Merged: Senate Inquiry
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What's on the menu.
What's on the menu.
Is next week is the start of the long goodbye? We can, for starters (from Sarcs's long list) redefine Haemorrhoids as piles of bleeding paper-work, stacked up on the miniscule's desk. It must be a foot high. This could be reduced by releasing certain items of interest for consumption.
L'Apéritif. perhaps the industry responses to the WLR. I cannot see, apart from practical (undisclosed) reasons, why these have not been published. Yep, a tasty way to start.
L'Entrée Perhaps a minuscule nibble around the edges of whether Truss is going to enforce the WLR salad or just let it droop and slide off the edge of the table.
Le Plat Principal. The Senate MoP surprise meal deal; - will it be meat and potatoes, or some mushy confection covered with a thin, bitter sauce? The chef's have been very coy about this dish, we must hope it's not served too cold due to delayed service.
Le Fromage. Pel Air cheese; this has matured and is now very ripe, to the point where the smell from the kitchen is almost palpable; the crackers have been a long while in the oven and ready to serve. This favourite of the fabled insurance elephant will not be palatable if delayed much longer. Perhaps the Canadian chef can be persuaded to serve it up sooner, rather than later.
Le Dessert. DAS pudding; not done properly, this can be either bitter or incredibly bland; we have had both at this restaurant. Perhaps the new chef from the Brindabella mountains can coax out the finer flavours from this potentially disastrous dish.
Le Café. Medivac biscuits and espresso, although delicious, the biscuits are very fragile, prone to disintegrate especially when exposed to moisture, 'dunking' is a frowned upon practice for the true connoisseur. The bitter aftertaste of the coffee more than offsets the sweetness found in a well made confection.
Le Digestif. Machiavellian nuts, Beaker balls, ICC Ginger curls, chocolate wabbit ears; or, cigar butts and an expensive Montreal brandy. Help yourself.
Toot toot –
A Sunday twiddle; sponsored by the IOS Chapter for "Them wot wotches MKR". A non approved, not aligned bunch of miscreants if ever there was one.
"Skies safe - anybody?"
Is next week is the start of the long goodbye? We can, for starters (from Sarcs's long list) redefine Haemorrhoids as piles of bleeding paper-work, stacked up on the miniscule's desk. It must be a foot high. This could be reduced by releasing certain items of interest for consumption.
L'Apéritif. perhaps the industry responses to the WLR. I cannot see, apart from practical (undisclosed) reasons, why these have not been published. Yep, a tasty way to start.
L'Entrée Perhaps a minuscule nibble around the edges of whether Truss is going to enforce the WLR salad or just let it droop and slide off the edge of the table.
Le Plat Principal. The Senate MoP surprise meal deal; - will it be meat and potatoes, or some mushy confection covered with a thin, bitter sauce? The chef's have been very coy about this dish, we must hope it's not served too cold due to delayed service.
Le Fromage. Pel Air cheese; this has matured and is now very ripe, to the point where the smell from the kitchen is almost palpable; the crackers have been a long while in the oven and ready to serve. This favourite of the fabled insurance elephant will not be palatable if delayed much longer. Perhaps the Canadian chef can be persuaded to serve it up sooner, rather than later.
Le Dessert. DAS pudding; not done properly, this can be either bitter or incredibly bland; we have had both at this restaurant. Perhaps the new chef from the Brindabella mountains can coax out the finer flavours from this potentially disastrous dish.
Le Café. Medivac biscuits and espresso, although delicious, the biscuits are very fragile, prone to disintegrate especially when exposed to moisture, 'dunking' is a frowned upon practice for the true connoisseur. The bitter aftertaste of the coffee more than offsets the sweetness found in a well made confection.
Le Digestif. Machiavellian nuts, Beaker balls, ICC Ginger curls, chocolate wabbit ears; or, cigar butts and an expensive Montreal brandy. Help yourself.
Toot toot –
A Sunday twiddle; sponsored by the IOS Chapter for "Them wot wotches MKR". A non approved, not aligned bunch of miscreants if ever there was one.
"Skies safe - anybody?"
Last edited by Kharon; 2nd Aug 2014 at 22:12. Reason: Let them eat cake is not a good call..
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Kharon,
mate, you forgot that old menu favorite
"The catch of the day"
I inquired of the waiter who replied
"Anyone who orders the fish"
and from the state of the industry, have we been served up some crook prawns???
mate, you forgot that old menu favorite
"The catch of the day"
I inquired of the waiter who replied
"Anyone who orders the fish"
and from the state of the industry, have we been served up some crook prawns???
Progress so far.
Despite the findings and recommendations of the AAI Report and ASRR Panel and calls from a substantial segment of the aviation industry:
- Mr Dolan has been reappointed
- NGA's OBRs haven't been recovered
- The ATSB's report on the ditching remains the formal position of the ATSB on the accident
- Every CASA executive is in the same position
- CASA Board positions haven't been spilled
- Jeff Boyd has been appointed to one of the two new positions on the CASA Board
- The Regulatory Reform Program is about to take another turn in direction, justifying another decade of expensive paper shuffling.
Did I miss anything?
I realise some people are waiting, with bated breath (in PPRuNe-speak: baited breathe) for the announcement of the new CASA DAS, but even a lot of people in industry have finally worked out that the DAS will never be the Messiah but, instead, just another naughty boy or girl.
If there were six like Jeff Boyd on the Board, I might see the point of the Board. But there aren't, so I don't.
So once the next naughty boy or girl is appointed as DAS and the remaining new position on the Board is filled, it's effectively business as has been usual for the last couple of decades.
What's the IOS's Plan B?
Despite the findings and recommendations of the AAI Report and ASRR Panel and calls from a substantial segment of the aviation industry:
- Mr Dolan has been reappointed
- NGA's OBRs haven't been recovered
- The ATSB's report on the ditching remains the formal position of the ATSB on the accident
- Every CASA executive is in the same position
- CASA Board positions haven't been spilled
- Jeff Boyd has been appointed to one of the two new positions on the CASA Board
- The Regulatory Reform Program is about to take another turn in direction, justifying another decade of expensive paper shuffling.
Did I miss anything?
I realise some people are waiting, with bated breath (in PPRuNe-speak: baited breathe) for the announcement of the new CASA DAS, but even a lot of people in industry have finally worked out that the DAS will never be the Messiah but, instead, just another naughty boy or girl.
If there were six like Jeff Boyd on the Board, I might see the point of the Board. But there aren't, so I don't.
So once the next naughty boy or girl is appointed as DAS and the remaining new position on the Board is filled, it's effectively business as has been usual for the last couple of decades.
What's the IOS's Plan B?
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Clarise, the lambs crying is getting louder.
So once the next naughty boy or girl is appointed as DAS and the remaining new position on the Board is filled, it's effectively business as has been usual for the last couple of decades.
Unless somebody very very special can click a finger and magically turn Australian politics, culture and it's subordinate departments into generative non-pathological organisations, we are screwed.
Kharon, nice menu my tendentious friend. However I didn't see any robust sized bottles of 'Chateau Le Pineapple' on the menu? Could we please order 3 cases? Cheers.
Last edited by 004wercras; 3rd Aug 2014 at 04:06. Reason: Open day on the Styx River Houseboat. Not many willing attendees.
On the reappointment of Beaker the following appears apt:
Given the public humiliation so far - and there is more to come - how does he continue to look in the mirror and then go to work each morning?
“Being poor is a mere trifle. It is being known to be poor that is the sting.” Jerome K. Jerome
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Unless somebody very very special can click a finger and magically turn Australian politics, culture and it's subordinate departments into generative non-pathological organisations, we are screwed.
if we meet on the barricades we shall die on the barricades
baulked every time tried to post the link to Tracy Chapman and 'Talkin Bout a Revolution
Last edited by FAR CU; 3rd Aug 2014 at 09:26.
So it looks like Plan B is for some form of anarchical insurrection by the IOS! The Senate Inquiry was held that long ago that babies born at the time are now entering kindergarten. All through the thread people have hung out for the next thing that will bring immediate and lasting change to the way aviation is administered and regulated in this country. The Senate inquiry, the next Senate inquiry into Pel Air, the change of government, the Truss report, the AFP investigation, the Privileges committee etc etc. Each time there has been a resounding chorus of “Its Time”.
I will give the credit to Creampuff but he forecast many years ago that none of the above was going to move the industry an inch closer to genuine reform mainly because both main political parties did not see aviation reform as being a vote catcher or game changer. They liked their Public Servants to run interference for them and supported them by extensions to their appointments when the time came. You might cite McCormick as an example of a scalp but he was never a professional bureaucrat so he was always going to be the fall guy. At least he had once upon a time slipped the surly bonds but what why would some aviation experience save him from getting the boot from an aviation portfolio? Dolan has zero aviation experience and failed badly at Senate estimates and inquiries yet continues to be the Commissioner at the ATSB.
What is the common denominator in all this? One word- Complacency. There have been no Cat 1 accidents in this country so from the politicians and publics point of view all must be well. CASA convince the government of the day, whether red or blue, that if radical change is made then an accident will be the inevitable result. That is why the Senate reports get ignored, that is why the government will conduct an extensive review and ultimately not change anything.
So what will change things? To make the decision makers non-complacent, Simples! One way is through the sheer hard yards of lobbying by various professional and industry organisations. They are the bodies that have the access, the credibility and the data that can influence the decision makers. Organisations like the RAA, AIPA the Ag association etc. These are the people that get treated seriously but it takes an awful lot of effort and an awful lot of time. Think of it in similar terms to the technological advances in aviation between the two World Wars.
So what is the equivalent of WW2?
That is the terrible reality of how aviation advances- fatal accidents. Not just any accidents as Lockhart River proved but a shiny jet with a recognisable brand name on the tail fin. Close calls like Mildura are obviously not enough to get rid of political and public complacency. I doubt that the recent near hit at MCY will be enough. Only pictures on the TV of the scale of MH17 will do it.
It is certainly a cynical viewpoint but cynicism comes through having seen it all before and not witnessing change. As an example the current hours requirements in the U.S. only come about because of the Colgan crash. Fulltime tracking of passenger aircraft will only occur due to MH370. The risk assessment of air routes over war zones will have more conservative assumptions included because of MH17. The importance of pilots being able to actually manipulate an aircraft in an emergency is only given prominence because of AF447 and Asiana 214. All these issues were present for many years before an accident occurred and there were plenty of warnings.
Complacency, get rid of that and you get rid of the people running CASA and the ATSB. I know how it won’t be achieved but that just gets people upset because they think they have found the Holy Gourd through a keyboard.
I will give the credit to Creampuff but he forecast many years ago that none of the above was going to move the industry an inch closer to genuine reform mainly because both main political parties did not see aviation reform as being a vote catcher or game changer. They liked their Public Servants to run interference for them and supported them by extensions to their appointments when the time came. You might cite McCormick as an example of a scalp but he was never a professional bureaucrat so he was always going to be the fall guy. At least he had once upon a time slipped the surly bonds but what why would some aviation experience save him from getting the boot from an aviation portfolio? Dolan has zero aviation experience and failed badly at Senate estimates and inquiries yet continues to be the Commissioner at the ATSB.
What is the common denominator in all this? One word- Complacency. There have been no Cat 1 accidents in this country so from the politicians and publics point of view all must be well. CASA convince the government of the day, whether red or blue, that if radical change is made then an accident will be the inevitable result. That is why the Senate reports get ignored, that is why the government will conduct an extensive review and ultimately not change anything.
So what will change things? To make the decision makers non-complacent, Simples! One way is through the sheer hard yards of lobbying by various professional and industry organisations. They are the bodies that have the access, the credibility and the data that can influence the decision makers. Organisations like the RAA, AIPA the Ag association etc. These are the people that get treated seriously but it takes an awful lot of effort and an awful lot of time. Think of it in similar terms to the technological advances in aviation between the two World Wars.
So what is the equivalent of WW2?
That is the terrible reality of how aviation advances- fatal accidents. Not just any accidents as Lockhart River proved but a shiny jet with a recognisable brand name on the tail fin. Close calls like Mildura are obviously not enough to get rid of political and public complacency. I doubt that the recent near hit at MCY will be enough. Only pictures on the TV of the scale of MH17 will do it.
It is certainly a cynical viewpoint but cynicism comes through having seen it all before and not witnessing change. As an example the current hours requirements in the U.S. only come about because of the Colgan crash. Fulltime tracking of passenger aircraft will only occur due to MH370. The risk assessment of air routes over war zones will have more conservative assumptions included because of MH17. The importance of pilots being able to actually manipulate an aircraft in an emergency is only given prominence because of AF447 and Asiana 214. All these issues were present for many years before an accident occurred and there were plenty of warnings.
Complacency, get rid of that and you get rid of the people running CASA and the ATSB. I know how it won’t be achieved but that just gets people upset because they think they have found the Holy Gourd through a keyboard.
Agree with LL that it will take something major to shake the government and bureaucrats out of their complacency.
A major crash would certainly do it, but no one wants that.
Action by the FAA (i.e. downgrading Australia to tier 2) would certainly do it. I half expected this to happen - it was being contemplated in 2009, and very little of the PelAir debacle since 2009 could have inspired any confidence.
I don't understand the recent comments about lack of insurance for survivors, Could someone here enlighten me?
If this is the case, then a decision by insurers and other customers not to use Australian registered air ambulances (until such time as this issue is addressed) would cause pain. Pain for Australian operators. Pain for Australians overseas. Pain for people from other countries needing air ambulance services in this region - imagine if the US or Europe recommended that their citizens not be transported by an Australian registered air ambulance.
I suspect this would get this particular loophole (if it exists) fixed. Of course I understand you are talking about a much bigger picture, but at least it would be a start.
A major crash would certainly do it, but no one wants that.
Action by the FAA (i.e. downgrading Australia to tier 2) would certainly do it. I half expected this to happen - it was being contemplated in 2009, and very little of the PelAir debacle since 2009 could have inspired any confidence.
I don't understand the recent comments about lack of insurance for survivors, Could someone here enlighten me?
If this is the case, then a decision by insurers and other customers not to use Australian registered air ambulances (until such time as this issue is addressed) would cause pain. Pain for Australian operators. Pain for Australians overseas. Pain for people from other countries needing air ambulance services in this region - imagine if the US or Europe recommended that their citizens not be transported by an Australian registered air ambulance.
I suspect this would get this particular loophole (if it exists) fixed. Of course I understand you are talking about a much bigger picture, but at least it would be a start.
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So what will change things? To make the decision makers non-complacent, Simples! One way is through the sheer hard yards of lobbying by various professional and industry organisations. They are the bodies that have the access, the credibility and the data that can influence the decision makers. Organisations like the RAA, AIPA the Ag association etc.
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QUOTE: it will take something major to shake the government and bureaucrats out of their complacency. QUOTE.
A major crash would certainly do it. But until then;
"De minimus non curat lex"
"the law does not concern itself with trifling
matters."
A major crash would certainly do it. But until then;
"De minimus non curat lex"
"the law does not concern itself with trifling
matters."
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Wait a bit.
CP –"What's the IOS's Plan B?"
David Fawcett and Co have done a magnificent job and never once let the team down, industry is as homogenous now as it ever has been, or is likely to ever be again. Everyone is over the Truss dithering and even the big boys are wanting the reform. Go no further than this unmitigated pile of bollocks – laughingly referred to as Part 61 – if you really want to see what the 'old' system has produced, it is at the pinnacle of total NFI. If industry meekly accepts this, it's game over. With McComic and his bully boys gone (or going) industry can fight against Part 61, without fear of reprisal.
So there would be the start point for Plan B – the Senators know exactly how the old regime worked and will not be caught out a second time. The new bored/DAS will be walking into a **** storm if they 'try it on', a simple request from everyone regarding part 61 would be the trigger for round two.
No one wants to go back to war – but if the industry doesn't catch a break soon there are viable alternatives to BOHICA. Regenerated anger, turned to fury will serve to provide the will and determination to never, ever allow a creature like McComic to ride roughshod over those that paid for the privilege. Industry was only mildly annoyed during Forsyth and placid right now; I would not want to be the one responsible for dashing their hopes, not now. No; It will be much easier to get the reform happening and pacify the industry; rather than risk open rebellion. If a cornered animal can't fly – rest assured it will fight.
We'll know soon enough. Out, out damned doom sayers and take those bloody goats with you. (insert big smile).
Toot toot..-.-
Last edited by Kharon; 4th Aug 2014 at 20:35. Reason: Bill and Nan are our two goats – give the dogs hell when the mood is right. Smart as new paint.
reality is that if the two Senate inquiries, the Forsyth review and the 'true' report from the Canadians don't change things, nothing will without a fight to the metaphorical death that is.
If a cornered animal can't fly – rest assured it will fight.
If a cornered animal can't fly – rest assured it will fight.
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I asked (before the hackles rise because Lookleft dares to post on this thread)
Not sure what heckles have been raised. Pprune is an open forum for all people to post their views (in line with the rules of course).
Kharon, as always, a very factual comment about the Part 61 mess that is going to grow into it's very own version of a Frankenstein. Where will it all end?
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Lookyloo said;
You must have had a fluoro light explode in your eyes! They aren't heckles, they are just long unshaven back hairs 
And,
I like the way China does business, they still execute people! Nothing wrong with that, gets my vote
Back to the important stuff. The Canuck report - My source tells me that the report has indeed been passed gracefully into the eager hands of Pumpkin Head, who in turn has advised the Miniscule of its content, who in turn has sought assistance from the cleaning department to examine the best way to clean the report somewhat! Although the report is now locked away safely in a much stronger CHUBB safe than the ASSR submissions were locked in, it is still being debated how and if to release its content publicly. So with the possible release of the report this month (and subsequent Beaker public interviews and his now famous mi mi mi-ing) plus Herr Skulls imminent departure, and the fact that Styx Houseboat fares are half price for August only, it should at least be an amusing few weeks.
"Safe passage for all"
I can see your heckles from here!
And,
Like the Chinese version of democracy
Back to the important stuff. The Canuck report - My source tells me that the report has indeed been passed gracefully into the eager hands of Pumpkin Head, who in turn has advised the Miniscule of its content, who in turn has sought assistance from the cleaning department to examine the best way to clean the report somewhat! Although the report is now locked away safely in a much stronger CHUBB safe than the ASSR submissions were locked in, it is still being debated how and if to release its content publicly. So with the possible release of the report this month (and subsequent Beaker public interviews and his now famous mi mi mi-ing) plus Herr Skulls imminent departure, and the fact that Styx Houseboat fares are half price for August only, it should at least be an amusing few weeks.
"Safe passage for all"
Last edited by 004wercras; 5th Aug 2014 at 10:34. Reason: Taking my cheese cloth IOS singlet out of the Dryer
I like the way China does business, they still execute people! Nothing wrong with that, gets my vote
I'm guessing driving the tanks driving over the dissenters. Screaming over the engine and grinding tracks "Toe the party line or else!"
Yep your only beef with McCormick and Dolan is they have the power that is rightfully yours. Good to see your Painters and Dockers forebears have passed on Uncle Joe's rules to live by.