Qantas Asia Business Model
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Qantas Asia Business Model
A sneak peek at the Qantas Asia business model, how it'll effect cabin crew and the immorality of the Qantas group.
Jetstar accused of exploiting cabin crew - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
Jetstar accused of exploiting cabin crew - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
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Difference between Tiger & Thai Airways events are we can view the data on webtrack or QAR data.
As for the Jetstar case the precursor to an operational event is the crew self reports.
Would CASA care to comment?
As for the Jetstar case the precursor to an operational event is the crew self reports.
Would CASA care to comment?
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Does this entire situation sit comfortably within the widely spruiked ICAO 'Just Cultue' policy ?
Is this situation 'wolds best practise' ?
Is this truly safety first ?
Is this situation 'wolds best practise' ?
Is this truly safety first ?
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AM - Jetstar rebuts fatigue claims 28/07/2011
Employees of this airline are now delivered to the aircraft by "suppliers" and "providers"and if they , "these people",have a problem with fatigue according to Buchanan can "write to me".
This is a truely toxic outfit.
Employees of this airline are now delivered to the aircraft by "suppliers" and "providers"and if they , "these people",have a problem with fatigue according to Buchanan can "write to me".
This is a truely toxic outfit.
You just need to see where management are coming from.
Best practice - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Nothing in the accepted definition of best practice mentions treating staff in accordance with best practice. It's a buzzword of todays globalisation focused world. It's all about seeing who can cut the most and following that guy. If they able to get away with forcing staff to work potentially unlimited hours in a country, obviously that's Best Practice.
Best Practice has got nothing to do with treating staff like anything else except a measurable number on a piece of paper. Why do we all think there is so many consultants like Bain & Co at Qantas. They're measuring all of us against the lowest common denominators out there, in Thailand, Phillipines, Mainland China etc.
Management 101 - leave your morals at the door thanks.
Best practice - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Nothing in the accepted definition of best practice mentions treating staff in accordance with best practice. It's a buzzword of todays globalisation focused world. It's all about seeing who can cut the most and following that guy. If they able to get away with forcing staff to work potentially unlimited hours in a country, obviously that's Best Practice.
Best Practice has got nothing to do with treating staff like anything else except a measurable number on a piece of paper. Why do we all think there is so many consultants like Bain & Co at Qantas. They're measuring all of us against the lowest common denominators out there, in Thailand, Phillipines, Mainland China etc.
Management 101 - leave your morals at the door thanks.
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Listening to BB's response, leaves me with more unanswered questions:
1. In the senate inquiry, I was led to believe that J* had a very robust safety reporting system. Why is it then, that the first J* has heard of the fatigue report (Thai crew) was thru the media?
2. J* claim to have a "Just Culture" & Fatigue management system. However both have failed on this occasion. Do the service providers in Asia operate to the Just culture system"?
3. What has actually changed as a result of all the cabin crew "Oscar" reports, is fatigue being managed? Or are reports just filed away?
4. BB stated that AIPA wanted Qantas pilots in Jetstar jobs which is incorrect as per AIPA's claim.
5. Why is it that Jetstar employees feel compelled to go to the media as opposed to Jetstar management? Do they not trust the safety reporting system?
6. Didn't Jetstar learn from the "Toughen up princess" letter? More letters to staff bullying when reporting fatigued.
7. Does it not concern Jetstar, Qantas or CASA that they don't have "control" due minority stakes in their service providers?
8. BB stated he "encouraged" crew not to operate if fatigued. Should he have stated that J* don't permit as part of their policy any crew to operate who is fatigued?
9. BB response focussed on what happened to the crew after reporting fatigued. Why were the crew fatigued in the first place? Over worked / poor rostering / Long duties?
MC
1. In the senate inquiry, I was led to believe that J* had a very robust safety reporting system. Why is it then, that the first J* has heard of the fatigue report (Thai crew) was thru the media?
2. J* claim to have a "Just Culture" & Fatigue management system. However both have failed on this occasion. Do the service providers in Asia operate to the Just culture system"?
3. What has actually changed as a result of all the cabin crew "Oscar" reports, is fatigue being managed? Or are reports just filed away?
4. BB stated that AIPA wanted Qantas pilots in Jetstar jobs which is incorrect as per AIPA's claim.
5. Why is it that Jetstar employees feel compelled to go to the media as opposed to Jetstar management? Do they not trust the safety reporting system?
6. Didn't Jetstar learn from the "Toughen up princess" letter? More letters to staff bullying when reporting fatigued.
7. Does it not concern Jetstar, Qantas or CASA that they don't have "control" due minority stakes in their service providers?
8. BB stated he "encouraged" crew not to operate if fatigued. Should he have stated that J* don't permit as part of their policy any crew to operate who is fatigued?
9. BB response focussed on what happened to the crew after reporting fatigued. Why were the crew fatigued in the first place? Over worked / poor rostering / Long duties?
MC
I just posted this in another thread, thought it pertinent here as well;
Milgram
Milgram
VOLT S – 450 VOLT S” (Blass, 2004, p. 79). Initially, the “shocker” started giving a low voltage of what they believed was an actual shock, and they were then asked to gradually increase the voltage in response to suggestions from the experimenter, who would say things like:
1. Please continue.
2. The experiment requires that you continue.
3. It is absolutely essential that you continue.
4. You have no other choice, you must go on.
The experiment was intended to show just how far the “shocker” would go, based on receiving commands from someone in authority. This was all part of an experiment done at Yale. Predictions on how many people would be willing to continue to shock at high voltage levels were low … about 3%. In actuality, however, 65% were willing to give them the juice at the maximum level.
1. Please continue.
2. The experiment requires that you continue.
3. It is absolutely essential that you continue.
4. You have no other choice, you must go on.
The experiment was intended to show just how far the “shocker” would go, based on receiving commands from someone in authority. This was all part of an experiment done at Yale. Predictions on how many people would be willing to continue to shock at high voltage levels were low … about 3%. In actuality, however, 65% were willing to give them the juice at the maximum level.
Milgram had the following to say about the results: “Ordinary people, simply doing their jobs, and without any particular hostility on their part, can become agents in a terrible destructive process. Moreover, even when the destructive effects of their work become patently clear, and they are asked to carry out actions incompatible with fundamental standards of morality, relatively few people have the resources needed to resist authority”
I was astounded by Buchanan's response to Nick Xenophon's allegations this morning. His opinion of Richard Woodward was to be expected but to launch in boots and all into Nick Xenophon, frankly one of the few politicians I've seen with character and integrity was appalling.
Nick, you are one of the few politicians who seems to talk sense and the Australian public seem to have a great deal of respect for - myself included. I don't always agree with you but PLEASE keep going as you are.
Interesting to see a photo of Nick and Natasha Stott Despoja in the paper yesterday. I don't know if it's in the pipeline but any political party fronted by those two would get my vote.
Oh and Bruce, you've just accused Richard Woodward of misleading the senate enquiry. To do so would be a serious offense under Australian law so I assume you'll be providing evidence of his misconduct to the AFP? No, didn't think so.
And in addition I think it's disappointing that Senator Xenophon, you know who I've reached out to a number of times saying I'm available to, if he's got any enquires. And he chooses to raise these sorts of allegations in the media rather than pick up the phone.
And I think at this time more than any in Australia we really need some great political leaders and some real leadership and we're not getting it from our political leaders when they behave like this.
And I think at this time more than any in Australia we really need some great political leaders and some real leadership and we're not getting it from our political leaders when they behave like this.
Interesting to see a photo of Nick and Natasha Stott Despoja in the paper yesterday. I don't know if it's in the pipeline but any political party fronted by those two would get my vote.
Oh and Bruce, you've just accused Richard Woodward of misleading the senate enquiry. To do so would be a serious offense under Australian law so I assume you'll be providing evidence of his misconduct to the AFP? No, didn't think so.
Maybe they'll get Travolta back to revoice the safety video:
In the event of an emergency it is the cabin crew that is most important to you. These people are paid $7 per hour and may not have slept for 24 hours. Good luck with that!!
In the event of an emergency it is the cabin crew that is most important to you. These people are paid $7 per hour and may not have slept for 24 hours. Good luck with that!!
So the Thai cabin receive $258/month plus$7hr per flight hour. And BB tells the ABC that they earn up to $30k per annum
without busting the, load of crap, FRMS that the QF group have been forced to embrace.
That means they fly 74hrs a week with no annual leave
I think Bruce is using Allan's faulty calculator
When will this End
without busting the, load of crap, FRMS that the QF group have been forced to embrace.That means they fly 74hrs a week with no annual leave
I think Bruce is using Allan's faulty calculator
When will this End
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Contact Qantas | Contact Centres and Office Contacts
Qantas Bangkok Office IS Tour East Thailand.
Arms length? Minority Interest?
So the Jetstar Flight Attendant service provider is also the Qantas Office.
Qantas Bangkok Office IS Tour East Thailand.
Arms length? Minority Interest?
So the Jetstar Flight Attendant service provider is also the Qantas Office.
And I'm being fair dinkum too! 
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When will this End
- When experienced airline managers actually run the airline
- When safety driven and safety focused managers actually run the airline
- When the public, politicans and entire aviation community say enough is enough
- Hopefully before a smoking hole graces the front page of The Australian
- When personal greed, never ending pissing contests and over inflated ego's are removed from the aviation industry's core
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BB stated in the papers that the average hours worked by Thai crew was 24 hrs ,so if you do the maths total renumeration for the year is 11832 for the average worker.$258/month plus$7hr per flight hour.What did he tell the senate
BARBARA MILLER: Five Thai based crew though said that they'd felt too tired to operate a Sydney to Melbourne flight and were castigated for that and asked by their Thai based employer to give guarantees that they would not repeat that behaviour.
That surely is unacceptable.
BRUCE BUCHANAN: That is unacceptable. And that's why we've gone back to the supplier when we were aware of the allegations yesterday and said this is unacceptable.
We've told TET who recruit cabin crew on our behalf, and there's a number of these sorts of suppliers in countries like Thailand and Singapore and Asian markets where they recruit crew for a number of airlines.
And we've said, look that may be acceptable to other airlines where you chastise and intimidate them. But that's just not just part of the standards of the Qantas Group and we find it unacceptable that you've issued these letters.
That surely is unacceptable.
BRUCE BUCHANAN: That is unacceptable. And that's why we've gone back to the supplier when we were aware of the allegations yesterday and said this is unacceptable.
We've told TET who recruit cabin crew on our behalf, and there's a number of these sorts of suppliers in countries like Thailand and Singapore and Asian markets where they recruit crew for a number of airlines.
And we've said, look that may be acceptable to other airlines where you chastise and intimidate them. But that's just not just part of the standards of the Qantas Group and we find it unacceptable that you've issued these letters.
So here we are folks; Qantas is paying its senior management top dollars to implement a foreign labour hire strategy that any Two bit property developer could have done for almost nothing..... So much for grand strategy, this is pure, simple, stupid, pointless idiocy on behalf of Qantas.
This folks is the "supplier/fulfillment" business model in all it sordid, **** covered, smelly glory.
The theory goes that the value of Qantas is in the brand and nothing else. The theory goes that all the components that go to make up the airline are merely "business inputs" that can be provided by "suppliers" who will provide the required product or service for a simple fee.
In this theory, you are not a "pilot" but a "provider of piloting services". Qantas simply pays someone to provide "piloting services" and that is the end of it. The folks who do all this are called "supply chain managers".
The idea behind all this is that risk is systematically removed, or so Qantas management thinks. They don't have to worry about care and feeding of employees, retirement, training, rosters, etc. etc. One simple monthly fee to the supplier takes care of all that.
The ultimate abstraction of this business model has the senior management and Board sipping champagne as the only employees of the business, with literally everything else being contracted out - pilots, engineering, cabin crew, wet leased aircraft - the lot. All the owners have to do is collect the money and pay the suppliers.
The trouble with this wonderful concept is a little matter called "value added" Every one of your suppliers in this beautiful construct takes away a tiny little morsel of your value added. Furthermore, and what is worse, it denies you any chance of adding extra value - because that requires staff to do something more than they contracted for. This is where this model trips and falls flat on its face like Qantas is in the process of doing.
So lets take our Thai Jetstar cabin crew....
When there is an over run, accident and fire at Darwin or Den Pasar, I will say right now that I expect that those Thai Cabin crew will be first off the aircraft and to hell with you and your family. Did they contract to die fighting bravely for the lives of their Qantas passengers? No way! They are simply contractors.
Mother gets asthma and requires a drink of water in flight? No way, I'm just a contractor.
Same with engineers and pilots - sorry fella, I just do as I'm told, fixing your problems is not covered by my pay grade.
I've told my son I'll disinherit him if he flies Jetstar anywhere, and I mean it.
The model was made to work by guys like Lindsay Fox, Toll and Patrick, but even some of their customers are taking their logistics back inside because they were losing control.