Qantas Pilots, You Are Losing The Battle.
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These days you need both to run a successful campaign. A number of people use either social media or traditional media exclusively (divided by age in general, although not exclusively). A growing majority use both.
The traditional media also sponge off social media to pick trends and public interest items. They don't usually credit their sources but if you follow both you can pick up where the print/tv journos are getting their ideas from.
Look at the political parties, unions, charities and interest groups; they all use social media to push their barrows. You can't rely on it to generate sustained public interest because of the huge amount of white noise these sites carry (and they are effectively worldwide gossip networks) but if you do it right you can reach a large number of interested people regularly. If your messages are thought provoking, entertaining and informative, that number of people will grow exponentially.
As long as whoever is running the page can get the right balance between keeping people interested and boring the pants off them with crappy updates (and as long as they spray for trolls regularly) F'book is an effective and free way of bypassing the whole Editor's desk story-graveyard.
There was no social media in 89. There was no PPRuNe and we were not all having this virtual conversation. In 89, if you wanted to find out what was happening you picked up a mag/newspaper or switched on your tv and learned what Murdoch, Black, Packer et al wanted you to hear. You had a small circle of friends and colleagues who heard other stuff, but it was limited to Who You Knew and What They'd Heard. In 2011 you can fire up your computer or phone and find out what's trendy in Chad this week.
If there had been bulletin boards, social media and similar in 89, the outcome may have been different.
The traditional media also sponge off social media to pick trends and public interest items. They don't usually credit their sources but if you follow both you can pick up where the print/tv journos are getting their ideas from.
Look at the political parties, unions, charities and interest groups; they all use social media to push their barrows. You can't rely on it to generate sustained public interest because of the huge amount of white noise these sites carry (and they are effectively worldwide gossip networks) but if you do it right you can reach a large number of interested people regularly. If your messages are thought provoking, entertaining and informative, that number of people will grow exponentially.
As long as whoever is running the page can get the right balance between keeping people interested and boring the pants off them with crappy updates (and as long as they spray for trolls regularly) F'book is an effective and free way of bypassing the whole Editor's desk story-graveyard.
There was no social media in 89. There was no PPRuNe and we were not all having this virtual conversation. In 89, if you wanted to find out what was happening you picked up a mag/newspaper or switched on your tv and learned what Murdoch, Black, Packer et al wanted you to hear. You had a small circle of friends and colleagues who heard other stuff, but it was limited to Who You Knew and What They'd Heard. In 2011 you can fire up your computer or phone and find out what's trendy in Chad this week.
If there had been bulletin boards, social media and similar in 89, the outcome may have been different.
Last edited by Worrals in the wilds; 31st May 2011 at 14:05. Reason: inneffective spelling of effective
Job123,
I have seen that page. But can other people, not just the person who liked it, see the info?
I see things written on people's wall that I'm not even friends with. We need mass distribution, to everybody, even the people who don't want it.
Plus, AIPA need to send everyone an email telling them to like this page, there are 2500 Mainline pilots, last time I looked there 92 people who had liked the page.
I have seen that page. But can other people, not just the person who liked it, see the info?
I see things written on people's wall that I'm not even friends with. We need mass distribution, to everybody, even the people who don't want it.
Plus, AIPA need to send everyone an email telling them to like this page, there are 2500 Mainline pilots, last time I looked there 92 people who had liked the page.
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It's on here - Pprune is all we need
The traditional media also sponge off social media to pick trends and public interest items. They don't usually credit their sources but if you follow both you can pick up where the print/tv journos are getting their ideas from.
If there had been bulletin boards, social media and similar in 89, the outcome may have been different.
The real Qantas kamikaze - to be sure to be sure | Daily Telegraph Miranda Devine Blog
When this story was published it only had 14 comments, but when Miranda returned from her weekend the comments jumped to 60 last count. I suggest we monitor these stories from pprune. The range problem DFW - SYD is a fine example of the risk taking the bean counters are prepared to take, (having the right equipment helps) sadly as I scan the mainstream media today, they simply just don't get it.
It is my view, we need to come up with a thread name that we can request to become a sticky from the mods to become the media thread for all to see. Collectively, we have some great writing talent on here who would help get the real message across to the punter and media.
There is no doubt in my mind, this current lot of managers have trashed the Q brand and now are so desperate to save face they will go to any lengths to get the message out "it's all the staffs fault," which is not the case at all!
From another thread Qantas board split - Joyce to go? a brilliant post from B772
The shareholders must be getting nervous about the financial performance of QF for the last few years.
Morningstar advise the current total investment return as follows:
Over 1 Year -16.4%
Over 3 years -13.2% per year average
Over 5 Years -3.9% per year average
Over 10 years -0.5% per year average
Over the last 3.5 years the share price has dropped from $6.06 in October 2007 to a low of $1.38 in March 2009. They are currently finding support just over $2.00.
Since Clifford and Joyce have been at the helm the financial performance has been a disaster with long term investors seeing their returns wiped out. The index stocks show an average return of 9.1% per year average over 10 years. (BHP is 18.8% over 10 years)
History suggests the performance of a company is a reflection of its management. QF has been sadly lacking since Dixon was appointed.
Morningstar advise the current total investment return as follows:
Over 1 Year -16.4%
Over 3 years -13.2% per year average
Over 5 Years -3.9% per year average
Over 10 years -0.5% per year average
Over the last 3.5 years the share price has dropped from $6.06 in October 2007 to a low of $1.38 in March 2009. They are currently finding support just over $2.00.
Since Clifford and Joyce have been at the helm the financial performance has been a disaster with long term investors seeing their returns wiped out. The index stocks show an average return of 9.1% per year average over 10 years. (BHP is 18.8% over 10 years)
History suggests the performance of a company is a reflection of its management. QF has been sadly lacking since Dixon was appointed.
Last edited by TIMA9X; 1st Jun 2011 at 01:28. Reason: typo
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A satirical video or two on You Tube might not go astray either
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Jossell and Wirthless is good but the mainstream wouldn't follow it. I, on the other hand tune in quite regularly!
Just waiting for the share market to drag itself above 5000/5200 and I'm going to sell my GFC bargain QF shares.
As for video ideas. One idea would be to use the 730 report where AJ praises the QF 32 pilots and then in the next frame a 730 report where he bags them. Next the paper article about being middle of the road and then the announcement of J* moving toward the business class market. There would be many clips from the Senate Inquiry that would be good value. Throw in some Dixon Jackson gold WRT the failed corporate take over and a few cartel fine headlines with a bit of Jitconnict and there you have it!
Just waiting for the share market to drag itself above 5000/5200 and I'm going to sell my GFC bargain QF shares.
As for video ideas. One idea would be to use the 730 report where AJ praises the QF 32 pilots and then in the next frame a 730 report where he bags them. Next the paper article about being middle of the road and then the announcement of J* moving toward the business class market. There would be many clips from the Senate Inquiry that would be good value. Throw in some Dixon Jackson gold WRT the failed corporate take over and a few cartel fine headlines with a bit of Jitconnict and there you have it!
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Top Advice for Qantas management
Sack the whole lot; close the airline for a few months. Get CASA to accept all bona fide pilot qualifications from the world over, then hire all the talents available. Get rid of this insular Australian crap; get rid of all the prima donnas who think Australia owe them a job. In the interim JetStar, Tiger, SQ, Air NZ etc can operate the necessary air services. QED.
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Hmmm! Arrogance, conceit and not learning from past mistakes is a recipe for disaster.
Have you not heard about the 89' pilots dispute?
Are you not aware that scab pilots from overseas are still flying with Qantas today, and also with Virgin and Jetstar?
Are you really all that thick?
Do you really think the travelling public gives a stuff about you?
If you do, you get my 'Goose of the year' award!
Can't you see the satire in Aka Dals post?
Have you not heard about the 89' pilots dispute?
Are you not aware that scab pilots from overseas are still flying with Qantas today, and also with Virgin and Jetstar?
Are you really all that thick?
Do you really think the travelling public gives a stuff about you?
If you do, you get my 'Goose of the year' award!
Can't you see the satire in Aka Dals post?
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Amos, AIPA aren't about to make the mistakes of '89.
AIPA won't:
1. Be taking on the PM of the days' "crowning achievement": The Accord
2. Be taking on a Newspaper magnate's plaything: his airline,
3. Be operating outside the laws of the land;
4. Be taking any action that will allow QF to sue or sack it's members,
5. Be taking any action that would completely shut down a vital sector of the economy.
6. Be asking it's members to supply a signed resignation.
7. Be taking any action without a reasonable fall-back position,
8. Be taking any action that would FAIL to remove the competitive disadvantage of QF over other airline, e.g. have the only two competitors striking at the same time.
9. Thinking that because we have never lost a fight before, it can't happen this time either.
10. Be ignoring the Industrial umpire.
11. Be making a 29% pay claim.
Now you tell me.... Have we learnt from '89 or haven't we?
AIPA won't:
1. Be taking on the PM of the days' "crowning achievement": The Accord
2. Be taking on a Newspaper magnate's plaything: his airline,
3. Be operating outside the laws of the land;
4. Be taking any action that will allow QF to sue or sack it's members,
5. Be taking any action that would completely shut down a vital sector of the economy.
6. Be asking it's members to supply a signed resignation.
7. Be taking any action without a reasonable fall-back position,
8. Be taking any action that would FAIL to remove the competitive disadvantage of QF over other airline, e.g. have the only two competitors striking at the same time.
9. Thinking that because we have never lost a fight before, it can't happen this time either.
10. Be ignoring the Industrial umpire.
11. Be making a 29% pay claim.
Now you tell me.... Have we learnt from '89 or haven't we?
Ouch! After telling us (again after a couple of decades) what AIPA will not do, you must have QF management, the public, the shareholders and the government quaking in their boots...
Last edited by Captain Dart; 1st Jun 2011 at 09:19.
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The point is, that the lessons of '89 have been well and truly learnt. The 89'ers in here crying doom offer no plausible alternative to industrial action.
QF pilots do not wish to go down this path. The fact that we are considering it should be a signal as to the gravity of the situation we are faced with.
Personally, it is the second last thing I would rather do. The last is doing nothing.
We have heard and heeded the warnings. It is not your fight. Let us get on wth it.
QF pilots do not wish to go down this path. The fact that we are considering it should be a signal as to the gravity of the situation we are faced with.
Personally, it is the second last thing I would rather do. The last is doing nothing.
We have heard and heeded the warnings. It is not your fight. Let us get on wth it.
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"Maybe just sit and do nothing"... Well, that's what we have been doing and look where we are...
- 80 pilots threatened with redudancy last year, if we didn't come up with 80 million in savings! (...how much was that fine again?).
- Tasman flying all now done by Jetconnect, while the B767 pilots are forced to waste their long service leave to make up for the lost flying!
-Night freight work gone to the lowest bidder... Again, flying that the B767 used to do!
- Pushed well down the line, when it comes to staff travel and generally not shown any respect for supposedly "senior members of the company"... We have now been called "kamakazees", "rouges" and we're all living in "cloud cuckoo land"... Gee, I wouldn't want anyone like that holding a position of responsibility!
So that's what a GOOD relationship with the company gets you!
- 80 pilots threatened with redudancy last year, if we didn't come up with 80 million in savings! (...how much was that fine again?).
- Tasman flying all now done by Jetconnect, while the B767 pilots are forced to waste their long service leave to make up for the lost flying!
-Night freight work gone to the lowest bidder... Again, flying that the B767 used to do!
- Pushed well down the line, when it comes to staff travel and generally not shown any respect for supposedly "senior members of the company"... We have now been called "kamakazees", "rouges" and we're all living in "cloud cuckoo land"... Gee, I wouldn't want anyone like that holding a position of responsibility!
So that's what a GOOD relationship with the company gets you!