Jon Stevens INXS behaviour - Jetstar shines.
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Jon Stevens INXS behaviour - Jetstar shines.
INXS singer Jon Stevens ejected from Jetstar flight
Another win for commonsense, respect and people skills.
Another win for commonsense, respect and people skills.
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Once again I would be very wary about judging what the real story here is only having seen one side represented. I have had a couple of occassions over the past few months where I have had passengers escorted off my aircraft. I don't give a sh*t who you are, you have to act like a reasonable and responsible adult when onboard an aircraft. I am sick of groundstaff saying to me 'there is a passenger at the gate who is drunk and a bit agressive but we have talked to him and he has promised to be good'. I am sorry but if you can't control yourself to be 'not' drunk at the gate then you are not coming onboard my aircraft. When has it becoming acceptable to be a 'little' bit intoxicated onboard. As for passengers who argue with crew over all sorts of things I also don't have much sympathy, just because air travel has become low cost doesn't give people the right to treat staff like crap. If someone like this 'tool' is causing the crew to devote time to sorting him out then why should the airline carry him, it is not fair on the crew, other passengers etc. He needs to sit where he has been asked, or atleast ask before moving and then don't get all 'uppity' when pulled up on it.
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I am sick of groundstaff saying to me 'there is a passenger at the gate who is drunk and a bit aggressive but we have talked to him and he has promised to be good'.
It was a constant PITA ten years ago, you'd think that at least something could improve in the happy world of aviation.
Message to CS staff; it is a heck of a lot easier to throw an aggressive drunk out of the terminal than it is to skull-drag them kicking and screaming off a full aircraft prior to its departure. I suppose like all of us, CS don't get any support for making firm decisions, so it's easier to volleyball it to someone else than refuse them carriage at check in.
That's not saying Jon Stevens was well or badly behaved, I have no idea. Media reports can be unreliable about this sort of thing.
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If what is said in the article is correct, ie he asked why he couldn't move, they explained to him why and he complied and moved back. If that's what happened then perhaps the cabin crew were a bit over the top.
I've seen (and I've done it) many pax move to spare seats, most times the pax will ask and the cabin crew will say do it once the seat belt sign is off.
I've seen (and I've done it) many pax move to spare seats, most times the pax will ask and the cabin crew will say do it once the seat belt sign is off.
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You have to wonder if Cabin Crews were more experienced and maybe "more engaged" at work, would 'small' problems like this escalate to the point that someone gets 'thrown' off the aircraft for 'threatening behaviour'....?
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Pay Peanuts and you Get
Inexperienced,poorly trained children with attitude and zero life skills
JetStar has them in abundance and there is a growing number in Qantas Mainline.
American style service here we come
JetStar has them in abundance and there is a growing number in Qantas Mainline.
American style service here we come
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Kids in Charge
A few years back I was travelling to LAX on the QF11.The charming fellow sitting next to me had his alcohol cut off by a young female flight attendant.In her opinion he had had enough.He had consumed the same amount as me .Two glasses of red wine.No warnings.Nothing.He was not happy.When he asked to see the CSM she told him that he was on a break.The CSM eventually returned and was very apologetic when made aware of the circumstances.Alcohol was reinstated and we never saw the prohibitionist again.The fellow was sixty and the hostie about the age of his grandaughter.Nice bloke who eventually saw the funny side.
While these little dollies may be qute to look at give me a boiler with people skills any day
While these little dollies may be qute to look at give me a boiler with people skills any day
My wife is a S/H CSM mainline who has 30+ years service.
She still loves her job and goes to work and comes home with a beaming smile on her face due to her people skills and the folks she works for in the passenger cabin and her crew mates.......................except for the Gen X and Y who yap to each other all of the time, whinge about their rosters IF they turn up to work and when asked what they want to do at the briefing always say "I want to work on the cart with her/him" and think it is the end of the world to have to work up the front. Experience is essential for this job and contrary to the previous posts about the "beehives" they are what made the airline what it was and now amalgamated with the rest of the company is going to lose an asset which is impossible to replace when they retire.
S/H and L/H staff I have met and had the pleasure of their service in many years of travel have been 95% fantastic and the First/ Business crew are a credit to the company.
And there is no way that a pax who the ground staff say "has had a few" will be boarded due to the fact that they are an unknown risk and when they promise to have no more once they are boarded want another drink ASAP.
Safety first.
Not knowing the facts of the thread starter topic we can only hope that it was a logical and rational decision.
She still loves her job and goes to work and comes home with a beaming smile on her face due to her people skills and the folks she works for in the passenger cabin and her crew mates.......................except for the Gen X and Y who yap to each other all of the time, whinge about their rosters IF they turn up to work and when asked what they want to do at the briefing always say "I want to work on the cart with her/him" and think it is the end of the world to have to work up the front. Experience is essential for this job and contrary to the previous posts about the "beehives" they are what made the airline what it was and now amalgamated with the rest of the company is going to lose an asset which is impossible to replace when they retire.
S/H and L/H staff I have met and had the pleasure of their service in many years of travel have been 95% fantastic and the First/ Business crew are a credit to the company.
And there is no way that a pax who the ground staff say "has had a few" will be boarded due to the fact that they are an unknown risk and when they promise to have no more once they are boarded want another drink ASAP.
Safety first.
Not knowing the facts of the thread starter topic we can only hope that it was a logical and rational decision.
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And there is no way that a pax who the ground staff say "has had a few" will be boarded due to the fact that they are an unknown risk and when they promise to have no more once they are boarded want another drink ASAP.
This is without factoring in the pax who can seem perfectly sober at checkin and then turn into chimpanzees on pushback.
If the younger staff are a problem maybe the airline is not recruiting the right people, or maybe they can no longer attract them. This is certainly the case with the independent ground handling companies infesting the nation's international terminals and ramps. Their management all-stars still haven't figured out the peanut / monkey equation. I agree that the beehives (your term not mine
) are generally good at handling trouble before it becomes real trouble.
QF A330...
Not from my experience I'm afraid. 
Place: Sydney. Date: Late December 2010. Flight: QF Link DHC-8 to a regional port. Passenger was allowed to board who was so p1ssed that an ultimatum was given to the cabin crew by some passengers that either HE gets off, or WE do. The offender could hardly talk OR walk, and should NEVER have been allowed to board the aircraft in the first place, because he would have obviously represented a known risk to ground staff before as he was being boarded!
Ground staff were eventually called to intervene by the PIC when the pisshead threatened to biff another passenger who'd told him to sit down and behave himself, and he was removed from the flight, much to everyone's relief!
CAs handled the situation brilliantly!
And there is no way that a pax who the ground staff say "has had a few" will be boarded due to the fact that they are an unknown risk and when they promise to have no more once they are boarded want another drink ASAP.
Safety first.
Safety first.
Place: Sydney. Date: Late December 2010. Flight: QF Link DHC-8 to a regional port. Passenger was allowed to board who was so p1ssed that an ultimatum was given to the cabin crew by some passengers that either HE gets off, or WE do. The offender could hardly talk OR walk, and should NEVER have been allowed to board the aircraft in the first place, because he would have obviously represented a known risk to ground staff before as he was being boarded!
Ground staff were eventually called to intervene by the PIC when the pisshead threatened to biff another passenger who'd told him to sit down and behave himself, and he was removed from the flight, much to everyone's relief!
CAs handled the situation brilliantly!
Last edited by SIUYA; 27th Jan 2011 at 09:13.
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It should be more like "Jon Stevens Noiseworks behaviour". He fronted INXS only briefly from 2002-2004 
Yeah, SIUYA. Wish I had a dollar for every time a gutless gate person left it for the cabin crew on my flights to deal with the drunks they let through the gate.
I used to put in internal reports, but in hindsight it probably would've been better just to get CASA involved, as nothing was done about it at a company level. Judging by your post it seems nothing's changed
Yeah, SIUYA. Wish I had a dollar for every time a gutless gate person left it for the cabin crew on my flights to deal with the drunks they let through the gate.
I used to put in internal reports, but in hindsight it probably would've been better just to get CASA involved, as nothing was done about it at a company level. Judging by your post it seems nothing's changed
Cj..........
Actually, that's what we were all dreading! Being reached by a technicolour yawn!
Clarrie............LOL on that one!
Actually, best technicolour yawn from a passenger that I have EVER seen was in Bahrain in 1998.............Indian guest worker from Qatar who'd had to do a Visa run up to Bahrain for the day. BIG MISTAKE, because they had a bar at the airport, and as the Indians couldn't get liquor permits in Qatar, this guy took advantage of his day's outing to Bahrain and got REALLY REALLY pissed............so much so that he threw-up on the Bahraini dude who was checking passports as we boarded the aircraft for the flight from Bahrain to Doha!
It was absolutely priceless, and it caused absolute and total chaos!
He wasn't allowed to board the aircraft, and for all I know he's probably still in jail in Bahrain!
Actually, that's what we were all dreading! Being reached by a technicolour yawn!
Clarrie............LOL on that one!
Actually, best technicolour yawn from a passenger that I have EVER seen was in Bahrain in 1998.............Indian guest worker from Qatar who'd had to do a Visa run up to Bahrain for the day. BIG MISTAKE, because they had a bar at the airport, and as the Indians couldn't get liquor permits in Qatar, this guy took advantage of his day's outing to Bahrain and got REALLY REALLY pissed............so much so that he threw-up on the Bahraini dude who was checking passports as we boarded the aircraft for the flight from Bahrain to Doha!
It was absolutely priceless, and it caused absolute and total chaos!
He wasn't allowed to board the aircraft, and for all I know he's probably still in jail in Bahrain!
Last edited by SIUYA; 27th Jan 2011 at 09:28.
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While most of what said above is true. New CC recruits at Jetstar are trained to the minium and the younger the better seems tobe the recruitment line. Three weeks ground school 15 days or 120 hrs and 4 Days line training. Thats it. With no real world experience doesn' t look good sometimes.
However in the case of this thread the CSM has over 10 years of experience and is a good bloke, he also asked the Captain of 20 plus years of Airline experience of his opinion and options.
No twenty year old making this call.
However in the case of this thread the CSM has over 10 years of experience and is a good bloke, he also asked the Captain of 20 plus years of Airline experience of his opinion and options.
No twenty year old making this call.
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CIVIL AVIATION REGULATIONS 1988 - REG 256
(1) A person shall not, while in a state of intoxication, enter any aircraft.
i think this should be the final word on whether someone should be boarded. The real problem is the unrestricted self service of alcohol in the airline lounges prior to boarding which causes the problems at the gate or door of the aircraft
(1) A person shall not, while in a state of intoxication, enter any aircraft.
i think this should be the final word on whether someone should be boarded. The real problem is the unrestricted self service of alcohol in the airline lounges prior to boarding which causes the problems at the gate or door of the aircraft
Thread Starter
in a state of intoxication
i think this should be the final word
Ummm, the guy admitted he decided he would change from his allocated seat on his own accord.
Hard to confirm but the way I read it is he did this after the plane had already taxied as well?
I say good work to the crew.
Its a simply idea really, you sit in the seat your told to. If you can't abide by that then what else is too good for you?
Hard to confirm but the way I read it is he did this after the plane had already taxied as well?
I say good work to the crew.
Its a simply idea really, you sit in the seat your told to. If you can't abide by that then what else is too good for you?
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the definition of intoxication is of less a concern to airman than the effects of carrying a person in breach of the regulation.
Unless you have a disability or illness that would explain slurred speech, unsteady on feet, loudness, aggressive, lacking coordination, then you are likely to be intoxicated.
an experienced person should be able to use their skills to determine the difference between someone with a disability and someone that is pissed. An experienced person uses discretion to make this determination so as to avoid causing offence to the person in question.
The law sadly puts the onus on the crew - tech and cabin to ensure as the final line of defence that the CAR's are complied with.
It has been my experience to err on the side of caution and when in doubt perhaps get a second opinion. At the end of the day it is the decision of the PIC if a person is carried.
When i have requested a PIC to offload or deny boarding over my years as crew i have always in every case been supported by the PIC.
in over 20 years as cabin crew I have only needed to deny boarding on 3-4 occasions. In most cases someone that has had a couple of drinks isn't necessarily intoxicated and the PIC will always rely on the support of the Cabin crew and likewise to ensure the security of pax and aircraft.
Sometimes we get it wrong and we miss them at the door and experience is the difference between managing the situation and ensuring all pax and crew travel comfortably and safely or overreacting and cutting of service unnecessarily.
the quantity of alcohol is not always the issue its often the ability of the person to handle it and sometimes its a judgement call on the part of the crew
Unless you have a disability or illness that would explain slurred speech, unsteady on feet, loudness, aggressive, lacking coordination, then you are likely to be intoxicated.
an experienced person should be able to use their skills to determine the difference between someone with a disability and someone that is pissed. An experienced person uses discretion to make this determination so as to avoid causing offence to the person in question.
The law sadly puts the onus on the crew - tech and cabin to ensure as the final line of defence that the CAR's are complied with.
It has been my experience to err on the side of caution and when in doubt perhaps get a second opinion. At the end of the day it is the decision of the PIC if a person is carried.
When i have requested a PIC to offload or deny boarding over my years as crew i have always in every case been supported by the PIC.
in over 20 years as cabin crew I have only needed to deny boarding on 3-4 occasions. In most cases someone that has had a couple of drinks isn't necessarily intoxicated and the PIC will always rely on the support of the Cabin crew and likewise to ensure the security of pax and aircraft.
Sometimes we get it wrong and we miss them at the door and experience is the difference between managing the situation and ensuring all pax and crew travel comfortably and safely or overreacting and cutting of service unnecessarily.
the quantity of alcohol is not always the issue its often the ability of the person to handle it and sometimes its a judgement call on the part of the crew