Holden's fate seems sealed.
If Holden does leave, workers will receive the most generous redundancy benefits around. Holden says leaving will cost $600m. Most of this will go to staff payouts. The fellow interviewed agrees with my calculation: the average production-line worker will walk away with a redundancy package of between $300k-500k.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 01:15
  #1045 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Hunter Valley NSW
Posts: 169
Oh dear, BNEA320, that does make for depressing and probably true reading. Collier was for many years a unionist, but the corruption, the bullying, and the tactics wore her down, till she quit. The AWU admits 146,000 jobs have been lost in manufacturing since 2007, these are their figures, not mine and easily googled. And yet we fawn over the Holden workers, who have four years to find another job, and go out with pockets tingling. Here in the Hunter, small manufactures close almost weekly, they cannot keep up with the wages, the insurance, the super, and either head off shore, or just give up. We are doing a great job of pricing ourselves out of existence, one way or another.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 01:21
  #1046 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sydney
Posts: 29

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Old 16th Dec 2013, 01:30
  #1047 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Castle NastySwine
Posts: 157
Soldier of fortune post 1086

Confirmed. The Greek Santa wants SYD DOM to be a "terminal only" business. Key points:
- "Roster alignment": Replace 2x12hr days / 2x12hr nites / 4xdays-off roster with a 2x10hr days / 2x10hr nites / 2xdays-off. The 10hr may be 10.5hr or 10.9hr but either way Dom & ain't terminals will be on the same/simar roster.
- QF & Jitconnict 738 Phase checks plus heavier jobs plus 40 LAMEs (20 from each terminal) to go to Base.
- Senior LAMEs & DMMs exempt from the process in exchange for full support to "sell" the changes to the blokes on the floor.
- So far, no selection criteria beyond "must have 738, JC and supervisory experience". Recent mention of possibly sending LAMEs that also have wide body license(s).
- Possible "sweeteners" to be offered terminal LAMEs to go to Base. Given the current financial austerity measures, I can't imagine what possible sweeteners worth a damn could be offered.

Looks like anyone at SIO receiving 738 training are on a one-way ticket to Base.

Am I missing something, but can someone see the sense in sending 40 SIO & SDO LAMEs to Base to acquit the work 32 SDO LAMEs across 4 crews still manage to regularly complete before first flight of the day, despite the 20% loss in productivity caused by the introduction of Maintenix? Most SIO LAMEs have little experience on 738 Phase checks. Base LAMEs have none. Word on the street is if forced to go to Base, terminal LAMEs will refuse to sign for Base LAMEs/AMEs; the phase checks will more often than not be "left in pieces" in the hangar in the morning; there's no way that 40 LAMEs can cover the phase check work plus those big all-nighter jobs, given that they won't get much help or accept much help from a Base workforce facing or having copped 150 job losses.

How can Texas Tony accept an unacceptable risk to OTP and a decrease in productivity?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 01:31
  #1048 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Casablanca
Posts: 128
What does an A380 SO earn? I heard about $180,000?..no disrespect, if you can get that money for that role good on you..but seriously, it's not sustainable...Also heard that a number of long term SOs have already had a chance at a window seat but for whatever reason won't move to Perth or have new born babies, bought a new house, just got married etc etc.. Frankly in this game take the first window seat/command that comes your way... You never know when the music is going to stop!
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 01:57
  #1049 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Australia
Posts: 521
Possible "sweeteners" to be offered terminal LAMEs to go to Base. Given the current financial austerity measures, I can't imagine what possible sweeteners worth a damn could be offered.
Probably meant to be taken literally.............

Leftover sweeteners from catering.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 02:57
  #1050 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Outofoz
Posts: 669
Why have Leigh and Alan not been able to capitalise on it?International pax to/from Australia up 5% to 30.3m in FY2013, capacity (seats) also up 5% | CAPA - Centre for Aviation

That's right, its everyone else's fault!
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 04:07
  #1051 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 418
Also heard that a number of long term SOs have already had a chance at a window seat but for whatever reason won't move to Perth or have new born babies, bought a new house, just got married etc etc.. Frankly in this game take the first window seat/command that comes your way... You never know when the music is going to stop!
Most SO's in QF are long term now, and are probably hedging their bets that things may work out. A gamble to be sure, but there you have it. Everyone is different, but my family comes before my flying every time. Moving to Perth wasn't for us, and that may turn out to be a dumb move, but all you can do is work with what's in front of you at the time.

All I want to do is predict the future. Is that too much to ask?

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Old 16th Dec 2013, 04:11
  #1052 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Somewhere on the Australian Coast
Posts: 896
Moving to Perth is not for a lot of people Ruprecht. Many FOs have come to the same decision. Dumb choice? Who knows. I have a feeling you and I may have seen enough of Perth to last a lifetime.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 04:58
  #1053 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Casablanca
Posts: 128
Yeah that's fair enough Ruprecht .. I get what your saying, all I'm saying is be very careful about not taking an opportunity for a window seat.. In my career I've already lost my job after my mob collapsed, having been on the open market with thousands of other blokes.. Having left or right seat time will better your chances of employment elsewhere..

Now I'm back in the left seat and life is good.. I hope it works out for you QF blokes...chin up and keep optimistic but prepare for the worst.. And having window seat time helps in that regard..
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 05:49
  #1054 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Australia
Age: 43
Posts: 104
Whats the story with the brand new JQ A320 (i think the rego is VH-VFV) parked on the JHAS apron in MEL? It looks as though it has been placed in long term storage.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 08:11
  #1055 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Roguesville, cloud cuckooland
Posts: 1,177
The CASA register says it arrived mid November.



It's a good question, particularly if it is going into long term storage... Is Jetstar still paying the lease payments to mainline?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 09:22
  #1056 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 3,040
So EK have said, no equity injection for QF.Still AJ says nothing. Just a week or so ago he was bouncing around like the Duracell Bunny proclaiming all sorts of impending gloom. Just what is going on?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 10:18
  #1057 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Hunter Valley NSW
Posts: 169
Buggered if anybody knows SOPS. My son has just done a Sim in SYD, and he hoped he would pick up the goss there, but everyone is scratching their heads there, too.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 10:29
  #1058 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: S33E151
Posts: 965
EK mate just told me he'd heard David Koczkar Jetstar Chief Commercial Officer just resigned. Rats? Ships?

Anyone confirm?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 15:00
  #1059 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Orstrahlia mate
Posts: 10
Well, since I posted a few days ago, it would appear that I am not the only person who thinks that the costs at Qantas are way too high.

With Captains earning more than $400K, First Officers earning almost $300K, Second Officers earning more than $200K, and Flight Attendants earning more than $100K its perhaps no wonder that AJ started setting up Airlines abroad. Maybe he realised that the costs of doing business were too high in Australia.

I am amused when guys here say "well Australia is a high cost country"......well I think you may just be pricing yourselves out of business. Salaries have to be higher in the sandpit as they need to attract crews to somewhere which in many peoples eyes can be a pretty dire place to live, and bring up a family.

....and as for those who opt to defer a window seat....it could be a very high risk gamble.

Qantas may be sitting on a cash pile, but it is dwindling, and when it gets to around the last 1 Billion or so, the refuel companies, caterers and credit card companies will want paying in cash, and then the cash burn will become much more rapid.

It is not just AJ that is ruining Qantas, it is employee/union greed as well.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 15:26
  #1060 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: south pacific vagrant
Posts: 1,322
confirmed by jh today vjet

dk is off to pursue an "extraordinary opportunity" outside the industry.

one supposes its more than makeup this time
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