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"Qantas to cut flights and jobs"

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"Qantas to cut flights and jobs"

Old 30th Mar 2011, 00:48
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"Qantas to cut flights and jobs"

Qantas to scrap planes, jobs as fuel costs bite

EBA time maybe?
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 01:14
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there is still growth in capacity, just a reduction in the amount of growth.

The fleet choices made by 'management' will bite them in the arse.

At least they are targeting these 'managers' in the latest round of job cuts.....
its not nice for anyone to lose their jobs, but at least joyce has recognised that there are other non critical areas where the fat can be trimmed, instead of going straight for the jugular of the flight crew!

Its time the public were educated on the cost of flying an aeroplane from A to B. It is ridiculous for people to expect an airfare for less than the cost of the parking at the airport, or the taxi to get there. The pressure on all airlines to remain profitable is immense, poor old VB are finding out the hard way, and I suspect QF wont be far behind.

Regulation of the industry again? Thoughts?
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 01:33
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Seriously, how can anybody take Joyce at face value ? With the amount of money executive management are making with their salaries, bonus structure, share options AND their 'on the side consulting companies' anything he says should be treated with a wry smile.
This is standard management textbook reaction to industry pressures and economic challenges - scare the workforce. The day that Allan and friends put their honest open and clear paypackets on the table which includes evidence of a 'salary reduction' due to these unforeseen market conditions is the day that I start believing any of the verbal excrement that management spew forth.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 01:57
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Does this mean the "third fokker" might be scrapped???
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 02:06
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An Analysts View

Qantas shares have risen 5 cents to $2.20 after the statement, but Roger Montgomery of Montgomery Investment Management says the company's share price is lower than a decade ago for good reason.
"Since 2001, the company has raised an additional $2.5 billion and borrowed an extra $2.4 billion and yet the profits today are barely improved on those of a decade ago," he observed.
"The company remains alive thanks to the beneficence of its shareholders and lenders. If the hat ever comes back empty, Qantas will have to return to government ownership or foreign ownership."
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 02:40
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their 'on the side consulting companies'
While I do not hold a brief for anyone in Qantas management, I find this allegation offensive. gobbledock should put up or shut up: he should withdraw the allegation if he can't substantaite it.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 04:42
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Ken,

Your "all over the planet" - should be "in la la land"

Funnily enough, I can't find the trail that used to exist on the web that linked some of the current management to a third party consulting company. And it's not Boston Consulting.

It used to even mention it on Jetstars website under the CEO blurb, although strangely it has disappeared.

I used to wonder if that was why JB didn't get the top gig. Simply he was not part of the club.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 05:06
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It's amazing that this news comes after meeting with Boeing.. B787 is the perfect nightmare in a nightmare for QF.

LH SO Pilot doing LAX returns = $130K - <800 hours flying a year - away from home 100 days a year
LH FA doing LAX returns = $110K - <2000 hours flying a year - aprox 20 days away from home per 2 months
Manager (exec) = $98K working >40 hours a week

Work out the hourly rates!

Last edited by yellowmellow; 30th Mar 2011 at 05:55. Reason: Corrected SO - should have said F..
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 05:18
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‘‘We want to limit redundancies wherever possible. At this stage only management positions will be made redundant,’’ he said.

AJ looks around - thinks to himself "who's doing nothing" ah yes management!
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 05:20
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Yellow, you could work it out from the time the staff member signs on at Mascot, until they sign off there. This is the time that they are away from families, friends and home. Also, most cabin crew on LA flights are QCCA these days, so nowhere near the figure you quoted.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 05:27
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'on the side consulting companies'


Gladly supply proof:.................a well known manager closed the Apprentice training school (90 years of tradition!) and outsourced it to the local TAFE, claiming a $2 Million dollar saving.

Much later we find that he is on the board of that same TAFE.............

When other mangers were advised of this conflict of interest, not a single one took any action.............
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 06:27
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LH SO Pilot doing LAX returns = $130K - <800 hours flying a year - away from home 100 days a year
100 days per year = 2400 hpy (hours per year)

130,000/2400 = $54 per hour


LH FA doing LAX returns = $110K - <2000 hours flying a year - aprox 20 days away from home per 2 months
120 days per year = 2880 hpy

110,000/2880 = $38 per hour


Manager (exec) = $98K working >40 hours a week
40*48 (subtracted 4 weeks leave) = 1920 hpy

98,000/1920 = $51 per hour (weekends home, public holidays, no risk etc etc)

Work out the hourly rates!
Yep.......you win
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 06:30
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Regulation of the industry again? Thoughts?
The government delivered QF the australian aviation market on a plate. What more do QF want?

Like Ansett, let free enterprise play out.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 06:49
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'on the side consulting companies'


Gladly supply proof:.................a well known manager closed the Apprentice training school (90 years of tradition!) and outsourced it to the local TAFE, claiming a $2 Million dollar saving.

Much later we find that he is on the board of that same TAFE.............
Que? Here's me all these years thinking that TAFE was part of the government education system! When did TAFE morph into the private sector.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 06:52
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Hey Goblin

Think about what's the point I'm trying to make? Are you suggesting that an office person has it better?

Anyway you're counting sleep in calculations?

If you at it you have more time at home than an office person..

What happens if the crew actually enjoy the locations that they are in? The break and lifestyle of flying? Fly with their friends?

Mcdonald's pays and lets you go home at night. I enjoy being away for a week to have 3 at home...
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 07:54
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its not about who has it better. Its about being paid for the job you do, or might need to do. Tell me what a 'manager' does that can affect someone elses life?

farkin nothin
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 08:45
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In those pilot hrs one should times by say 30 to 50 per cent for study time. Then work out a pilots hry rate, not real good.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 08:54
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Hey Goblin

Think about what's the point I'm trying to make? Are you suggesting that an office person has it better?

Anyway you're counting sleep in calculations?

If you at it you have more time at home than an office person..

What happens if the crew actually enjoy the locations that they are in? The break and lifestyle of flying? Fly with their friends?
Any time you are not at home, i.e AWAY! You are working.

I'll spell it out for you just so you are aware.

A Pilot away for 100 days a year = 2400 hours that they are not with their family.

A 9-5 manager is home every night, and therefore is never away.

A 9-5 manager has weekends off, public holidays, christmas etc.

Pilots do not.

Pilots work shifts, nights, ever changing rosters. They have to bid for leave which is awarded on seniority, and generally miss most of the families important events - which mostly leads to divorce.

Traditionally - we were well remunerated for this.

If the 9-5 managers get their way, we will be paid less than a bus driver.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 09:22
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So go become a manager.
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Old 30th Mar 2011, 09:46
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Tell me what a 'manager' does that can affect someone elses life?
How about building a crappy roster for you?

How about under training staff you work with so that they are next to useless?
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