Air Niugini News
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seth Afrika
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Arn't the APNG ATR 72's going to be configured for something like 40 seats. Would think that the 3.0 odd tonne reduced payload would make a bit of a difference over the DH8-100 currently used.
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Port Moresby
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ATR vs DHC
I understand the newest ATR 42-600 to be a capable aircraft surpassing the performance of the 100 or 300 DHC's. ATR200 and 300 are pathetic but the 500 has many good features..
ANG has looked at this but my information is they discount the aircraft due to landing gear issues and economics. The gear is not as wide as the DHC- and 8 or 10 aircraft carry a heafty replacement cost.
The 300 acqusitions are on hold while the Q400 is inducted, it is possible more 400's will be ordered and could phase out the 300 altogether. Faster better range and a lower seat kilometer cost is a convincing arguement.
The classic DHC's are no longer being manufactured but the support has not changed and Bombardier has recently implemented a 120k cycle life, extending from the current 80k. Bombardier is making a ton of money on parts and support so I don't see this stopping any time soon.
ANG however doesn't have any Dash 8 aircraft older than 35k cycles so they have anouther 40 years useful life there if anyone thinks that far ahead.
ANG recently invested significant funds into their Dash 8 with WAAS enabled FMS, so I think they are likely to keep these aircraft for a period of time. The replacement glass cockpit has been evaluated as costly but justified if the aircraft are to remain for decades into the future.
ATR however have in the past purchased entire fleets in order to place their equipment (Bangkok Air) so who knows maybe the ATR 42-600 could become the new standard in this category. At least until Bombardier start manufacturing a new and improved 50 passenger.
ANG has looked at this but my information is they discount the aircraft due to landing gear issues and economics. The gear is not as wide as the DHC- and 8 or 10 aircraft carry a heafty replacement cost.
The 300 acqusitions are on hold while the Q400 is inducted, it is possible more 400's will be ordered and could phase out the 300 altogether. Faster better range and a lower seat kilometer cost is a convincing arguement.
The classic DHC's are no longer being manufactured but the support has not changed and Bombardier has recently implemented a 120k cycle life, extending from the current 80k. Bombardier is making a ton of money on parts and support so I don't see this stopping any time soon.
ANG however doesn't have any Dash 8 aircraft older than 35k cycles so they have anouther 40 years useful life there if anyone thinks that far ahead.
ANG recently invested significant funds into their Dash 8 with WAAS enabled FMS, so I think they are likely to keep these aircraft for a period of time. The replacement glass cockpit has been evaluated as costly but justified if the aircraft are to remain for decades into the future.
ATR however have in the past purchased entire fleets in order to place their equipment (Bangkok Air) so who knows maybe the ATR 42-600 could become the new standard in this category. At least until Bombardier start manufacturing a new and improved 50 passenger.
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Would have thought that the narrower track of the ATR would have been a positive on narrow sealed, (and unsealed with the low pressure tyre option) runways. They can handle a good crosswind. The trailing link certainly makes for a smoother arrival than the long stiff oleos of the Dash.
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Pointy End
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The end of the domestic jet service?
It looks like the days of a domestic jet service are coming to a sad end, dictated by the runway limitations and lack of upkeep/upgrade on the current strips. It is sad that the government allows this to happen, nothing against turboprops, having flown F27, Dash 7 and F28 domestically for PX, but the "smok balus" is definitely a better option.
The traveling population of PNG is constantly increasing yet PX is dictated to buy smaller, slower aircraft due to the runways, to me this is a great disservice to the people. Any hope of getting the domestic airports upgraded for B737 or A320 type operations is unfortunately fast becoming a pipe dream.
The traveling population of PNG is constantly increasing yet PX is dictated to buy smaller, slower aircraft due to the runways, to me this is a great disservice to the people. Any hope of getting the domestic airports upgraded for B737 or A320 type operations is unfortunately fast becoming a pipe dream.
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Bai, mi go long hap na kisim sampla samting.
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Whats all this about the ATR not having an APU? The 72-500 that was in PNG had the right prop brake on and he engine was the APU. Flew very nicely but required a dispensation from the country of registration to allow it to land at Kunai due to the strip width. Other than that it fit the bill for the proposed job nicely. even had a 90min ETOPs approval.
I don't believe that APNG are actually looking at buying them though. The visiting one was here on proving flights for a particular contract and was proposed to be operated under the APNG AOC whilst its own FAOC application was being processed.
Quite possible I'm wrong though....... it happened once before.
I don't believe that APNG are actually looking at buying them though. The visiting one was here on proving flights for a particular contract and was proposed to be operated under the APNG AOC whilst its own FAOC application was being processed.
Quite possible I'm wrong though....... it happened once before.
atr apu
Wizard,
The big tail light and rear fuse was to put the apu in, but they never did. It does not have one. Yes like the Saab the idea was RH engine and prop brake, and just like the Saab seldom used in practice for various reasons. So in the tropics please board first and wait in row one for 10-20 mins while the engines are started for air conditioning and you will see what i am on about. But then you still have to put up with cramped seats with your back staight up and down. I commute as a passenger in them weekly and given the chance will wait an hour to get a Dash 8. Then pick up a F27 freighter and think what a roomy beast they must have been with 50 on board. We do not seem to have come far in the last 50 years, apart from burning a little less gas.
The big tail light and rear fuse was to put the apu in, but they never did. It does not have one. Yes like the Saab the idea was RH engine and prop brake, and just like the Saab seldom used in practice for various reasons. So in the tropics please board first and wait in row one for 10-20 mins while the engines are started for air conditioning and you will see what i am on about. But then you still have to put up with cramped seats with your back staight up and down. I commute as a passenger in them weekly and given the chance will wait an hour to get a Dash 8. Then pick up a F27 freighter and think what a roomy beast they must have been with 50 on board. We do not seem to have come far in the last 50 years, apart from burning a little less gas.
Join Date: Jun 2008
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What the hell....? 20 years ago in Fiji - and that is the same Latitude as Innisfail - well and truly in the Tropics, - we used to start the right engine with the prop braked and cool the cabin for 5 minutes before calling for boarding. The cabin and the girls and the tech crew were cool to receive the passengers, and the passengers were cool too when they sat down, whether in Fiji, Vanuatu, Samoa, or Tonga. What is so special about New Guinea..? On the ground, and on descent into Nausori or Nadi we would get fogging from the airconditioning due to the moisture in the humid air as the airconditioning system from the engine system proved just how efficient it was working in the local environment.
( Just had to warn the Nervous Nellies that it wasn't smoke, tasol)
At altitude, they used to ask what the knocking on the fuse ice shields was as the props shed ice when going through a buildup with big droplets.
But the cabin was warm then..
p.s. And if you wanted to save fuel, to make up for the 5 minutes, it was alright to release the prop brake, push back or reverse taxi on one, and start the other on the way to the holding point for the active..
That's how it was designed.... back then.
( Just had to warn the Nervous Nellies that it wasn't smoke, tasol)
At altitude, they used to ask what the knocking on the fuse ice shields was as the props shed ice when going through a buildup with big droplets.
But the cabin was warm then..
p.s. And if you wanted to save fuel, to make up for the 5 minutes, it was alright to release the prop brake, push back or reverse taxi on one, and start the other on the way to the holding point for the active..
That's how it was designed.... back then.
Last edited by frigatebird; 18th Jun 2010 at 11:23.
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Brisbane,
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ATR Aircon
Frigatebird,I have to agree.Not sure about the ATR42,but I have just done a few legs on the 72 in Vietnam.From Phu Quoc (around 9degrees N,about the same as POM is S)with OAT at 33C the right hand engine was used with the brake on and I have to say that on boarding it was a very comfortable environment. Saabs,I guess it depends on how far you're commuting but for a 59 minute flight and at 183cm/100kg,I had no problems at all.Unlike the 4.5 hour Jetstar flight to DRW.That's another story altogether!
I heard exactly the same thing yesterday BB from a reliable source. First 3 before christmas. Sounds like the old Dash 8 days might be drawing to an end.
The only one they might keep is ANK as that isn't leased.
The only one they might keep is ANK as that isn't leased.
Join Date: May 2008
Location: LAE, PAPUA NEW GUINEA
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BB and WW are apparently close to the mark. From an impeccable source this morning, 3 by year end, probably looking at 8 total (but 12 mentioned) intended to replace the DHC-8 1/2/300s.
Despite the high level of Bombardier support the DHC-8 is still seen as a mixed fleet (2 x 100 3 x 200 3 x 300) which requires a disproportionately high investment in spares to fleet size.
Despite the high level of Bombardier support the DHC-8 is still seen as a mixed fleet (2 x 100 3 x 200 3 x 300) which requires a disproportionately high investment in spares to fleet size.
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Anyone know where they plan on sending 2 x 767s and a 757? The new 767 is not reflected in the current schedule.
As per the website, the config is 46/148. That is very generous in terms of space. Is the J class market to PNG that substantial?
As per the website, the config is 46/148. That is very generous in terms of space. Is the J class market to PNG that substantial?