Truss: Aviation Safety Regulation Review
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Still a worry.
"The Civil Aviation Safety Authority continues to provide appropriate indemnity to all industry personnel with delegations of authority".
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Guess that's it, the end of any viable aviation industry in Australia.
Business in any form cannot operate or survive in a Corrupt environment, ultimately it all comes unstuck.
Failure of Gov. to recognize when and where corruption exists, and act to stamp it out puts any industry on the slippery slope.
It was wonderful while it lasted, enjoyed almost every minute of it, and very sad to see it end up like this.
RIP aviation in Australia, unfortunately the bastards won!
Business in any form cannot operate or survive in a Corrupt environment, ultimately it all comes unstuck.
Failure of Gov. to recognize when and where corruption exists, and act to stamp it out puts any industry on the slippery slope.
It was wonderful while it lasted, enjoyed almost every minute of it, and very sad to see it end up like this.
RIP aviation in Australia, unfortunately the bastards won!
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All, it is not too late to have a final (unrecognised or valued) input.
The Deputy Prime Minister has invited public and industry views on the recommendations of the report, prior to the finalisation of the Government response. Public and industry comments are being sought by close of business Monday 30 June 2014. Comments can be sent to the Department on the attached comment form.
However, I feel it's probably just flogging a dead horse ...
Despite the 260 submissions to the WLR, the 2800 posts on this forum regarding the ASRR and Senate Inquiry, (read by those that matter) from many more learned and eloquent than I, I feel it will truly take a smoking hole in the ground to elicit any change.
.
Many thanks to the many aforementioned contributors (you know who you are) to the two ongoing threads for your valiant efforts. Also, many thanks to the Senate members who tried so hard to have industry concerns heard. I wonder where you get the strength to carry on after such ignorance.
Me... I'm off to EnZed.
The Deputy Prime Minister has invited public and industry views on the recommendations of the report, prior to the finalisation of the Government response. Public and industry comments are being sought by close of business Monday 30 June 2014. Comments can be sent to the Department on the attached comment form.
However, I feel it's probably just flogging a dead horse ...
Despite the 260 submissions to the WLR, the 2800 posts on this forum regarding the ASRR and Senate Inquiry, (read by those that matter) from many more learned and eloquent than I, I feel it will truly take a smoking hole in the ground to elicit any change.
.
Many thanks to the many aforementioned contributors (you know who you are) to the two ongoing threads for your valiant efforts. Also, many thanks to the Senate members who tried so hard to have industry concerns heard. I wonder where you get the strength to carry on after such ignorance.
Me... I'm off to EnZed.
Last edited by Two_dogs; 3rd Jun 2014 at 10:08.
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from the executive summary...
19. The Australian Transport Safety Bureau transfers information from Mandatory Occurrence Reports to the Civil Aviation Safety Authority, without redaction or de-identification.
well no more confidential incident reporting. that'll save the system thousands of dollars.
....just what are they thinking??
in the full report this ranks as the understatement of the decade!
do you notice throughout the report that ICAO is seen as the peak governing body and australia is a servant to it.
I thought we were a sovereign nation.
19. The Australian Transport Safety Bureau transfers information from Mandatory Occurrence Reports to the Civil Aviation Safety Authority, without redaction or de-identification.
well no more confidential incident reporting. that'll save the system thousands of dollars.
....just what are they thinking??
in the full report this ranks as the understatement of the decade!
While CASA is clearly aware of specific instances of industry dissatisfaction, it does not appear to fully comprehend the level or breadth of ill-feeling across all industry sectors. This lack of comprehension is especially apparent at the senior leadership level, including within the CASA Board.
I thought we were a sovereign nation.
Last edited by dubbleyew eight; 3rd Jun 2014 at 12:15.
An unsurprisingly ineffectual Report.
A bigger CASA Board and a new Messiah DAS is all that will happen in substance.
In other words, back to the future. Way back.
A bigger CASA Board and a new Messiah DAS is all that will happen in substance.
In other words, back to the future. Way back.
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Musical chairs - Game on!
I did like this part of the Executive Summary -
I don't think the Witchdoctor would enjoy seeing his contribution towards 20 years of ridiculous wording and legalese which is aimed only at persons with PHD's (probably 0.001 percent of our industry) get **** canned! Can you imagine the scowl behind that silly beard?
On a lighter and not surprising note, my sources tell me that the Buzzards are already circling internally at Fort Fumble smack above some of the carcasses, and the games have begun internally! Some in-fighting, back stabbing and manipulation, along with shoring up votes for some of the expected new positions, some bruised egos, and some with hard-on's over the prospect of getting paid more money to deliver retribution upon the IOS! What a swell place ey?? And it reminds me of an old saying that used to float through the halls of Infrastructure which was 'there is nothing more dangerous on earth than a disgruntled current or former CAsA employee'! At that, I shall rest my case.
TICK TOCK
'The Panel recommends returning to a third tier of regulation, removing as much detail as possible from the regulations, and using plain Language standards in the third tier'.
On a lighter and not surprising note, my sources tell me that the Buzzards are already circling internally at Fort Fumble smack above some of the carcasses, and the games have begun internally! Some in-fighting, back stabbing and manipulation, along with shoring up votes for some of the expected new positions, some bruised egos, and some with hard-on's over the prospect of getting paid more money to deliver retribution upon the IOS! What a swell place ey?? And it reminds me of an old saying that used to float through the halls of Infrastructure which was 'there is nothing more dangerous on earth than a disgruntled current or former CAsA employee'! At that, I shall rest my case.
TICK TOCK
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Recommendation 22. Small offices at industry locations.
Bankstown, Moorabbin closures have not proved popular then.
The TSB report probably needs washing through Trim or sky sentinel a few times before release. I wonder if the TSB are in danger of joining the IOS?
004. I can imagine the goings on in casa offices. Tin hats on and keep head down.
Bankstown, Moorabbin closures have not proved popular then.
The TSB report probably needs washing through Trim or sky sentinel a few times before release. I wonder if the TSB are in danger of joining the IOS?
004. I can imagine the goings on in casa offices. Tin hats on and keep head down.
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Hmmmm, small offices at airports hey Biccy? But what will happen to existing worm farms and ergonomic offices with robust pot plant selections? Will these be made redundant?
P.S Better wake old Terry and tell him the report has been released. He would have missed out on that news, he goes to bed at midday these days
P.S Better wake old Terry and tell him the report has been released. He would have missed out on that news, he goes to bed at midday these days
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The worm farms and pot plants should go through robust transformational change to ensure value for money for stakeholders and safety reasons can't argue with safety. Localized pot plants are safe pot plants.
Some pot plants could be donated to deserving senators with small pot plant allowances.
Some pot plants could be donated to deserving senators with small pot plant allowances.
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when you look at the influence ICAO has had on CAsA and you look at the huge areas of aviation that ICAO seem totally ignorant of, I have come to the conclusion that ICAO must be one of the dumbest organisations on the planet.
how can you dictate how countries regulate aviation while not even acknowledging that a great part of it even exists.
of course ICAO exist above government control so there is no sorting out their stupidity.
australia really is becoming a country I could permanently migrate from.
maybe for the next year we should all send minister truss an AA battery each week. inundate him with them. ....because a dildo(like him) should never be used without a fresh battery.
how can you dictate how countries regulate aviation while not even acknowledging that a great part of it even exists.
of course ICAO exist above government control so there is no sorting out their stupidity.
australia really is becoming a country I could permanently migrate from.
maybe for the next year we should all send minister truss an AA battery each week. inundate him with them. ....because a dildo(like him) should never be used without a fresh battery.
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minister truss this is just plain stupid....
the risk is on a per aircraft basis. the number of persons carried only changes the risk if your evaluation of risk is flawed.
you need to do better mate.
Risk in GA operations is generally proportional to the consequences: risk becomes greater as the number of persons carried on the aircraft increases, but given that operations are of small aircraft, there are usually few persons on the aircraft, lowering the risk.
you need to do better mate.
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this is quite wrong minister....
the problem is that the sheer volume of dribble emanating from CAsA actually masks and obscures the actual issues and has people thinking that irrelevant issues are most important.
....but then you wouldn't know....
Education and awareness building activities are also key to the lifting of safety standards in the private GA sector.
....but then you wouldn't know....
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in all honesty minister you haven't a bloody clue....
in self administration you say..
you really haven't a clue.
the success comes from the competence of the participants not any organisational structure you bureaucratic paper shufflers impose on them.
I know, you're a hammer so all the world is a nail.
in self administration you say..
The success of these groups is highly dependent on the governance, efficiency and knowledge of their governing bodies and it is on these areas that CASA has to concentrate its oversight activities.
the success comes from the competence of the participants not any organisational structure you bureaucratic paper shufflers impose on them.
I know, you're a hammer so all the world is a nail.
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Oh, it's not that bad; not too bad at all.
It's a strange wee confection, is the WLR. But before having a taste there are some formalities to observe.
I believe I could be persuaded to elevate The Honourable Warren Truss MP from miniscule to minister provided the promised changes are enforced (no other option really). The minister could have so very easily done an Albo and delivered a soft white paper elephant; but didn't. No matter the motivation - a promise was made and kept; a report was ordered and delivered. What the unspeakable Albo left behind for the minister to deal with was seriously ugly. The situation was disgusting enough on the surface and only the gods could know what was floating beneath. I sometimes forget that parliament is a stage show, there's that which the audience see and 'that what goes on' backstage. The minister (and team) must deal with both sides of the finished production. So, no matter what opinion you have of the show, one must acknowledge the investment, hard work and risks. Tricky thing, pleasing all the people, all the time. In short, this IOS member says 'thank you' to the member for Wide Bay.
Of course the minister was juggling hot coals: but not for too long. Said coals were dropped into the capable, heavily gloved hands of D Forsyth. Esq. and his merry men. Once again the options were open and the report could have gone either way. Realistically, the report could never, ever be a silver bullet, especially as the options for a band aid solutions became severely limited. Referee Forsyth stepped up as the scrums became fierce, and turned nasty. Cynicism and pragmatism aside, I reckon Forsyth has managed a difficult task quite well indeed. I propose D Forsyth Esq. be elevated to associate IOS membership and call on the Gobbledock to second the motion. Bravo that man, well done.
The final accolade must be for the industry – great job. Clarity, cohesion and the courage to say – enough is enough – has won some hard earned yards, some self respect and a positive place to start. Great start to the match from the alphabet groups and individuals. Bravo, bravo indeed; well played. Now is not the time to back off, play up and play dirty in the ruck. The opposition will, for the whole 80 minutes. Selah.
I digress. The report. I feel it would be a mistake to 'shoot from the hip' on this report and a quick skim of the executive summary won't do, not at all. As said, it's a strange confection. There are parts which, to me at least, are 'stilted'. These parts reflect the difficulty of writing a report which very publicly exposes some of the government 'sensitive' parts and the difficulties facing the industry, combined with a hysterical press and uninformed public. Changes in syntax clearly define the sensitive areas where the panel has been obliged to tread very carefully; but the message is there and well done for being able to keep that message in play.
Anyway you look at it, the report is a positive step. It sends a clear message, now it will be up to the industry, incoming DAS, Minister and Senate team to make sure it works out: the way it was intended. I do agree with Sandilands; McComic should be escorted from building at the earliest opportunity before an abuse of considerable power is used to pay old scores. I am certain Forsyth could manage to find a night watchman, caretaker if you like, for the next short while. IMO - McComic must be considered 'armed and dangerous', capable, with malice and aforethought of inflicting terrible damage; any of the 49 'ers will confirm this opinion. His batting partner Dolan is out in July anyway (hallelujah) and although he is relatively harmless; the two of them together do frighten the horses and terrify the smaller children. Anyway – why stay where no one wants you?
Once you find your way past the top 'fluff' and bottom waffle, there are about 40 pages to read which are powerful; given the report must be framed in 'understatement', diplomatic and comprehensible to those outside of industry vaguely interested. If we achieve all the recommendations, undiluted, properly executed; it will be a great step taken out the darkness toward the light.
Okey-dokey – Seconds away – Gloves off - Round two.
I believe I could be persuaded to elevate The Honourable Warren Truss MP from miniscule to minister provided the promised changes are enforced (no other option really). The minister could have so very easily done an Albo and delivered a soft white paper elephant; but didn't. No matter the motivation - a promise was made and kept; a report was ordered and delivered. What the unspeakable Albo left behind for the minister to deal with was seriously ugly. The situation was disgusting enough on the surface and only the gods could know what was floating beneath. I sometimes forget that parliament is a stage show, there's that which the audience see and 'that what goes on' backstage. The minister (and team) must deal with both sides of the finished production. So, no matter what opinion you have of the show, one must acknowledge the investment, hard work and risks. Tricky thing, pleasing all the people, all the time. In short, this IOS member says 'thank you' to the member for Wide Bay.
Of course the minister was juggling hot coals: but not for too long. Said coals were dropped into the capable, heavily gloved hands of D Forsyth. Esq. and his merry men. Once again the options were open and the report could have gone either way. Realistically, the report could never, ever be a silver bullet, especially as the options for a band aid solutions became severely limited. Referee Forsyth stepped up as the scrums became fierce, and turned nasty. Cynicism and pragmatism aside, I reckon Forsyth has managed a difficult task quite well indeed. I propose D Forsyth Esq. be elevated to associate IOS membership and call on the Gobbledock to second the motion. Bravo that man, well done.
The final accolade must be for the industry – great job. Clarity, cohesion and the courage to say – enough is enough – has won some hard earned yards, some self respect and a positive place to start. Great start to the match from the alphabet groups and individuals. Bravo, bravo indeed; well played. Now is not the time to back off, play up and play dirty in the ruck. The opposition will, for the whole 80 minutes. Selah.
I digress. The report. I feel it would be a mistake to 'shoot from the hip' on this report and a quick skim of the executive summary won't do, not at all. As said, it's a strange confection. There are parts which, to me at least, are 'stilted'. These parts reflect the difficulty of writing a report which very publicly exposes some of the government 'sensitive' parts and the difficulties facing the industry, combined with a hysterical press and uninformed public. Changes in syntax clearly define the sensitive areas where the panel has been obliged to tread very carefully; but the message is there and well done for being able to keep that message in play.
Anyway you look at it, the report is a positive step. It sends a clear message, now it will be up to the industry, incoming DAS, Minister and Senate team to make sure it works out: the way it was intended. I do agree with Sandilands; McComic should be escorted from building at the earliest opportunity before an abuse of considerable power is used to pay old scores. I am certain Forsyth could manage to find a night watchman, caretaker if you like, for the next short while. IMO - McComic must be considered 'armed and dangerous', capable, with malice and aforethought of inflicting terrible damage; any of the 49 'ers will confirm this opinion. His batting partner Dolan is out in July anyway (hallelujah) and although he is relatively harmless; the two of them together do frighten the horses and terrify the smaller children. Anyway – why stay where no one wants you?
Once you find your way past the top 'fluff' and bottom waffle, there are about 40 pages to read which are powerful; given the report must be framed in 'understatement', diplomatic and comprehensible to those outside of industry vaguely interested. If we achieve all the recommendations, undiluted, properly executed; it will be a great step taken out the darkness toward the light.
Page 70). Throughout this report, the Panel recommends changes that, if actioned, will contribute to the rebuilding of trust between the industry and CASA. Changing its regulatory philosophy is the most important shift that CASA must make. Coupled with a much stronger policy towards just culture, the Panel considers that the relationship between CASA and industry can reach a level of maturity where, as in many of the countries identified in Table 5, regulator access to safety data is no longer controversial.
Page 72). Although the Swedavia-McGregor Report was completed 25 years ago, the principles are still relevant today. The Panel considers that CASA should adopt an organisational structure similar to that developed for New Zealand, with modifications to suit the size and scope of the aviation community in Australia. The transformation envisaged in this concept, which is intended to structure CASA along the lines of industry’s activities (a client-oriented output model) rather than CASA’s activities, is depicted in Figure 8. Many variations of such a model are possible, and the proposal is not prescriptive. However, the key intention is to clarify accountability and improve the points of contact for the aviation community.
Last edited by Kharon; 3rd Jun 2014 at 20:17.
Firstly, thank you Minister Truss. I haven't read the entire report yet, just the executive summary but I believe that the review has delivered all that could reasonably be expected.
Without mincing words, the key finding is that the entire culture of CASA is toxic. Toxic to industry and toxic to its good staff. That is what words like "adversarial", "trust", "respect", "governance" and "just culture" strongly imply. All else follows from that. The question of adoption of FAA/NZ regulations is a bridge too far at present, but I would think it may naturally surface later if the rest of the changes are implemented.
However there's the rub; these are only recommendations and it is now up to the Government to respond and implement change.........
I personally would hope that a very senior person from Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet drives the Governments response and adopts all the recommendations and then some. I would also hope that the same person is appointed to the CASA Board with a mandate to drive change. I would also hope that the new Director is made responsible to the Board as in other organisations.
Make no mistake, the job of the New Director is going to be very, very difficult without total support of the Board, the Department and the Government because driving organisational change is notoriously difficult to do,especially breaking the alleged "iron ring" at the heart of the problem.
On the other hand, I suspect if Mr. Mrdak and company have drafted the governments response then any change at all will be cosmetic and the embuggerisation of all industry participants will continue unabated.
The ball is in the Governments court, we have to wait and watch.
P.S. Mc Cormick? Finished. Dolan the same.
PPS. Why was the Pel AIr ATSB report an "aberration"?
Without mincing words, the key finding is that the entire culture of CASA is toxic. Toxic to industry and toxic to its good staff. That is what words like "adversarial", "trust", "respect", "governance" and "just culture" strongly imply. All else follows from that. The question of adoption of FAA/NZ regulations is a bridge too far at present, but I would think it may naturally surface later if the rest of the changes are implemented.
However there's the rub; these are only recommendations and it is now up to the Government to respond and implement change.........
I personally would hope that a very senior person from Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet drives the Governments response and adopts all the recommendations and then some. I would also hope that the same person is appointed to the CASA Board with a mandate to drive change. I would also hope that the new Director is made responsible to the Board as in other organisations.
Make no mistake, the job of the New Director is going to be very, very difficult without total support of the Board, the Department and the Government because driving organisational change is notoriously difficult to do,especially breaking the alleged "iron ring" at the heart of the problem.
On the other hand, I suspect if Mr. Mrdak and company have drafted the governments response then any change at all will be cosmetic and the embuggerisation of all industry participants will continue unabated.
The ball is in the Governments court, we have to wait and watch.
P.S. Mc Cormick? Finished. Dolan the same.
PPS. Why was the Pel AIr ATSB report an "aberration"?
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PPS. Why was the Pel AIr ATSB report an "aberration"?
Dangly, I don't have enough bandwidth to list all the sections I would take the axe or wrecking ball to, but at a minimum;
- Bring in 'accountability' and remove protective legal freedom from prosecution for CAsA employees
- Replace all 3 DAS positions and a number of the Executives. (I won't name names but members of the IOS and government know who the stumbling blocks are)
- Keep the Board numbers at 4. No need for 2 more, but replace the current 4 with aviation experienced Board members who come with reputations of integrity.
- Changes to the way the ICC operates have been recommended thank god, but the present system is stacked and in my opinion a complete shonk. A complete overhaul and appointment of someone like Michael Hart is imperative.
- Complete removal/redundancy of the 'Iron Ring' has to proceed if a new CAsA that works harmoniously with industry is to be achieved. We know who they are. Time to change position descriptions and out these destroyers once and for all. You can't build a house if half of CAsA builds up a row of bricks while another part of CAsA pulls down 2 rows.
- Up skilling of management and inspectors in modern practises and not bureaucratic dark age methods is required.
- Transparency and equality with the application of rules and activities among the industry. As Sunny would put it in another way - If you are prepared to smash GA or an Ag operator for something then you should be able to bollock the big end of town as well. We all know that certain carriers are 'untouchable'.
- KPI's (which has been recommended). And penalties toward CAsA for breaking SLA's. Where a business is financially crushed due to CAsA incompetence there should be a method for repatriation and costs awarded.
- An end to the abuse of taxpayer funds and the never ending bottomless tin of money that funds endless legal pursuits of innocent people due to no better reason than a few egos and some pride has been dented. This is sanctioned government accepted abuse.
- Annual ANAO and other accepted audits of CAsA finances and expenditure, legal activities, due processes, ethics, procedures, compliance with statutory laws and the Chicago convention.
For starters......
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If Pelair was an aberration, so was Whyalla. Should I mention Lockhart River, Seaview Monarch etc?
The ball has hit the net. It's not in anybody's court until the industry response is served and recommendations are subsequently adopted or not.
Change has occurred due to the IOS efforts, the most major demonstration of direct action by industry and players in my living history. I've been around since 1965 and never seen anything like it. Of note there has been no public disobedience or disorder and only the antagonist in this case can be seen to be guilty of abuse of power leading to a complete vote of no confidence by industry and highlighted in the recommendations.
This is a hiatus and it can be seen as pivotal whether we go up or down. Much thought and input is needed by industry and now would be a good time to mend old wounds, put ego's aside and unite all aviation interests to support a reply with a common theme that best fits the positive recommendations.
The ball has hit the net. It's not in anybody's court until the industry response is served and recommendations are subsequently adopted or not.
Change has occurred due to the IOS efforts, the most major demonstration of direct action by industry and players in my living history. I've been around since 1965 and never seen anything like it. Of note there has been no public disobedience or disorder and only the antagonist in this case can be seen to be guilty of abuse of power leading to a complete vote of no confidence by industry and highlighted in the recommendations.
This is a hiatus and it can be seen as pivotal whether we go up or down. Much thought and input is needed by industry and now would be a good time to mend old wounds, put ego's aside and unite all aviation interests to support a reply with a common theme that best fits the positive recommendations.
The only changes recommended that are likely to be acted upon is appointing more people to positions of power within the ATSB and CASA! An extra Commissioner for the ATSB who has significant aviation experience! Why not just replace the one we have at the moment? At the end of the day the industry has yet another report with yet more recommendations which the government of the day can choose to implement or ignore. Like the two Senate reports before it the recommendations show how far behind the rest of the world CASA is. One of CASA's primary roles is auditing yet the report states that it doesn't even do that properly and should get 3rd party contractors to help it out.
Watching these reports being wheeled out is like watching announcements from AJ about how he is going to turn QF around. Until something catastrophic happens it will be BAU, then it will be "how could something like this happen in Australia?" As one of the regular posters is fond of stating TICK TOCK!
Watching these reports being wheeled out is like watching announcements from AJ about how he is going to turn QF around. Until something catastrophic happens it will be BAU, then it will be "how could something like this happen in Australia?" As one of the regular posters is fond of stating TICK TOCK!
Right on cue...
From page 2 of The Australian dated 4 June 2014
And the funniest part is that most of you will fall for it (again).
… Mr Truss said the replacement of current CASA head John McCormick … and the creation of two new board positions would herald a “new start” for CASA. …