Qantas:EP Predeparture Checks Reintroduced
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"Moderators,If it wasn't for a minority of pilots using antagonistic and disparaging terms such as trolley dolley and biscuit chucker then there would far fewer arguments and problems for the mods."
RedTbar...you forgot that those nasty mean spirited pilot wankers also use phrases such as Cart tart, Lolly Molly,Tech Crew Relief Device,Bouncing Barman, (or maid as the case may be!),Galley Hag, Wally (or Wendy) the Ailse Walker etc etc etc.
I for one feel the need for a screaming tantrum just thinking about the way this loud proud group of "garcon extraudinaire" are treated by the beer swilling, skirt chasing, rugby playing, bottom groping overpaid, underutilized bunch of nerdy rednecks that inhabit OUR workspace.
Kiethhhhhhh!!!!.....another Pink Gin Fizz pleath.....I feel the need for soothing ministrations....sob
....Ohhh the pain...the pain!!!
RedTbar...you forgot that those nasty mean spirited pilot wankers also use phrases such as Cart tart, Lolly Molly,Tech Crew Relief Device,Bouncing Barman, (or maid as the case may be!),Galley Hag, Wally (or Wendy) the Ailse Walker etc etc etc.
I for one feel the need for a screaming tantrum just thinking about the way this loud proud group of "garcon extraudinaire" are treated by the beer swilling, skirt chasing, rugby playing, bottom groping overpaid, underutilized bunch of nerdy rednecks that inhabit OUR workspace.
Kiethhhhhhh!!!!.....another Pink Gin Fizz pleath.....I feel the need for soothing ministrations....sob
....Ohhh the pain...the pain!!!
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The PRIME role of CC is EMG Ops, service is a secondary (despite what management think, and not an issue on QF anyway 
). As such, CC should be asked EP questions before every duty commencement. If they get one wrong, they should be asked another question. If they fail to get this right, they should be stood down. It is that simple. Pilots don't get a second chance with EMG drills, but there are two of us in airline cockpits, thus I concede a second question for CC. It is NOT THAT HARD. If you can't get one out of two EP questions right, I don't want you looking after my family in the event of an EMG!
). As such, CC should be asked EP questions before every duty commencement. If they get one wrong, they should be asked another question. If they fail to get this right, they should be stood down. It is that simple. Pilots don't get a second chance with EMG drills, but there are two of us in airline cockpits, thus I concede a second question for CC. It is NOT THAT HARD. If you can't get one out of two EP questions right, I don't want you looking after my family in the event of an EMG!
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I agree with clear to land and if there are some crew who don't keep up to date then it's sayonara.
We expect the same of the pilots,engineers and anyone who has a job that is safety related.
It's a pity that we can't expect the same effort from those running he airline
We expect the same of the pilots,engineers and anyone who has a job that is safety related.
It's a pity that we can't expect the same effort from those running he airline
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We [QF] were doing it for years before someone changed the policy. Probably thought it might be a way to help justify their position.
Anyway. Qantas [The airline with ZERO corporate memory] is about to be re-invent the wheel by way of the policies re-introduction.
The quiz as I understand it won't be done in front of others.
Anyway. Qantas [The airline with ZERO corporate memory] is about to be re-invent the wheel by way of the policies re-introduction.
The quiz as I understand it won't be done in front of others.
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Predeparture Costs
Sign on time is generally 90 mins before departure.It use to be 120 mins.Someone decided we didnt need that much time and chopped it down by 30 mins.Saved them a fortune but it meant there was no time for predeparture EP checks,Galley checks,bar preaparation,OJ delivery and head set delivery.
Headset delivery and amenity pak delivery have only recently returned.Emergency equipment checks have and always will be uppermost in importance.
As far as galleys checks are concerned if it aint on the aircraft it likely wont make it and dont dare delay an aircraft for catering .
Aircraft catering/dressing ex Sydney is a farce.Try explaining to a J/C customer you dont have tomato juice ...they are initially dumbstruck and then pissed off.Last time it happened the pax comment was"why am I not surprised after all this is Qantas"But I digress.The return of Predeparture checks is fantastic but local standbys will need to be made available.By that it is meant that some crew will need to do standbys at QCC1 or a/c will be delayed due to EP failure
Headset delivery and amenity pak delivery have only recently returned.Emergency equipment checks have and always will be uppermost in importance.
As far as galleys checks are concerned if it aint on the aircraft it likely wont make it and dont dare delay an aircraft for catering .
Aircraft catering/dressing ex Sydney is a farce.Try explaining to a J/C customer you dont have tomato juice ...they are initially dumbstruck and then pissed off.Last time it happened the pax comment was"why am I not surprised after all this is Qantas"But I digress.The return of Predeparture checks is fantastic but local standbys will need to be made available.By that it is meant that some crew will need to do standbys at QCC1 or a/c will be delayed due to EP failure
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Boys and Girls,
I can't see the office thinking about that until someone fails a test and is stood down.
Worse if the kite's delayed and they can't get any more crew.
You'll see another change in this policy real quick.
GADRIVR,you called it mate not us.
I can't see the office thinking about that until someone fails a test and is stood down.
Worse if the kite's delayed and they can't get any more crew.
You'll see another change in this policy real quick.
those nasty mean spirited pilot wankers
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Butterfield8, CC report time is 60 mins before departure except in the capital of the known universe where it is 75 mins. Sure people get there earlier than that but they don't have to. Rest of your message might get lost when you quote inaccurate figures, i sure stopped to let a bull**** out at that point.
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Clarification
The figures quoted were for international flights.
Eg(a) QF3 SYD/HNL Sign on Time 18:15 DEP Time 19:40
(b)QF1 SYD/BKK Sign on Time 15:35 DEP Time 17:00
Apologies
Eg(a) QF3 SYD/HNL Sign on Time 18:15 DEP Time 19:40
(b)QF1 SYD/BKK Sign on Time 15:35 DEP Time 17:00
Apologies
Last edited by Butterfield8; 10th Aug 2009 at 12:12.
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Tough Audience Out There
Butterfield gets pulled up for being 5 mins wrong by a guy(drivabilongbalus)s who is 10 minutes wrong.
Go Figure.
CC sign on 85 mins before departure.
13 posts since 1999 and he gets it wrong.Unlucky 13?
Go Figure.
CC sign on 85 mins before departure.
13 posts since 1999 and he gets it wrong.Unlucky 13?
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Nothing wrong with asking a few questions. I agree that if you don't know the answers to straight-foward EP questions, then you shouldn't be operating. Afterall, as someone said, the prime responsibility of CC is safety (not who has the most perfect makeup/latest handbag etc)
As for the "stress of being asked questions", surely you jest! If you can't handle the stress of a few questions, then how the hell will you handle the stress of an emergency?
I've flown with a great many competent, able and pleasant cabin crew (male and female)....I've also been absolutely horrified by what I have seen at joint tech/cabin crew EP days....the inability to actually open a door was one...and I jest you not.
SOME people need reminding that their job is NOT just to swan up and down the aisle looking fabulous and acting vacuuous (I think that is a word!)...and we all know there are people out there like that. If something like a few EP questions before a flight will weed some of them out, or get them to get their s%$t together, then bravo!
Again, we are talking about a minority, but it could be a mnority that makes the difference in a life or death situation.....just because these don't arrive every day(or even at all in one's career) does not mean they shouldn't be prepared for.
As for the "stress of being asked questions", surely you jest! If you can't handle the stress of a few questions, then how the hell will you handle the stress of an emergency?
I've flown with a great many competent, able and pleasant cabin crew (male and female)....I've also been absolutely horrified by what I have seen at joint tech/cabin crew EP days....the inability to actually open a door was one...and I jest you not.
SOME people need reminding that their job is NOT just to swan up and down the aisle looking fabulous and acting vacuuous (I think that is a word!)...and we all know there are people out there like that. If something like a few EP questions before a flight will weed some of them out, or get them to get their s%$t together, then bravo!
Again, we are talking about a minority, but it could be a mnority that makes the difference in a life or death situation.....just because these don't arrive every day(or even at all in one's career) does not mean they shouldn't be prepared for.
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100% correct distracted cockroach....
If someone is stressed out with a pre departure EP quiz then how would they react in a real emergency?
If there are crew who do not take the safety aspect of the job seriously then this could be a wake up call for them...
If someone is stressed out with a pre departure EP quiz then how would they react in a real emergency?
If there are crew who do not take the safety aspect of the job seriously then this could be a wake up call for them...
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agree
why is this even being debated !!!!!! (note: statement not a question)
baseline:
if you can't answer 5 questions (and get a second chance if you bugger it up )- then frankly you should leave the keys on the table, organise your farewell drinks and log onto seek.com
All this garbage about being "stressed" by a pre-flight quiz ...WTF?..... you are either a professional or you're not.
And if you want people to see CC as professional people (which the greater majority are) then ace the quiz with 5 quick correct answers and then pose the query why is Q paying someone to stand there and ask what you have already proven to be competent in by passing your EP's.
Frankly, I would have thought duty hour linits and a more articulate, reasonable and realistic fatigue management program would be more worthy of a fight.
AT
why is this even being debated !!!!!! (note: statement not a question)
baseline:
if you can't answer 5 questions (and get a second chance if you bugger it up )- then frankly you should leave the keys on the table, organise your farewell drinks and log onto seek.com
All this garbage about being "stressed" by a pre-flight quiz ...WTF?..... you are either a professional or you're not.
And if you want people to see CC as professional people (which the greater majority are) then ace the quiz with 5 quick correct answers and then pose the query why is Q paying someone to stand there and ask what you have already proven to be competent in by passing your EP's.
Frankly, I would have thought duty hour linits and a more articulate, reasonable and realistic fatigue management program would be more worthy of a fight.
AT
