Merged: APNG Twin Otter Missing
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
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Agreed Blackhand. he certainly can be his own worse enemy sometimes.
You know who I was talking about...... He also told me the same thing about the money. I believe what they offered was on the point of being ridicules and he was hanging out for a better offer.
The crasher remark was tongue in cheek........... but he is pretty good at it.
You know who I was talking about...... He also told me the same thing about the money. I believe what they offered was on the point of being ridicules and he was hanging out for a better offer.
The crasher remark was tongue in cheek........... but he is pretty good at it.
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Wondering why so much importance is being placed on a report that will in essence achieve very little.
Kokoda crash pay-outs capped by PNG law | The Australian
Kokoda crash pay-outs capped by PNG law.
RELATIVES of the nine Australians killed in an air crash near Kokoda would only get paltry compensation under the country's legislation.
Several groups of relatives are due to visit Kokoda and the crash site about 85km north of the capital Port Moresby this week, to hold a memorial service on the one year anniversary of the accident, which killed the Australians, three Papua New Guineans and one Japanese when their aircraft hit a mountain.
The relatives could face hostility from some landowners at the crash site who have yet to receive any reparations for damage to their property.
Earlier this year, landowners in a village near the site complained their water supply had been contaminated and a swath of forest had been chopped down to allow rescue and salvage helicopters to access the crash site, on a steep ridge about six hours' walk from the nearest road.
The landowners alleged medicines carried by the plane had leached into a local creek and polluted the water supply.
A local ex-pat who asked not to be named told The Australian that landowners had conducted an animated discussion about compensation with Australian High Commission officials who visited the crash site.
Yesterday a spokesman for the Australian Foreign Affairs Department reported villagers said they had written to Airlines PNG about the issues.
Airlines PNG, which operated the crash plane, said last month that compensation was "being discussed with the state".
PNG's Community Development Minister, Carol Kidu, who is accompanying one group of relatives to the crash site this week, confirmed compensation had been an issue but said she would be with the group and would help explain the situation to locals.
Compensation payouts from the airline's insurers to the Australian relatives could be as little as $12,500, according to experienced international aviation lawyer Patrick Nunan.
Mr Nunan says the families of the Kokoda victims would only be entitled to a capped payment of a maximum of 30,000 kina or about $12,500 under the local legislation.
TB
I think any shortfall it what Australian courts would consider appropriate compensation should be taken out of Australia’s annual aid package to PNG. As for the local land owners wanting compensation? Take that up with the aircraft owner, Airlines PNG and the PNG Government. This has absolutely nothing tho do with the Australian victims, their families or the Australian tax payer. I am very disappointed that the Australian High Commission even talked to them.
APNG is an international operator and will have appropriate liability insurance as a condition of its Australian FAOC. Whether or not the PNG CAA provided proper regulatory oversight or adequate investigation, it was APNG's crash, not the PNG Government's. The Government may yet have to answer to ICAO on this and a number of other issues. But not the point here.
Because Australian citizens were involved, a case for compensation should be brought to court at an international level.
While it is not usual for investigations to apportion blame - but to find the cause - litigation lawyers don't operate under any such limitations. Once blame is established, if land has been polluted, the landowners may also be able to seek a settlement at a higher level or for a higher value than what is available locally. It probably depends on their ability to engage a suitable headkicking legal team. How is it the responsibility of the Australian taxpayer, via any special aid, unless it becomes some kind of urgent natural or environmental disaster? Unlikely that a passenger-carrying Twin Otter would be carrying enough toxins to do that. And if it was, that would open up another can of worms via the DG regulations.
Whatever, the insurers will be in their usual huddle to try and weasel out at minimum cost.
Because Australian citizens were involved, a case for compensation should be brought to court at an international level.
While it is not usual for investigations to apportion blame - but to find the cause - litigation lawyers don't operate under any such limitations. Once blame is established, if land has been polluted, the landowners may also be able to seek a settlement at a higher level or for a higher value than what is available locally. It probably depends on their ability to engage a suitable headkicking legal team. How is it the responsibility of the Australian taxpayer, via any special aid, unless it becomes some kind of urgent natural or environmental disaster? Unlikely that a passenger-carrying Twin Otter would be carrying enough toxins to do that. And if it was, that would open up another can of worms via the DG regulations.
Whatever, the insurers will be in their usual huddle to try and weasel out at minimum cost.
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Of course they would have insurance, but the insurer wouldn't pay out more than they legally had to. Why should they?
Aussie citizens or not - it was a domestic flight and subject to PNG law - which limits payout from the carrier to 30,000 Kina. The nationality of those killed is irrelevant.
The litigation lawyers you refer to Mach therefore have nowhere to go against APNG. Of course if they can find someone else to blame then they may be able to get somewhere. Hence they would probably be very interested in the outcome of the accident investigations.
I don't like their chances.
No offence Mach, but personally I'm a bit over insurance bashing sentiments from those who perhaps aren't armed with the facts.
TB
Aussie citizens or not - it was a domestic flight and subject to PNG law - which limits payout from the carrier to 30,000 Kina. The nationality of those killed is irrelevant.
The litigation lawyers you refer to Mach therefore have nowhere to go against APNG. Of course if they can find someone else to blame then they may be able to get somewhere. Hence they would probably be very interested in the outcome of the accident investigations.
I don't like their chances.
No offence Mach, but personally I'm a bit over insurance bashing sentiments from those who perhaps aren't armed with the facts.
TB
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The litigation lawyers you refer to Mach therefore have nowhere to go against APNG
Have see case in PNG where was very much higher payout than 30 thousand kina.
Is this case of strict liability, I think not.
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tolakuma manki,
The other case may have been a private flight? In which case strict liability and the Kina30,000 limit wouldn't have applied. This was not.
gas-chamber,
Sounds like you know what you are on about.
TB
The other case may have been a private flight? In which case strict liability and the Kina30,000 limit wouldn't have applied. This was not.
gas-chamber,
Sounds like you know what you are on about.
TB
Regardless who had what kind of insurance it means nothing until Sid or some from the PNG DOT publishes a final report.
This is partly why Airlink closed down,no insurance paid out on the Goroka Bandit crash,the Hoskins Islander crash and the Patrick Kundin Bandit crash,hence this is one of the reasons why Sid went public in the way he did. The ATR was the final straw for Airlink. The whole thing comes back to the PNG politicians,I say no more !
This is partly why Airlink closed down,no insurance paid out on the Goroka Bandit crash,the Hoskins Islander crash and the Patrick Kundin Bandit crash,hence this is one of the reasons why Sid went public in the way he did. The ATR was the final straw for Airlink. The whole thing comes back to the PNG politicians,I say no more !
APNG to merge with PX ?
Merger proposed for PX, Airlines PNG | The National
Interesting
I really hope this doesn't eventuate. I'll even start going to church to pray that this doesn't happen.
If APNG collapsed,Air Niugini would more than likely get APNG's existing contracts provided they could supply the aircraft and crews.
There is no way that Air Niugini would get something out of this,other than a hell of a head ache.
Interesting
I really hope this doesn't eventuate. I'll even start going to church to pray that this doesn't happen.
If APNG collapsed,Air Niugini would more than likely get APNG's existing contracts provided they could supply the aircraft and crews.
There is no way that Air Niugini would get something out of this,other than a hell of a head ache.
I also heard that one of APNG's most experienced DHC-6 checkies has decided to team up with an ex APNG Dash 8 Captain,to start servicing the PNG bush strips,that aren't being serviced any more.
Good onya MB and JT
PX doesn't want APNG's tired aircraft,nor do we want Toomey !
Good onya MB and JT
PX doesn't want APNG's tired aircraft,nor do we want Toomey !
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Ever thought that A/PNG and Air Niugini might be considering code sharing on the Cairns Moresby route to try to offset the QF Q400 and the dumping of capacity on the route. A/PNG can do it cheaper for sure. They have an under utilised ATR-72 available in the mornings nowadays; it seems. Nice machine I am led to believe. With about 95% of the mining work in the country I would say Air Niugini would love to merge with them , but I seriosly doubt the clients-mining companys- would be to happy.
Last edited by Cravenmorehead; 19th Aug 2010 at 11:31.
I dunno what planet you are on Head,why on earth would PX love to merge with APNG ?
Sounds like APNG are on the verge of collapse,I hope I'm wrong though.
PX taking onboard APNG just doesn't stack up,maybe there is some political influence ?
Sounds like APNG are on the verge of collapse,I hope I'm wrong though.
PX taking onboard APNG just doesn't stack up,maybe there is some political influence ?
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Airfares in and out of PNG used to be astronomical! Competition has been the best thing that has happened to PX, they now run more efficiently and actually turn a profit. PX need APNG as it has made them improve and the people of PNG are the ones that have benefited the most.
There won't be any 'merger', however I do think the PNG govt need to buy into APNG and run a few auditors through the place. Then throw 'em a few more aircraft/refleet and let 'em loose.
There won't be any 'merger', however I do think the PNG govt need to buy into APNG and run a few auditors through the place. Then throw 'em a few more aircraft/refleet and let 'em loose.
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I agree with with the above post. It never ceases to amaze me the drivel that comes out of PNG. I think it is interesting that all these merger comments and talks of imminent collapse come when A/PNG have just launched a very smick ATR-72 into the system. Air niugini are you scared of a little decent competion? Tired old dash8's, at A/PNG? I remember most of yours arriving in 1997 and then on. Yes A/PNG's are old but very well maintained by great engineers, with stacks of experience.
It would have been a very expensive exercise bringing the ATR-72 into service, and no doubt this would have placed a great financial burden on the company. I imagine that the old cash flow at present would be a worry. But they did it. LGL love it and it is a good example of a company that is not scared to think outside the box. From here I should imagine more will come. Remember A/PNG was is essentially a G.A operator a few years back with nothing more than a couple of B1900's and two very tired old Dash8's. They now have nearly all the lucrative mining work. The mining companies love them they do the job well and safely.
To rumours of merger and imminent collapse I say bollocks!
I agree with Craven perhaps Air Agony and A/PNG are looking at joining forces on the Cairns POM run to stave off QF and their foray into the market. It would make sense to me.
Cheers
It would have been a very expensive exercise bringing the ATR-72 into service, and no doubt this would have placed a great financial burden on the company. I imagine that the old cash flow at present would be a worry. But they did it. LGL love it and it is a good example of a company that is not scared to think outside the box. From here I should imagine more will come. Remember A/PNG was is essentially a G.A operator a few years back with nothing more than a couple of B1900's and two very tired old Dash8's. They now have nearly all the lucrative mining work. The mining companies love them they do the job well and safely.
To rumours of merger and imminent collapse I say bollocks!
I agree with Craven perhaps Air Agony and A/PNG are looking at joining forces on the Cairns POM run to stave off QF and their foray into the market. It would make sense to me.
Cheers
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Che
Drivel?
Hopefully 2009 and 10 were better years.
Anyway, heres hoping the talk of merger and imminent collapse is, as you say, just "BOLLOCKS"
Re..
might be a quite await to see that happen I'd wager.
APNG chairman Simon Wild told shareholders that, in its first full year of operations as a listed company, APNG had suffered an overall loss of K24.6 million. It made a loss of K7.5 million in 2008.
Hopefully 2009 and 10 were better years.
Anyway, heres hoping the talk of merger and imminent collapse is, as you say, just "BOLLOCKS"
Re..
stave off QF