Qantas Pilots, You Are Losing The Battle.
Thread Starter
Tuner says you are helpless.
Keg says wait till later.
With respect, neither of you understand the subject.
Waiting is no use. Public perceptions of the pilots are being built brick by brick, day by day. The airline keeps piling it on week by week and it builds up and sticks in peoples minds......."flyboys", "$500,000 paypacket"......mmmmh get me a beer and change to channel Seven, "pocket $200,000", "free flights anywhere in the world"......mmmh change to Channel Ten..
These are what are called "sounds bites" and they are the only thing that stick in most peoples minds for more than five seconds and they build up and clog peoples brains as they are supposed to.
The only counter to this is to produce your own sound bites, and it must be done professionally and it has to be done right now. On another thread the Panther did a reasonable job : "Qantasia" is an excellent sound bite. It summarises what Joyce wants to do to the airline. You need many, many more sound bites right now, starting with a lot about greedy managers, dodgy Chinese quality - it can be as xenophobic as you like because sound bites appeal to peoples vices, not virtues.
But it needs to be done now and got out through social media, bar talk, emails, jokes, etc. etc. Paul Keating was a master at this, remember his plan for tax increases and his crack about the dangers of getting between a Yuppy and a pile of money?
I've heard this same "all in good time" argument about starting PR campaigns and every time people did this, they f%^d it up. Do it now. Prior planning prevents piss poor etc.,etc.
Now to Tuners point you are not helpless at all!!!!! Firstly journos are lazy. The idea of good PR is to write the story for them, that's what press releases are about, however if you don't get them out there, and plenty of them, why the f&*k would a bored and busy journalist take the time to really find out what you are going on about? He gets a press release from Qantas with a juicy quote from AJ, he gets SFA from your union or a stiffly worded denial of what AJ said. What the f%^k is the journo going to do? He cuts and pastes the Qantas press release and in the last sentence, which most d1ckheads won't even get to he writes "AIPA officials denied this claim" or "AIPA officials were unavailable for comment."
You need a PR genius who can write nice, juicy, sweet, tender stories that are just as malicious and venomous as the Qantas stuff. You don't want the Captain of QF32 spouting about pay rates, you want the head of the union saying "send that f&**ing Irish Leprechaun back where he came from, we don't need his type in Australia to tell us how to run an airline. Qantas is staffed and run by Australians and we mean to keep it that way"; that will make the papers.
And of course all publicity is good publicity, the papers can then run an apology to an outraged AJ and the Irish community and a photo of the head of AIPA drinking Guiness with someone Irish. Result: The public now knows who the head of the AIPA is and what he stands for, and a lot will agree with him....and of course every time after that when they see AJ on television they will think....."fukcing irish leprechaun" and stop believing him.
If you do not understand how all this works I can't help you. If you don't understand that media is a blood sport I can't help you. The fight you are in does not operate by Marquis of Queensberry rules. Get professional help, fast.
Keg says wait till later.
With respect, neither of you understand the subject.
Waiting is no use. Public perceptions of the pilots are being built brick by brick, day by day. The airline keeps piling it on week by week and it builds up and sticks in peoples minds......."flyboys", "$500,000 paypacket"......mmmmh get me a beer and change to channel Seven, "pocket $200,000", "free flights anywhere in the world"......mmmh change to Channel Ten..
These are what are called "sounds bites" and they are the only thing that stick in most peoples minds for more than five seconds and they build up and clog peoples brains as they are supposed to.
The only counter to this is to produce your own sound bites, and it must be done professionally and it has to be done right now. On another thread the Panther did a reasonable job : "Qantasia" is an excellent sound bite. It summarises what Joyce wants to do to the airline. You need many, many more sound bites right now, starting with a lot about greedy managers, dodgy Chinese quality - it can be as xenophobic as you like because sound bites appeal to peoples vices, not virtues.
But it needs to be done now and got out through social media, bar talk, emails, jokes, etc. etc. Paul Keating was a master at this, remember his plan for tax increases and his crack about the dangers of getting between a Yuppy and a pile of money?
I've heard this same "all in good time" argument about starting PR campaigns and every time people did this, they f%^d it up. Do it now. Prior planning prevents piss poor etc.,etc.
Now to Tuners point you are not helpless at all!!!!! Firstly journos are lazy. The idea of good PR is to write the story for them, that's what press releases are about, however if you don't get them out there, and plenty of them, why the f&*k would a bored and busy journalist take the time to really find out what you are going on about? He gets a press release from Qantas with a juicy quote from AJ, he gets SFA from your union or a stiffly worded denial of what AJ said. What the f%^k is the journo going to do? He cuts and pastes the Qantas press release and in the last sentence, which most d1ckheads won't even get to he writes "AIPA officials denied this claim" or "AIPA officials were unavailable for comment."
You need a PR genius who can write nice, juicy, sweet, tender stories that are just as malicious and venomous as the Qantas stuff. You don't want the Captain of QF32 spouting about pay rates, you want the head of the union saying "send that f&**ing Irish Leprechaun back where he came from, we don't need his type in Australia to tell us how to run an airline. Qantas is staffed and run by Australians and we mean to keep it that way"; that will make the papers.
And of course all publicity is good publicity, the papers can then run an apology to an outraged AJ and the Irish community and a photo of the head of AIPA drinking Guiness with someone Irish. Result: The public now knows who the head of the AIPA is and what he stands for, and a lot will agree with him....and of course every time after that when they see AJ on television they will think....."fukcing irish leprechaun" and stop believing him.
If you do not understand how all this works I can't help you. If you don't understand that media is a blood sport I can't help you. The fight you are in does not operate by Marquis of Queensberry rules. Get professional help, fast.
Last edited by Sunfish; 27th May 2011 at 22:53.
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Sunfish - Your words are quite wise and I agree with most the content. When I did my media training I was taught to stick to 5 key points and to keep repeating them over and over again. The points can't be 25 words sentences, just something as simple as "Qantasia". If you or anyone else can list the 5 key points that you think we, that is the Engineers and the Pilots, should be repeating over and over again, it would be much appreciated.
We have already ruled out "working families" and "moving forward".
We have already ruled out "working families" and "moving forward".
Clotted
The people are not in the know. The 2.5% is different from the payload scales. The payload scales are a union claim but it has no timetable for introduction and the union are not calling for it's introduction from day one of the agreement, also like all claims apart from job security it is up for negotiation, though from what the union tell us managment have spent little to no time actually discussing union claims.
Keg,
Quote:
Qantas pilots on average salary of $150K seek 2.6%
I'm told by people who claim to be in the know that if AIPA's pay claim succeeds you, as a 767 captain, stand to gain 2.6% pa CPI increase and an immediate increase of 7.5% because 767 pilots would be paid the same as 330 pilots and for anyone who hasn't got 12 years service in Qantas would immediately go to 12th year pay rate.
Quote:
Qantas pilots on average salary of $150K seek 2.6%
I'm told by people who claim to be in the know that if AIPA's pay claim succeeds you, as a 767 captain, stand to gain 2.6% pa CPI increase and an immediate increase of 7.5% because 767 pilots would be paid the same as 330 pilots and for anyone who hasn't got 12 years service in Qantas would immediately go to 12th year pay rate.
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Sunfish,
You are absolutely right but there is this overwhelming lack of response that beggars belief when so many are trying to support the good guys.
I know battles are not won on this site, but I watch news and read papers and I know what I am not seeing.
I want the Rat Execs exposed for what is happening but am getting tired of seeing nothing to even start the process to achieve that end.
I am even more surprised that the wisdom of you and others is being dismissed by a wait and see approach without any seeming acceptance the points may be valid.
You are absolutely right but there is this overwhelming lack of response that beggars belief when so many are trying to support the good guys.
I know battles are not won on this site, but I watch news and read papers and I know what I am not seeing.
I want the Rat Execs exposed for what is happening but am getting tired of seeing nothing to even start the process to achieve that end.
I am even more surprised that the wisdom of you and others is being dismissed by a wait and see approach without any seeming acceptance the points may be valid.
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i'm just saying......the laws of branding - you gotta have a brand boys!
1. THE LAW OF LEADERSHIP. It is better to be first than it is to be better.
2. THE LAW OF THE CATEGORY. If you can't be first in a category, set up a new category you can be first in.
3. THE LAW OF THE MIND. It is better to be first in the mind than to be first in the marketplace.
4. THE LAW OF PERCEPTION. Marketing is not a battle of products, it's a battle of perceptions.
5. THE LAW OF FOCUS. The most powerful concept in marketing is owning a word in the prospect's mind.
6. THE LAW OF EXCLUSIVITY. Two companies cannot own the same word in the prospect's mind.
7. THE LAW OF THE LADDER. The strategy to use depends on which rung you occupy on the ladder.
8. THE LAW OF DUALITY. In the long run, every market becomes a two horse race.
9. THE LAW OF THE OPPOSITE. If you are shooting for second place, your strategy is determined by the leader.
10. THE LAW OF DIVISION. Over time, a category will divide and become two or more categories.
11. THE LAW OF PERSPECTIVE. Marketing effects take place over an extended period of time.
12. THE LAW OF LINE EXTENSION. There is an irresistible pressure to extend the equity of the brand.
13. THE LAW OF SACRIFICE. You have to give up something to get something.
14. THE LAW OF ATTRIBUTES. For every attribute, there is an opposite, effective attribute.
15. THE LAW OF CANDOR. When you admit a negative, the prospect will give you a positive.
16. THE LAW OF SINGULARITY. In each situation, only one move will produce substantial results.
17. THE LAW OF UNPREDICTABILITY. Unless you write your competitor's plans, you can't predict the future.
18. THE LAW OF SUCCESS. Success often leads to arrogance, and arrogance to failure.
19. THE LAW OF FAILURE. Failure is to be expected and accepted.
20. THE LAW OF HYPE. The situation is often the opposite of the way it appears in the press.
21. THE LAW OF ACCELERATION. Successful programs are not built on fads, they're built on trends.
22. THE LAW OF RESOURCES. Without adequate funding, an idea won't get off the ground.
2. THE LAW OF THE CATEGORY. If you can't be first in a category, set up a new category you can be first in.
3. THE LAW OF THE MIND. It is better to be first in the mind than to be first in the marketplace.
4. THE LAW OF PERCEPTION. Marketing is not a battle of products, it's a battle of perceptions.
5. THE LAW OF FOCUS. The most powerful concept in marketing is owning a word in the prospect's mind.
6. THE LAW OF EXCLUSIVITY. Two companies cannot own the same word in the prospect's mind.
7. THE LAW OF THE LADDER. The strategy to use depends on which rung you occupy on the ladder.
8. THE LAW OF DUALITY. In the long run, every market becomes a two horse race.
9. THE LAW OF THE OPPOSITE. If you are shooting for second place, your strategy is determined by the leader.
10. THE LAW OF DIVISION. Over time, a category will divide and become two or more categories.
11. THE LAW OF PERSPECTIVE. Marketing effects take place over an extended period of time.
12. THE LAW OF LINE EXTENSION. There is an irresistible pressure to extend the equity of the brand.
13. THE LAW OF SACRIFICE. You have to give up something to get something.
14. THE LAW OF ATTRIBUTES. For every attribute, there is an opposite, effective attribute.
15. THE LAW OF CANDOR. When you admit a negative, the prospect will give you a positive.
16. THE LAW OF SINGULARITY. In each situation, only one move will produce substantial results.
17. THE LAW OF UNPREDICTABILITY. Unless you write your competitor's plans, you can't predict the future.
18. THE LAW OF SUCCESS. Success often leads to arrogance, and arrogance to failure.
19. THE LAW OF FAILURE. Failure is to be expected and accepted.
20. THE LAW OF HYPE. The situation is often the opposite of the way it appears in the press.
21. THE LAW OF ACCELERATION. Successful programs are not built on fads, they're built on trends.
22. THE LAW OF RESOURCES. Without adequate funding, an idea won't get off the ground.
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Great post Sunfish.
If there was ever a time for qf pilots to put their hands in their pockets this is it. You need billboards, you need a campaign like those seen at election time.
Maybe a nice list of QF management gems:
Maintenance offshoring
Tax and super evasion thru overseas ventures
Dixon departure payout with the 0 cent dividend to the shareholders.
You guys know the details better than me.
If there was ever a time for qf pilots to put their hands in their pockets this is it. You need billboards, you need a campaign like those seen at election time.
Maybe a nice list of QF management gems:
Maintenance offshoring
Tax and super evasion thru overseas ventures
Dixon departure payout with the 0 cent dividend to the shareholders.
You guys know the details better than me.
ALAEA Fed Sec
The Qantasia quote is a good start.
I'll give you a some more items for starters
Focus on the outsourcing, how much work is done in house now compared to say 10 years ago. By outsourcing I mean everything, from support functions like IT through to engineering and pilots etc. Oursourcing here means anything that was done by a Qantas staff member that is now done by a contractor or subsidiary Qantas company whether is be in Australia or overseas.
Get the figures and start quoting percentage comparisions. Point out how Qantas is becoming less Australian. Clever wording can make it look that all the outsourcing has been off shored. Remember there's, lies, damn lies, and there's statistics. Also the first casualty in any war is the truth.
Start quoting reliability/failure rates and compared the pre outsourcing times, assuming they have deteriorated as people are suggesting.
Compare Qantas executive pay rises with the average working mans wage increases over that last 10 years.
Highlight the poor decisions re aircraft choices, i,e no 777's
You need to make the management look bad, not just once but with continual tid bits of information, and it needs to start immediately. Public opinion is what is important, keeping the powder dry for the big day will never work.
You guys have the moral high ground but that on it's own isn't going to win the battle, you need to get down and dirty like the other side have been doing.
The Qantasia quote is a good start.
I'll give you a some more items for starters
Focus on the outsourcing, how much work is done in house now compared to say 10 years ago. By outsourcing I mean everything, from support functions like IT through to engineering and pilots etc. Oursourcing here means anything that was done by a Qantas staff member that is now done by a contractor or subsidiary Qantas company whether is be in Australia or overseas.
Get the figures and start quoting percentage comparisions. Point out how Qantas is becoming less Australian. Clever wording can make it look that all the outsourcing has been off shored. Remember there's, lies, damn lies, and there's statistics. Also the first casualty in any war is the truth.
Start quoting reliability/failure rates and compared the pre outsourcing times, assuming they have deteriorated as people are suggesting.
Compare Qantas executive pay rises with the average working mans wage increases over that last 10 years.
Highlight the poor decisions re aircraft choices, i,e no 777's
You need to make the management look bad, not just once but with continual tid bits of information, and it needs to start immediately. Public opinion is what is important, keeping the powder dry for the big day will never work.
You guys have the moral high ground but that on it's own isn't going to win the battle, you need to get down and dirty like the other side have been doing.
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Thank prairiegirl.
If you want a deep understanding of the propaganda forces at work over the last 100 years, there is an excellent BBC series called "The Century Of Self" in four parts, each almost an hour. This series provides an excellent primer into the psychological techniques of propaganda that have been successfully honed over the last century by big business and governments. These same techniques & methodologies will be deployed both against you, and in the media. I would consider this essential viewing to help you maintain your sanity during this process. It is much easier to recognise & counteract if you know the what weapons the enemy has. Make no mistake, the corporations consider that they are at war with you, even if you don't consider yourself at war with them.
You may or may not have any belief in the theories and techniques Freud and psychoanalysis. You may consider it all psychobabble, but that won't stop these techniques being deployed against you & in the media.
Part 1 -
Part 2 -
Part 3 -
: He Must Be Destroyed
Part 4 -
If you want a deep understanding of the propaganda forces at work over the last 100 years, there is an excellent BBC series called "The Century Of Self" in four parts, each almost an hour. This series provides an excellent primer into the psychological techniques of propaganda that have been successfully honed over the last century by big business and governments. These same techniques & methodologies will be deployed both against you, and in the media. I would consider this essential viewing to help you maintain your sanity during this process. It is much easier to recognise & counteract if you know the what weapons the enemy has. Make no mistake, the corporations consider that they are at war with you, even if you don't consider yourself at war with them.
You may or may not have any belief in the theories and techniques Freud and psychoanalysis. You may consider it all psychobabble, but that won't stop these techniques being deployed against you & in the media.
Part 1 -
Part 4 -
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I know the full picture guys and can talk until the cows come home. I need 5 short quotes or catch phrases. In the press you have a matter of seconds, there is no time for stories and you rarely get to elaborate.
I like -
I like -
- Qantasia; and
- Management are tearing down the foundations of an Australian icon.
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What Sunfish said...
Sunfish is right on the money. Until AIPA pay the significant $$$$$ to a first rate public relations consultancy to run the PR war the fight will be lost.
PG
PG
Fearcampaign
Just a couple of points.
AIPA did not exist in 66. That was an AFAP (overseas branch) action.
Protected/unprotected industrial action is a recent concept and did not exist in '89.
Maui
Just a couple of points.
AIPA did not exist in 66. That was an AFAP (overseas branch) action.
Protected/unprotected industrial action is a recent concept and did not exist in '89.
Maui
Qantas bullying staff
Irish invention = qantasia
Qantas spirit of Asia
Irishman tanks Qantas share price and blames staff
failed Ansett management running Qantas
Wrong equipment and wrong CEO
p.s I think it's time the staff passed a vote of no confidence in the CEO and board. That would make some headlines!
Irish invention = qantasia
Qantas spirit of Asia
Irishman tanks Qantas share price and blames staff
failed Ansett management running Qantas
Wrong equipment and wrong CEO
p.s I think it's time the staff passed a vote of no confidence in the CEO and board. That would make some headlines!
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Originally Posted by fedsec
I know the full picture guys and can talk until the cows come home. I need 5 short quotes or catch phrases. In the press you have a matter of seconds, there is no time for stories and you rarely get to elaborate.
Originally Posted by fedsec
Qantasia
Everyone feels their job is going to Asia these days and they think you have it easy. Won't do it for you, doubly so given that the not just the average punter thinks Emirates, Singapore etc stand for a level of quality and service you guys (you are all QF after all) don't do any longer and that you're overpaid compared to the foreign people. If we all have to face competition why don't you?
Speaking honestly - SIA and Emirates are a better customer experience, simple as that. And that is part of your problem, there's little sympathy out there for your plight because you don't actually do anything for us that is so great. Pilots because they're just bedhopping flyboys who don't do much more than bus drivers and LAMEs because you're just bus mechanics as far as the person in the street is concerned.
If planes from other carriers fell out of the sky then you'd have a chance, but as it is you're just seen as part of an organisation that's too expensive for second tier service. Which makes it very easy for QF and others to paint you as they do.
And that's the crux of it, they're painting you and they're making the running in the public sphere and they're making you look like the bad guys.
Originally Posted by fedsec
Management are tearing down the foundations of an Australian icon.
Why should the average person feel obliged to assist you? All Alan wants to do is make you earn your pay and you're just wanting to slack off.
The "Australian icon" is well and truly overplayed and is a cliche that weakens your case unless you do something a bit unusual. Maybe get that song the Chaser guys did and flog that for a bit.
Originally Posted by fedsec
If you can think of some better or simpler ones please add to the list.I'm looking for ones that cover both groups so we can run them together.
1) tell me why it is in my self interest to care about you
2) tell me why you aren't the bad guy in this battle
The first the miners did well with their campaign, problem you have is that QF lead in no section of the market, there are plenty of Low cost guys out there now and the premium service of Qantas, well, it isn't.
So fight them with direct hard facts:
When SARS hit times were tough for the company and we took 0% rises. The CEO and Board took X%
When 9/11 occurred times were tough and we took 0% for the good of the company. The CEO and Board took Y%
In the last 10 years we've received A%, the CEO (including bonuses etc) has taken B%
If you take the money the CEO was going to make personally from the takeover then that would cover our requested payrise for N months.
And then trivialise the amount you are seeking:
If you take the entire pay rise we're asking for then that represents 2.3 cents per ticket. I mean come on, Joyce is on millions and he won't even consider 2.3c per ticket? And you wonder why we're upset!
Use correct figures of course. Even better to use QF figures so there's no way they can immediately counterattack by challenging your numbers.
You need to make your opponents look like the greedy ones and yourself as being purely angelic or as close as you can get. Forget being all technical, nobody in the rest of the world cares if QF bought 777s or the like, they only care about what affects them.
Sunfish is right, you guys are fighting the wrong war. Get genuine PR in from the outside.