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Qantas poised to inject millions into Jetstar Japan

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Qantas poised to inject millions into Jetstar Japan

Old 6th Nov 2013, 09:47
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
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I'm wondering what Jacana could have said that is more offensive than V-jet's remarks.

Care to edit, V-jet?
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 09:55
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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I find it hilarious that a LCC be based out of Narita of all places no one wants to go to Narita to travel domestically, maybe if they did some regional flights but domestically it's almost comical....
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 10:35
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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I find it hilarious that a LCC is based in Japan !!
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 10:39
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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I find it hilarious that Qantas is going to be bought out by a LCC that they own.
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 15:35
  #65 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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I'm just sitting on an overnight and being bored, found this while I was surfing.

Real men with some real vision I think.

VH-JET#1 & Her Sisters - Qantas and the 707

If only Qantas had these people now.
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 19:44
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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No, no editing. And I don't see my comments as offensive. If senior management and the board are left to behave as they have (and I see nothing changing - if anything it's getting worse!) then Qantas will cease to exist.

I am of the 'die on your feet' rather than 'live on your knees' brigade, but I accept I am in the minority.

As I said in an engagement survey (and I got more creative than this over time) if I saw BGA and the board on fire, and it were at all possible to do so, I would get the largest barrel of petrol I could and take great delight in throwing it on them and watching them burn. Apparently that survey showed we were 70% engaged (or something ridiculous like that) so I concluded that I was probably engaged as I cared about what they were doing with my beautiful airline - just not the way one would normally expect.

I have read too many financial disaster books to be able to sit back and quietly accept what is being stolen and wilfully destroyed without at least voicing concerns in the strongest possible way.

I have been told by Qantas courses 'Captain you must listen' etc etc when something is wrong - consistently for 30ish years!! Why is it when the entire company is being flown past DPA with no fuel into a CATIII airport we are expected to sit back and say 'Thank god we have such inspired management!' ????
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 22:48
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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Well, I think you're right about the road that Q is going down. I haven't been here anywhere near as long as you, nor do I feel as strongly as you; I am not my job. But Q is in trouble, no doubt about it.

It is however offensive to suggest that your (our?) plight is comparable to Jews being force-loaded on a cattle truck for mass murder. Hasn't been, isn't now, won't be tomorrow.

So does anyone else wonder if J* Japan is going down the same road as J* HK? Lots of PR, lots of money (outgoing), but no reliable business as yet?

Last edited by Oktas8; 6th Nov 2013 at 23:55.
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Old 6th Nov 2013, 23:54
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Godwin's Law.
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 03:13
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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I guess the shareholders don't get a lot of say in the matter.... But why are the boardmembers falling into line like sheep?
All we hear in the trenches is that International is bleeding money
Seriously?
There is one QF flight to Narita/Tokyo per day from Australia ..... One !
It leaves from Sydney and is always full as a fat girls sock
If dollars have to go somewhere, how give us an ex-Melbourne or ex-Brisbane like we did before, and not feed Jet* ex-Gold Coast through Cairns
It grills my cheese to see this unfolding, but he'll probably hand the old ex-ML, BN, PH to Narita over to JAL
There goes our flying, and there goes QANTAS international
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 03:44
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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I'll possibly apologise for the cattle truck comments. FWIW my family had 6 Jews in their house in the war. I have some understanding of what was involved.

The mindset I was alluding to is the 'It can't be any worse where we're going'. The point is, as with 'that business' in Europe, is that it certainly can be....
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 05:52
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
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I guess the shareholders don't get a lot of say in the matter.... But why are the boardmembers falling into line like sheep?
All we hear in the trenches is that International is bleeding money
Seriously?
There is one QF flight to Narita/Tokyo per day from Australia ..... One !
It leaves from Sydney and is always full as a fat girls sock
If dollars have to go somewhere, how give us an ex-Melbourne or ex-Brisbane like we did before, and not feed Jet* ex-Gold Coast through Cairns
It grills my cheese to see this unfolding, but he'll probably hand the old ex-ML, BN, PH to Narita over to JAL
There goes our flying, and there goes QANTAS international

There are currently no direct links between BNE and Japan. JQ runs daily [maybe?] flights to NRT and KIX from OOL.. I don't have time to look it up now, but BITRE stats show that the Japan routes on JQ regularly sit below 70% load factor for most of the year... combine that with plenty of 2 for 1 sales... not sure how profitable the routes are for the ammmmmmaaaazing business.

On the other hand -- as mentioned above -- the daily QF NRT flight usually goes out full on a 744 -- is a nightmare to staff travel on and is above 86% load factor for most of the year..

Why they don't have another flight or to BNE/MEL escapes me.. even a couple of days a week..
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 09:07
  #72 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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Is it the fact, that the only way to get people to fly on the amazzzzzzzing business, is to remove the Qantas option, so they don't have a choice?
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 10:21
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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Yup, SOPS, does look that way

Maybe the media should get onto this from this angle ..... The deliberate killing of QF International

Then again, Anset died, and the average Joe didn't really care

We are watching history unfold, and are amused to death
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 10:35
  #74 (permalink)  
 
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It's a national tragedy . I still can't believe these clowns are getting away with this vandalism
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Old 7th Nov 2013, 12:24
  #75 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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SN, I posted the same thing about a year ago. Nothing has changed. It seems to me that they won't be happy until Qantas has gone altogether, and they can say "See, we were right, Jetstar is an amazzzzing business, Qantas was just a basket case loss maker"
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Old 25th Nov 2013, 02:39
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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In the locked thread, it was asked "how much QF had spent on JQ".
Not sure of the total investment when including JQ Intl, JQ NZ and JQ Australia, but the investment in Asia alone is estimated at over a quarter of a billion dollars.

Qantas Stumps Up $60M

Jetstar Japan - $50M annual loss
Jetstar Asia - $4M profit
Jetstar Pacific - Not turned a profit since Qantas invested
Jetstar NZ - Not disclosed but "we in here for the long haul" - David Hall
Jetstar HK - $66M investment, but no planes flying yet


Amazing!
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Old 25th Nov 2013, 02:48
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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Also no mention of JQ long haul. There also seems to be a link in the decline of QF profits with the growth of JQ. 2004-7 were record profits I believe (GFC aside)..
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Old 25th Nov 2013, 02:58
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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And a Quarter of a Billion Dollars is less than the cost of a single A380 (list is around US$350m)

Reality is with entirely leased aircraft there is not that much (relative to the rest of the airline) capital invested in the LCCs. And for this a large number of planes - 118 in all.
Japan - 17 A320s
Pacific - 5 A320s
Asia - 19 A320s, 3 A330s
Australia - 63 A320/321s, 11 A333/B788s
(source wikipedia, however accurate that is)

Mind you leasing planes means that you have to payoff all of that lease cost (effectively someone elses interest, depreciation and profit) before you make any money,
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Old 25th Nov 2013, 03:25
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Aren't all the JQ A330's owned or financed through Qantas and then "leased" to JQ at depreciation rate only?

Are the 787's financed the same way?
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Old 25th Nov 2013, 03:29
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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Its not the capital tied up in aircraft that's the issue, its the cash already burnt. A lot of cash has been poured into these entities with very little to show for it. That capital is gone, and can only be recouped through a sale of the businesses.

The question is can QF afford to keep shovelling money into the endless cash pits of Asia? The analysts & market say no. If they go bust or are shut down, this capital loss is crystallised & the capital evaporates into thin air, gone from the business forever. The only way out is a face saving sale at a firesale price or they are gifted to the local partners.
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