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MERGED: Alan's still not happy......

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MERGED: Alan's still not happy......

Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:16
  #3061 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Fliegensville, Gold Coast Australia
Posts: 1
'Tis but politics SOPS, they know Labor and the watermelons will oppose......simplistic wedge politics really, TA showing he learnt well from howard......(Need to deflect something from Holden SPC etc.! Especially since the big fella came out guns blazing blaming unions etc., to which the management quickly disagreed, but that's another story!),

Shortun' won't be smart enough in his response, and will be effectively wedged by Abbot here......Leigh Clifford & AJ will be the winners here....effectively supported by Abbott and Co. ....the poor QF employee doesn't even factor in this....
Fliegenmong is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:20
  #3062 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Bangkok & Vegas
Posts: 73
Didn't they suspend the splitting of the AOC's last week?

What a waste of money and effort for all concerned.

Is anyone steering the qf float down oxford st?
Mr Leslie Chow is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:27
  #3063 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: aviation heaven, australia
Posts: 215
Lets all watch Labor block the sales act repeal and Qantas go down the tube due to an incompetent little Irish man. Labor just wants to continue throwing money away. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Simple fact is, QF staff are paid too high for the current airfare prices. People need to wake up and see reality.

Ansett mark II. Better get my CV to Virgin…...
empire4 is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:33
  #3064 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 468

To find a person's posts, just click on their name and follow the links.

Clearly, you do not understand the level of risk when practices are used that compromise the safety of the aircraft, and if before the flight you are just happy to ask to be returned safely to the ground during an in flight emergency having taken the chance on a cheap LCC flight and accepted lesser quality engineering and pilot skills, then follow these simple steps.
During such an emergency,
1., Follow the safety card instructions
2. Put your head between your legs and kiss your a*** goodbye..

Fly safely
AEROMEDIC is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:40
  #3065 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 201

Name some pay differences.
Most operational staff are line ball with Virgin.
The pay difference is in management pure and simple.
This is a pilot''s forum but your not so %#^k off.
Troo believer is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:44
  #3066 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: goulburn
Posts: 393
Just gets up my nose that the little p...can even have a partial win and I can see the PR machine going to work now saying how good he is.

Pity government couldn't make it conditional on a new CEO/Chairman being appointed because this will still end in tears regardless with backslaps, bonuses and Rockpool dinners as vultures move in.
ohallen is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 08:47
  #3067 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 75
Troo believer - could it be more to do with the number of employees used to get a job done, rather than how much they're paid. My understanding is that a lot of office positions are under the chop?
5-in-50 is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 09:04
  #3068 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The World
Posts: 60
Just watched Albanese on the ABC ......what a pathetic sympathizer this man is. BS about QFs role in war time .... for gods sake the limitations placed on all other airlines meant they didn't have the equipment to help. He conveniently ignores the Ansett input to the evacuation of Darwin following cyclone Tracey. And it is not as though the govt doesn't pay handsomely for the a rescue flights. Albanese is a disgrace.
Tangan is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 09:09
  #3069 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: sydney
Posts: 1,440
The guvmint could level the playing field across the board, domestic and International, by wiping CAsA out and starting again with some proper
regulations, getting rid of the carbon tax, and a little IR reform.
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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 09:15
  #3070 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: south pacific vagrant
Posts: 1,321

my pilot skills are less than a qf pilots? is that coz im paid less or dont work for qf?

utter bullsh1t
waren9 is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 09:38
  #3071 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In Frozen Chunks (Cloud Cuckoo Land)
Age: 13
Posts: 1,517
Warren you look like the sensitive type. Maybe this will cheer you up;

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Old 3rd Mar 2014, 09:55
  #3072 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Classified
Posts: 122
Tony Abbott quoted by the SMH today:

"If you look at the history of Qantas over the last decade or so it was hugely profitable for most of that time. That demonstrates to me that a well managed Qantas is more than capable of competing, and not just surviving, but of flourishing.
Says what he thinks of current management.............
D.Lamination is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 10:00
  #3073 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 64
Posts: 686

Ye know not of what ye speak. I agree with the sentiment expressed regarding sex and travel.

I do not work for QF but have a number of mates that do/did. We are all from the same background and all learned to fly in the military.

May I cite a couple of cases that show how incompetent QF management managed to become.

Due to fleet selection and a dwindling network, QF has found it almost impossible to roster senior captains (and I presume f/o's and s/o's) in international to do more than 50 hours a month. Two, who have recently retired, spent most of their last 12 months in QF on leave. All this while they were more than happy to fly 80-90 hours. Strange people pilots, they actually like going to work.

The whole argument has been orchestrated to appear as though it is unions killing QF. Most pilots I have met want to fly and have a family that accepts that fact. If a company with as many managers per driver as QF cannot get more than 50 stick hours a month out of their top professionals then this is a company I would never invest in.

In reading this thread, I am convinced that similar sentiments apply to a vast majority of the QF workforce.

Joyce has no leadership skills. Never did. Never will. They knew that when they hired him. People follow him out of curiosity.

Not one of the employees of QF would question the need for change, for pencil sharpening or compromise but they sure as hell wouldn't do it for the current management. Without a complete clearing of the board and senior management, Corporal Fraser is correct...We're all doooooomed. Strangely many employees see the Leningrad option as the preferred option.

As to the wasted money in Asia...delusional is the only word that I can come up with. I have taxied past the idle airframes at Narita and mates have seen the parking lot in Toulouse. And that is only the tip of the iceberg. The debabcle here in HK should be taken up by the Chasers.

One final note.

Most of the "non-existent" profits in QF International have been siphoned off into the FF program via transfer pricing. The FF program is not a saleable asset, it is a leech dressed up as a princess. Without an airline the FF program is worth exactly zero.

Why should not a full audit of the books be on the agenda?
VR-HFX is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 10:04
  #3074 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Sydney, NSW,Australia
Posts: 91
Alan & The Team, 5 years of own goals and they just did it again !

The world's highest paid Airline management team, and least successful.

Imagine what it would be like if all QF Staff achieved the same dismal results.
Jackneville is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 11:08
  #3075 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 468

No, I just said that if safety was compromised by the airline operator for the sake of making a profit, it was plainly wrong. I didn't refer to Jetstar or Qantas in my comment, just what should exist with a compliant operator.
Additionally, I said salary was according to responsibility, but I did not say pilot skills were any less, rather to say there should be a difference in salary for what is flown and passengers carried.
AEROMEDIC is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 11:55
  #3076 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: UK/OZ
Posts: 1,718
Is it really 5000 jobs to go?
No, the figure will be higher.
He said the equivalent of 5000 full time jobs.

So perhaps it could be 4000 full time jobs and 3000 part time jobs.
If he obfuscates the numbers on a live national press conference on the subject of the human cost of mass layoffs how can any of his financial figures be trusted.

Possibly the first time that the concept of equivalence has been used to describe numbers in a mass redundancy event?

mickjoebill is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 13:03
  #3077 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mt Druitt
Posts: 166

I did hear that too mickjoebill, 'the equivalent of 5000 full-time jobs (Joyce)' would go.

Baffling the public with BS again
snoop doggy dog is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 13:25
  #3078 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: London-Thailand-Australia
Age: 11
Posts: 1,057
Thumbs up Go Adele

Here we go, Déjà vu but mainstream now,

Wing clippings for Qantas bosses

Whatever shape Qantas finds itself in a year from now, it seems unlikely Alan Joyce will still be running the airline. The current board, led by Leigh Clifford, is also likely to be different.

The brutal reality is Joyce has put himself in a catch-22 situation by politicising the woes of the airline and insisting he is blameless, and that he has the full backing of the board and his shareholders. ''There is nothing anybody in Qantas has done that has caused this issue,'' he said.
At the end of the day, although Australians still consider Qantas their national carrier, albeit with less fervour after he grounded the airline on October 29, 2011 to break a deadlock with three unions, the lure of cheap air tickets dominates. And politicians have an eye for the votes.

It explains why Virgin Australia boss John Borghetti opened his half-yearly results posing the questions: ''What do we want the future of aviation in Australia to be? Do we want to go back to the days of the 1980s, when there was a regulated market and government-supported airlines were cumbersome, expensive, bureaucratic and airfares were high? Or do we want to continue what was started in the 1990s, following the path of other countries such as the US, Europe and Japan, in deregulating the market and encouraging competition, choice and innovation for the benefit of customers?''

Joyce has not endeared himself to the Australian public or staff with his various tactics since October 2011.
In the past couple of years, his various tactics and brawls with staff and rival Virgin to maintain a 65 per cent market share has made him the most disliked chief executive since Sol Trujillo waved goodbye after a controversial stint at Telstra.

In a series of focus groups conducted in February in Sydney's central business district with a $120 incentive for 90 minutes of grilling about Qantas, one of the participants said each of the eight people in his group agreed on the following:
1. Qantas was/is our national carrier - we were all proud of Qantas;

2. Australian pilots, Australian cabin crew, Australian aircraft servicing, safety and on-time flights are the most important factors when choosing an airline with which to fly [more than food, Qantas Club, in-flight service, seating, entertainment systems, etc];

3. Joyce and his team have ruined Qantas for their own ends;

4. Qantas needs to heal the rift between its staff and management to gain more confidence and thus more patronage from the public. The participant said there were several other focus groups being run concurrently. ''The mood throughout seemed to be consistent with the above.''

The final reading of the focus groups is not known, but this sort of talk is not surprising. Indeed, in the past few days I have received more than 100 emails from staff, former staff, customers and former customers castigating Joyce and the board for the embarrassing mess of Qantas. The tone is a mix of sadness and anger.

This sort of talk about Joyce is not unusual and prompted online bookmaker sportsbet.com.au to open up bets on how long Joyce could remain at the airline. Sportsbet's Will Byrne said: ''In bad news for the Irishman, the bookie is offering odds of $1.62 that he will have his wings clipped by this time next year, with $2.20 on offer for him to survive the current turbulence.''

Since the bets were opened on Friday, the booking agency has become more confident Joyce will go this month, with the odds for a sacking moving from $4.50 to $3.75 as the pressure mounts. ''Joyce appears to be on borrowed time, and his odds for a departure sooner than later have nosedived,'' Byrne said.
It has also opened up the bet to who will depart first: $1.50 odds for Joyce and $2.50 for Clifford.

Meanwhile, the Greens and Senator Nick Xenophon are trying as hard as they can to establish an urgent inquiry into the future of Qantas. They want Joyce to front the Senate inquiry so they can open his airline's books in an attempt to shine a light on what has gone on at Qantas.

Joyce released a loss of $252 million for the six months to December 31, announced he would slash 5000 jobs, cut routes, mothball or defer 50 aircraft and sell some assets. He is also calling for government assistance, including a debt guarantee and the removal of the antiquated Qantas Sale Act to ''level the playing field''.

But some of the problems are self-inflicted due to his obsession with maintaining a 65 per cent market share and his decision to continue to grow capacity despite the current state of affairs.

The Australian Competition and Consumer Commission is believed to be investigating Qantas for potential misuse of market power. In September, ACCC chairman Rod Sims said he was ''concerned'' by comments made by Qantas, particularly that it would add two planes for each one added by Virgin. Just as the government is set to make its verdict on Qantas' request for help, the ACCC should decide on what it plans to do in relation to the airline's role in the capacity war.

my bold, .... had a severe urge to bold it all.. And finally a focus group I agree with...


Mayday: How Qantas went from national icon to corporate tragedy

Ain't been a great week so far for the little bloke, nothing seems to be going right

Qantas foots big Modern Family bill amid job cuts

Govt to seek repeal of key restrictions of Qantas Sale Act | Plane Talking

Has Qantas chair Leigh Clifford totally lost the plot? | Plane Talking

Last edited by TIMA9X; 3rd Mar 2014 at 14:04.
TIMA9X is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 17:34
  #3079 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: south pacific vagrant
Posts: 1,321
having taken the chance on a cheap LCC flight and accepted lesser quality engineering and pilot skills
is exactly what you said aeromedic, how else does one interpret that?

write what you mean next time. i cant mind read.
waren9 is offline  
Old 3rd Mar 2014, 18:24
  #3080 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Australia - South of where I'd like to be !
Age: 55
Posts: 4,244

You beat me to it.

Interesting that Abbott didn't bend over backwards to all Joyce's demands !!!
500N is offline  

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