MERGED: Alan's still not happy......
Standard Unit said:
The funniest post in ages. Thanks for giving me a hearty laugh, which is more than can be said for most of this thread. "Am I dead ????" Priceless.
Oh my god I think I just shat myself !!
I just saw a Qantas ad on the telly and it showed, like, planes and staff and red tails and stuff !!
Am I dead ????
I just saw a Qantas ad on the telly and it showed, like, planes and staff and red tails and stuff !!
Am I dead ????
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In the Darwin case.
I heard JQ asked Darwin airport to build more terminal space & aerobridges. In return JQ would bring more passengers to Darwin.
But JQ weren't prepared to pay any more for the new facilities.
The foreign carriers said build more terminal space & we will pay the increased rate AND bring you more passengers.
I heard JQ asked Darwin airport to build more terminal space & aerobridges. In return JQ would bring more passengers to Darwin.
But JQ weren't prepared to pay any more for the new facilities.
The foreign carriers said build more terminal space & we will pay the increased rate AND bring you more passengers.
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Am I dead ????
Good morning. I'm Alan Joyce, your Qantas chief executive. On behalf of our chairman, Leigh Clifford, I'd like to welcome you on board QF1, our A380 flight to London today.
Or that's the plan. Unfortunately, due to the lack of a level playing field, we can afford only enough fuel to get us to Dubai. So on our arrival there, we'll be inviting you to offer us your credit cards to purchase more fuel for the next sector to London Heathrow.
Shortly your Qantas in-flight crew will be moving through the cabin in their exciting new designer uniforms. There are two of them, Dinh and Wong, recently hired at very attractive rates from a labour supply company in Phnom Penh, and we'll ask you to kindly bear with them as they learn the job. It would help if passengers in economy would deposit their sandwich wrappers, coffee cups, etc, in the bins provided at the rear of the aircraft.
Recent staff realignments also mean that we no longer have a first officer with us in the cockpit, so we are requesting anyone with flying experience to join us up front to keep an eye on the instruments while our captain takes a nap over the Indian Ocean.
I do apologise, too, that our in-flight entertainment system is not working, due to a regrettable misunderstanding by our maintenance contractors in Mexico. That may also explain the unusual sheet of flame when we started up the starboard outer engine. But any passenger with a guitar or a mouth organ, perhaps, is welcome to organise a sing-song once the seatbelt light has been turned off.
You will have the opportunity during the flight to buy Qantas shares as a souvenir of your time with us, a real bargain now at less than a dollar: just a few years ago they were worth more than $6. In the unlikely event of a further collapse in the share price, an oxygen mask will descend from the compartment above your head, for first class passengers only.
Those of you with seatbelts, please see that they are securely fastened and, if the push-button thingy is still working, ensure that your seat is in the upright position for take-off. Thank you for being among the dwindling number of Australians choosing to fly Qantas, the national flag carrier.
Alan Joyce does lugubrious like Gina Rinehart does iron ore. There are bottomless reserves. Whenever his mournful features pop up you know there will be yet another blast of bad news, inevitably announced with more cheesy headlines: STORMY SKIES, ROUGH LANDING FOR QANTAS.
Nothing good ever happens. Routes are cut, engineers are sacked as more maintenance work gets sent overseas, bases are closed, fuel costs soar, profits collapse, flights are cancelled, market share falters, the share price tanks.
How much of this is Joyce's fault I cannot say. But I remember those glory days when Qantas was a world power in aviation, happy to fly you almost anywhere around the globe, much envied by its competitors. Since Joyce took the top job in 2008, it's been nothing but ''honey, I shrank the airline''.
Not that there's been any shortage of dazzling plans. At one stage, various bits and pieces of the Jetstar offshoot were to be the saviour for Qantas: an efficient, low-cost operation would lure the punters on board and see profits take-off (requisite pun). Now it seems that Jetstar This and Jetstar That require a regular injection of Qantas cash and some pea 'n' thimble bookwork to keep airborne.
More recently, we've seen the deal with the Middle East airline Emirates, trumpeted by Joyce as yet another stroke of genius to rescue Qantas International, but which now looks awfully like the mouse making love to the elephant. Under Joyce and Chairman Clifford, every ballyhooed initiative seems to leave the place worse off. (Don't get me started on that crazy decision to ground the entire fleet and 100,000 angry passengers during an industrial dispute two years ago.)
The news this week that Qantas would nosedive (sorry) to a first-half loss this year of $300 million was a genuine shocker.
Nothing, though, is ever management's fault. It's the high cost of fuel, or more competition, or union intransigence, or a lack of government support, summed up - in a classic Joycean phrase - as ''our fiercely difficult operating environment.'' The whingeing never stops.
Instinct tells me it's time for Joyce and Clifford to strap on their parachutes and bail out (yes, I know). If they stay at the controls (last pun; metaphor now changes) we can expect Qantas to gradually fade away like Lewis Carroll's Cheshire Cat, until there is nothing left but the grin. my bold
Or that's the plan. Unfortunately, due to the lack of a level playing field, we can afford only enough fuel to get us to Dubai. So on our arrival there, we'll be inviting you to offer us your credit cards to purchase more fuel for the next sector to London Heathrow.
Shortly your Qantas in-flight crew will be moving through the cabin in their exciting new designer uniforms. There are two of them, Dinh and Wong, recently hired at very attractive rates from a labour supply company in Phnom Penh, and we'll ask you to kindly bear with them as they learn the job. It would help if passengers in economy would deposit their sandwich wrappers, coffee cups, etc, in the bins provided at the rear of the aircraft.
Recent staff realignments also mean that we no longer have a first officer with us in the cockpit, so we are requesting anyone with flying experience to join us up front to keep an eye on the instruments while our captain takes a nap over the Indian Ocean.
I do apologise, too, that our in-flight entertainment system is not working, due to a regrettable misunderstanding by our maintenance contractors in Mexico. That may also explain the unusual sheet of flame when we started up the starboard outer engine. But any passenger with a guitar or a mouth organ, perhaps, is welcome to organise a sing-song once the seatbelt light has been turned off.
You will have the opportunity during the flight to buy Qantas shares as a souvenir of your time with us, a real bargain now at less than a dollar: just a few years ago they were worth more than $6. In the unlikely event of a further collapse in the share price, an oxygen mask will descend from the compartment above your head, for first class passengers only.
Those of you with seatbelts, please see that they are securely fastened and, if the push-button thingy is still working, ensure that your seat is in the upright position for take-off. Thank you for being among the dwindling number of Australians choosing to fly Qantas, the national flag carrier.
Alan Joyce does lugubrious like Gina Rinehart does iron ore. There are bottomless reserves. Whenever his mournful features pop up you know there will be yet another blast of bad news, inevitably announced with more cheesy headlines: STORMY SKIES, ROUGH LANDING FOR QANTAS.
Nothing good ever happens. Routes are cut, engineers are sacked as more maintenance work gets sent overseas, bases are closed, fuel costs soar, profits collapse, flights are cancelled, market share falters, the share price tanks.
How much of this is Joyce's fault I cannot say. But I remember those glory days when Qantas was a world power in aviation, happy to fly you almost anywhere around the globe, much envied by its competitors. Since Joyce took the top job in 2008, it's been nothing but ''honey, I shrank the airline''.
Not that there's been any shortage of dazzling plans. At one stage, various bits and pieces of the Jetstar offshoot were to be the saviour for Qantas: an efficient, low-cost operation would lure the punters on board and see profits take-off (requisite pun). Now it seems that Jetstar This and Jetstar That require a regular injection of Qantas cash and some pea 'n' thimble bookwork to keep airborne.
More recently, we've seen the deal with the Middle East airline Emirates, trumpeted by Joyce as yet another stroke of genius to rescue Qantas International, but which now looks awfully like the mouse making love to the elephant. Under Joyce and Chairman Clifford, every ballyhooed initiative seems to leave the place worse off. (Don't get me started on that crazy decision to ground the entire fleet and 100,000 angry passengers during an industrial dispute two years ago.)
The news this week that Qantas would nosedive (sorry) to a first-half loss this year of $300 million was a genuine shocker.
Nothing, though, is ever management's fault. It's the high cost of fuel, or more competition, or union intransigence, or a lack of government support, summed up - in a classic Joycean phrase - as ''our fiercely difficult operating environment.'' The whingeing never stops.
Instinct tells me it's time for Joyce and Clifford to strap on their parachutes and bail out (yes, I know). If they stay at the controls (last pun; metaphor now changes) we can expect Qantas to gradually fade away like Lewis Carroll's Cheshire Cat, until there is nothing left but the grin. my bold
I strongly believe brand Qantas will outlast Joyce & Clifford changing that book title to "The Men Who Nearly Killed Qantas"..
Last edited by TIMA9X; 13th Dec 2013 at 14:56.
Sunfish - you're confusing direct like on like replacement for jobs with the overall economic multiplier effect of large resources projects throughout the economy.
The infrastructure that will contribute to the LNG boom is already built, or being built - the final investment decisions have been made, it's not pie in the sky.
They are underpinned by signed 30 year contracts by Asian energy companies to take the gas.
That means massive annuity style streams of cash flooding into the Australian economy for the next three decades.
So, to the earlier poster who said these forecasts can be made to suit whatever barrow you're pushing, and are often wrong, not so.
That money will mean jobs and economic stimulus, everywhere in all sorts of sectors.
That's not Ayn Rand at all - it's economics 101 and there's nearly two hundred years of evidence to back up the theories.
In fact, despite the earlier posts talking about rent seeking, it's precisely that flow of cash from mining that has propped up the economy until the Capex investment boom dried up.
One place that will feel a huge effect of the gas boom is Queensland, home to large CSG reserves. And that's without even beginning to look at shale reserves... many geologists believe Australia may be sitting on shale gas reserves that are just as big.
The future is bright and very promising for us and our kids - this really is the lucky country.
So, there won't be any armed insurrections, or people trying to seek resources at the end of a gun!
Provided - and a big if - we don't squander that income on perpetuating fortress Australia, and unsustainable terms and conditions in industries like car manufacturing or, at the risk of making you all grit your teeth, the airline industry.
There will be a Qantas in future.
I wonder if Abbott and co. will blink right at the last moment, bail you out a la Air NZ, and then force a quick, brutal and very radical re-structure and downsizing. A politician can live with Holden dying on his watch, but the cost of seeing the national carrier die on his watch? Far too politically and symbolically expensive to let that happen I reckon.
Think like a politician for a sec - the electorate would slaughter you.
So what to do?
Well gentlemen and ladies, make a big, ballsy decision.
If you don't like what's happening in aviation - then leave.
Change jobs.
Sell your house.
Move states, or even countries.
I did all three in 2011 after having taken a gamble late in life, changed industries and did a two year exec MBA (self funded, and I'm not rich or young).
As a result I have come close to tripling my income and have a job that is very interesting.
So it can be done.
If you're smart enough to get an ATPL, or complete an A,B,C or D check on a widebody then you can do it too.
Good luck.
The infrastructure that will contribute to the LNG boom is already built, or being built - the final investment decisions have been made, it's not pie in the sky.
They are underpinned by signed 30 year contracts by Asian energy companies to take the gas.
That means massive annuity style streams of cash flooding into the Australian economy for the next three decades.
So, to the earlier poster who said these forecasts can be made to suit whatever barrow you're pushing, and are often wrong, not so.
That money will mean jobs and economic stimulus, everywhere in all sorts of sectors.
That's not Ayn Rand at all - it's economics 101 and there's nearly two hundred years of evidence to back up the theories.
In fact, despite the earlier posts talking about rent seeking, it's precisely that flow of cash from mining that has propped up the economy until the Capex investment boom dried up.
One place that will feel a huge effect of the gas boom is Queensland, home to large CSG reserves. And that's without even beginning to look at shale reserves... many geologists believe Australia may be sitting on shale gas reserves that are just as big.
The future is bright and very promising for us and our kids - this really is the lucky country.
So, there won't be any armed insurrections, or people trying to seek resources at the end of a gun!
Provided - and a big if - we don't squander that income on perpetuating fortress Australia, and unsustainable terms and conditions in industries like car manufacturing or, at the risk of making you all grit your teeth, the airline industry.
There will be a Qantas in future.
I wonder if Abbott and co. will blink right at the last moment, bail you out a la Air NZ, and then force a quick, brutal and very radical re-structure and downsizing. A politician can live with Holden dying on his watch, but the cost of seeing the national carrier die on his watch? Far too politically and symbolically expensive to let that happen I reckon.
Think like a politician for a sec - the electorate would slaughter you.
So what to do?
Well gentlemen and ladies, make a big, ballsy decision.
If you don't like what's happening in aviation - then leave.
Change jobs.
Sell your house.
Move states, or even countries.
I did all three in 2011 after having taken a gamble late in life, changed industries and did a two year exec MBA (self funded, and I'm not rich or young).
As a result I have come close to tripling my income and have a job that is very interesting.
So it can be done.
If you're smart enough to get an ATPL, or complete an A,B,C or D check on a widebody then you can do it too.
Good luck.
Jack Ranga,
Negative...by all accounts she's a Domestic F/A employed in Australia.
Negative...by all accounts she's a Domestic F/A employed in Australia.
As AJ's friends in Canberra head home for their holidays, Tony says:
Tony Abbott says ditching Qantas Sale Act restriction on foreign ownership not 'unreasonable' - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
And to stir AJ, Virgin says, pick me:
Virgin says call us, not Qantas, in times of crisis
Prime Minister Tony Abbott has suggested he could support lifting foreign ownership restrictions on Qantas to put it on a level playing field.
Qantas says strict foreign ownership rules are making it hard to compete with Virgin and there are a number of ways the Government could help it.
Mr Abbott has ruled out providing subsidies to the airline and says the Government will not guarantee the airline's debt.
But he has told the Financial Review that it was not an "unreasonable" request by Qantas to have the Qantas Sale Act lifted.
Shares in the airline hit a record low last week, shortly after the airline's credit rating was downgraded to "junk" status by global ratings agency Standard and Poor's following a $300 million half-year loss.
The news of the downgrade came amid a $2 billion restructuring by Qantas, which insists it remains in a strong financial position due to its large cash balance and asset base.
In December, the company announced plans to axe about 1,000 jobs over the next 12 months.
Opposition treasury spokesman Chris Bowen said this week the Federal Government must consider all available options to help Qantas, including taking a small stake in the airline.
Qantas says strict foreign ownership rules are making it hard to compete with Virgin and there are a number of ways the Government could help it.
Mr Abbott has ruled out providing subsidies to the airline and says the Government will not guarantee the airline's debt.
But he has told the Financial Review that it was not an "unreasonable" request by Qantas to have the Qantas Sale Act lifted.
Shares in the airline hit a record low last week, shortly after the airline's credit rating was downgraded to "junk" status by global ratings agency Standard and Poor's following a $300 million half-year loss.
The news of the downgrade came amid a $2 billion restructuring by Qantas, which insists it remains in a strong financial position due to its large cash balance and asset base.
In December, the company announced plans to axe about 1,000 jobs over the next 12 months.
Opposition treasury spokesman Chris Bowen said this week the Federal Government must consider all available options to help Qantas, including taking a small stake in the airline.
And to stir AJ, Virgin says, pick me:
Virgin says call us, not Qantas, in times of crisis
Well gentlemen and ladies, make a big, ballsy decision.
If you don't like what's happening in aviation - then leave.
Change jobs.
Sell your house.
Move states, or even countries.
I did all three in 2011 after having taken a gamble late in life, changed industries and did a two year exec MBA (self funded, and I'm not rich or young).
As a result I have come close to tripling my income and have a job that is very interesting.
So it can be done.
If you're smart enough to get an ATPL, or complete an A,B,C or D check on a widebody then you can do it too.
Good luck.
If you don't like what's happening in aviation - then leave.
Change jobs.
Sell your house.
Move states, or even countries.
I did all three in 2011 after having taken a gamble late in life, changed industries and did a two year exec MBA (self funded, and I'm not rich or young).
As a result I have come close to tripling my income and have a job that is very interesting.
So it can be done.
If you're smart enough to get an ATPL, or complete an A,B,C or D check on a widebody then you can do it too.
Good luck.
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And in a contrasting management style, we have SpaceX - out to change the world:
"As much as possible, avoid hiring MBAs. MBA programs don’t teach people how to create companies. " - Elon Musk
"At my companies, our position is that we hire someone in spite of an MBA, not because of one." - Elon Musk
Even the job descriptions tell you it is a "Can Do" company ..
Software Developer - Borg
I love this bit:
"Working at SpaceX, you will hold a large degree of personal responsibility, work on awesome stuff and every day be completely baffled as to how you ever worked anywhere else."
What a refreshing change.
N
"As much as possible, avoid hiring MBAs. MBA programs don’t teach people how to create companies. " - Elon Musk
"At my companies, our position is that we hire someone in spite of an MBA, not because of one." - Elon Musk
Even the job descriptions tell you it is a "Can Do" company ..
Software Developer - Borg
I love this bit:
"Working at SpaceX, you will hold a large degree of personal responsibility, work on awesome stuff and every day be completely baffled as to how you ever worked anywhere else."
What a refreshing change.
N
Thread Starter
They are underpinned by signed 30 year contracts by Asian energy companies to take the gas.
That means massive annuity style streams of cash flooding into the Australian economy for the next three decades.
So, to the earlier poster who said these forecasts can be made to suit whatever barrow you're pushing, and are often wrong, not so.
That money will mean jobs and economic stimulus, everywhere in all sorts of sectors.
That's not Ayn Rand at all - it's economics 101 and there's nearly two hundred years of evidence to back up the theories.
That means massive annuity style streams of cash flooding into the Australian economy for the next three decades.
So, to the earlier poster who said these forecasts can be made to suit whatever barrow you're pushing, and are often wrong, not so.
That money will mean jobs and economic stimulus, everywhere in all sorts of sectors.
That's not Ayn Rand at all - it's economics 101 and there's nearly two hundred years of evidence to back up the theories.
The idea that all these mining projects bring huge money into Australia is just pure spin. Everyone talks about the economic multiplier BEFORE the project is done then it is never heard of again. Yes they will provide a economic uplift but nothing like what it should be, if it was Australian companies employing Australians.
Heard a interview with Ross Garnaut recently where he said that 75% of the mining boom profits went overseas.
The country is being gutted and eventually there will be nothing left.
That misses the point entirely. The issue is that Qantas has been deliberately destroyed. To the people that have cared greatly for 'The Company' over the last 95+ years it is incredibly sad to see it wrecked by a group of incompetent blow-ins
But I'm not sure if Joyce et al are actually incompetent or playing to some grand plan of destroying the airline deliberately to access the assets.
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V jet, I would suspect that Makybe Diva would not be the recipient of the needle, but the vet, after the crowd had intervened, and this is the best we can hope for here. Australians, someone lethargic about most things, except the cricket, if playing the Poms, ditto State of Origin, or the Anzacs, are slow to anger, but once incensed, they take it rather badly. Whilst few are taking much interest in the QF problems at the present, but are still puzzling over GMH and possibly Toyota, I would not like to be the Govt. should the thing suddenly fold. Naturally it will be Abbott's fault, not the management's who did "everything possible to save this Icon, but..........alas" and if it retains only domestic, we can wave 15,000 staff onto Centrelink, to the sandpit, or some God forsaken African Airline, that are still flying 707's. Anybody who thinks finding a job OS is fun, think again. Unless you are single, cashed up, and can rent out your trendy apartment easily, its ****e. Especially when the airline interviewing you, knows exactly why you are begging a job. As I blog this, it has just come over the news, that Abbott is seriously considering lifting the foreign ownership of QF, which probably means he will. A good decision. There is still hope.
Wrong on the outsourcing Neville.
My company - Australian born, owned and employing 12,000 Aussies, is a direct beneficiary of this.
Same with mining and the ongoing operational expenditure boom now that the capex has finished.
Noip - a cheap shot from an inspiring guy.
There's a lot of bull**** written about MBAs, almost all by people who don't have one.
It's a great degree - especially for the fact that it arms you with the knowledge that prevents accountants and financial engineers from snow jobbing you.
All about what fundamentally motivates you, what inspires you, and how you use the knowledge.
90 per cent of my classmates had `can-do' in spades, and have gone on to great things.
My company - Australian born, owned and employing 12,000 Aussies, is a direct beneficiary of this.
Same with mining and the ongoing operational expenditure boom now that the capex has finished.
Noip - a cheap shot from an inspiring guy.
There's a lot of bull**** written about MBAs, almost all by people who don't have one.
It's a great degree - especially for the fact that it arms you with the knowledge that prevents accountants and financial engineers from snow jobbing you.
All about what fundamentally motivates you, what inspires you, and how you use the knowledge.
90 per cent of my classmates had `can-do' in spades, and have gone on to great things.
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TT,
A cheap shot ..no .. he means it. And from what you have posted recently, you have confirmed his opinion.
All the damage to QF has been from Managment .. and I assume MBA graduates ... the "young turks" who are going to show the "old guys".
Me? Many years ago I had to make a choice ... A Masters, or .. follow my passion ... So I went with aeroplanes ...
QF's problems are not that difficult to solve ... concentrate on your core business and stop trying to think you are going to conquer the world using Asian Coolies.
I keep thinking of Alan's speach where he says we should engage with Asia (like we did 20 years ago? ) ... and then he abandons Singapore for Dubai .... way to go!!
N
A cheap shot ..no .. he means it. And from what you have posted recently, you have confirmed his opinion.
All the damage to QF has been from Managment .. and I assume MBA graduates ... the "young turks" who are going to show the "old guys".
Me? Many years ago I had to make a choice ... A Masters, or .. follow my passion ... So I went with aeroplanes ...
QF's problems are not that difficult to solve ... concentrate on your core business and stop trying to think you are going to conquer the world using Asian Coolies.
I keep thinking of Alan's speach where he says we should engage with Asia (like we did 20 years ago? ) ... and then he abandons Singapore for Dubai .... way to go!!
N
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noip, well said ,
MBA's, taught by people who never left school in my view.... clinical people with no passion for the industry they work in, appear happy to move around from one industry to the next, unlike pilots.
MBA's, taught by people who never left school in my view.... clinical people with no passion for the industry they work in, appear happy to move around from one industry to the next, unlike pilots.
Last edited by TIMA9X; 14th Dec 2013 at 04:21.
I think what he means is "we won't employ you if you come here with a buttoned down business school attitude, thinking that if you can measure it, you can manage it."
And not everyone who's been to business school thinks like that.
And not everyone who's been to business school thinks like that.