Righto...so whats wrong with Richmond for 2nd airport.
As for pull-up-terrain's issues with living in the Shire, spare a thought for the people in Sydney's North West, or further out West.
The flloodplain north of Richmond can never be built on for reidential housing, so a perfect spot for an airport.
Newcastle, Canberra will eventualy become international airports in their own right, serving their local population bases. But not as a 2nd sydney airport.
Fog at Richmond, cat 3 ILS solves that problem, only been doing that for 40 years in Europe and the USA.
Terrain around richmond, cant see that as a big problem, an annoying one for sure. Have a look at the IFR letdowns into Innsbruck. Right down a narrow valley with mountains 8,000 above airport elevation 4nm either side.
RAAF not allowing civies into their airports.......who the bloody hell runs the country, tha RAAF????.........I sure as hell didnt vote for Wing Commander such and such.
Sydney needs a 2nd airport in the Sydney basin, no where else.
Badgereys Creek is right in the middle of the expansion are for houses, non sensical to put an airport there.
Wilton, thats a red herring staight out of the script of yes Minister. Sir Humprey Appleby would be most impressed.
The Egyptians (and others) built the Suez Cannal 150 years ago. we cant even dam off a floodplain. Kinda sums up Australia.
Newcastle, Canberra will eventualy become international airports in their own right, serving their local population bases. But not as a 2nd sydney airport.
Fog at Richmond, cat 3 ILS solves that problem, only been doing that for 40 years in Europe and the USA.
Terrain around richmond, cant see that as a big problem, an annoying one for sure. Have a look at the IFR letdowns into Innsbruck. Right down a narrow valley with mountains 8,000 above airport elevation 4nm either side.
RAAF not allowing civies into their airports.......who the bloody hell runs the country, tha RAAF????.........I sure as hell didnt vote for Wing Commander such and such.
Sydney needs a 2nd airport in the Sydney basin, no where else.
Badgereys Creek is right in the middle of the expansion are for houses, non sensical to put an airport there.
Wilton, thats a red herring staight out of the script of yes Minister. Sir Humprey Appleby would be most impressed.
The Egyptians (and others) built the Suez Cannal 150 years ago. we cant even dam off a floodplain. Kinda sums up Australia.
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Who runs the Country?
Ozgrade3, bloody good question. Of course the RAAF do not run the country. Neither is the current Federal Government doing much of a job of it either. Your suggestion that the floodplain to the north of Richmond be built up and the airfield expanded is probably not implausible, but it won't happen in my lifetime nor yours most likely.
As for the RAAF not allowing civilian aircraft to use their facility, don't think that is the case. Many airfields are shared and have been for years. The RAAF may control airspace around airfields, but they give clearances to non military aircraft to use that airspace and the associated airfields. Maybe you did not vote for Wing Commander So and So, but just remember that maybe someday you might appreciate him or her as they fight to keep you free to fly around in this country.
As for the RAAF not allowing civilian aircraft to use their facility, don't think that is the case. Many airfields are shared and have been for years. The RAAF may control airspace around airfields, but they give clearances to non military aircraft to use that airspace and the associated airfields. Maybe you did not vote for Wing Commander So and So, but just remember that maybe someday you might appreciate him or her as they fight to keep you free to fly around in this country.
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Holsworthy
It doesn't get mentioned much. As ULTRALIGHTS mentioned, land is there, aligned for a 3rd runway Sydney. Centrally located. Easy to put in a short high speed rail link between airports with connections to anywhere else on the rail system. M5 feeds into it. The military could easily be moved to that large base they have near Cobbitty and still have rapid response for Sydney from there. Bankstown a/port shouldn't interfere and could also be linked. Seems like a no brainer. Am I missing something??
There is a reason why Holsworthy has not got a large strip, any earthworks in the area run the risk of unexplored ordinance and it's a tad close to a radioactive restricted area. To quote a 1995 report on the second airport proposals: The 1985 SSP rejected Holsworthy because of irresolvable airspace conflicts with Bankstown Airport, which would have to close, as well as the unexploded ordnance issue. Consequently, Holsworthy was not included in the ranking process which led to the short-list of two sites.
Last edited by markis10; 17th May 2012 at 22:27.
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Shame they can't find and remove any old ordinance which will have to be done at some stage anyway you would think. Relocate Bankstown to Holsworthy(that would keep it busy initially) or a new runway at Badgery's creek(there's land still set aside if the previous scenario is untenable). Let the developers take Bankstown. That would cover a lot of the costs $$$. Radioactive area?? Not good for the middle of Sydney, can't they clean that up and remove it as well?? Sounds like killing 2 or 3 birds with the one stone.
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rj27 He I believe would be referring to the just rebuilt nuclear reactor at Lucas Heights.
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It appears that much of the talk re Badgery's, Wilton, etc. is for an aerodrome to replace KSA; likewise much of the talk around RIC & Willy (such as teh RAAF study quoted above) appears to be for them to become 'major' civil fields.
We have to assume that KSA will remain the primary for years - decades - to come. But could not RIC and Willy become - not major civil fields, but overflows?
Riccy could have a limited number of A320 / 737-sized, short- and mid-range services, meaning no runway extension, limited impact on military operations and a viable alternative for anyone north and west of Parramatta - even if available destinations were only (say) MEL, BNE and ADL (and the odd AKL perhaps). Stick a cat III in and the fog issue is largely addressed.
As for Willy, the Newcastle / Hunter area has sufficient population to act as its own catchment, and it is too far from Sydney to be a 'second' Sydney airport - again naturally limiting ops to the extent that there would be no threat to mil ops.
So if each of RIC & WIL took 10-15 services a day, that's 30 slot pairs a day opened up at YSSY. Even 24 services between 06.00-18.00 would be only 2 arrivals and 2 departures per hour - one every 15 minutes - would that seriously stuff up military ops?
We have to assume that KSA will remain the primary for years - decades - to come. But could not RIC and Willy become - not major civil fields, but overflows?
Riccy could have a limited number of A320 / 737-sized, short- and mid-range services, meaning no runway extension, limited impact on military operations and a viable alternative for anyone north and west of Parramatta - even if available destinations were only (say) MEL, BNE and ADL (and the odd AKL perhaps). Stick a cat III in and the fog issue is largely addressed.
As for Willy, the Newcastle / Hunter area has sufficient population to act as its own catchment, and it is too far from Sydney to be a 'second' Sydney airport - again naturally limiting ops to the extent that there would be no threat to mil ops.
So if each of RIC & WIL took 10-15 services a day, that's 30 slot pairs a day opened up at YSSY. Even 24 services between 06.00-18.00 would be only 2 arrivals and 2 departures per hour - one every 15 minutes - would that seriously stuff up military ops?
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SACL has ended the debate
They have told the minister they will exercise their option over the 2nd airport.
They will now take their time, doing it where they want, when they want.
It will be driven by airline demand and shareholder willingness to invest.
Government at both levels have been hoist by their own petards.
Max the Axe proving once again that no matter where he is, he is the smartest man in the room. Nothing to see here now folks.
They will now take their time, doing it where they want, when they want.
It will be driven by airline demand and shareholder willingness to invest.
Government at both levels have been hoist by their own petards.
Max the Axe proving once again that no matter where he is, he is the smartest man in the room. Nothing to see here now folks.
