New Ticket Team vying to wrest control of AIPA
Never let the facts get in the way of the truth. The new CP is very keen to do a deal in 2 weeks. It would be EBA7 with back pay, more money for the 380, fixed allowances and a couple of other small issues fixed. It would be a compliant agreement as allowed for under law and could be put to the troops prior to Xmas and allow the engineers to get back pay with their retrenchment. EBA 8 was and allways will be the greatest crock of s..t we will ever see.
Nunc est bibendum
I voted 'no' to EBA8 because I reckoned we could do better. 'Better' to me wasn't a pay rise for A380 S/Os so that they could earn more than 744 S/Os who already earn more than 767 F/Os. 
Here is our chance to 'bury' the day 1 lottery and bring all S/Os onto the same pay rate. Instead it appears we're going to continue the charade and further disadvantage those who take promotion in the first few years in order to protect the few who can't/won't take promotion in the first dozen?
I hope that the rumours are wrong because if this is the way it goes down I'll be very disappointed in this 'new' AIPA. The pendulum will have swung back too far the other way.
Here is our chance to 'bury' the day 1 lottery and bring all S/Os onto the same pay rate. Instead it appears we're going to continue the charade and further disadvantage those who take promotion in the first few years in order to protect the few who can't/won't take promotion in the first dozen?
I hope that the rumours are wrong because if this is the way it goes down I'll be very disappointed in this 'new' AIPA. The pendulum will have swung back too far the other way.
The new CP is very keen to do a deal in 2 weeks.
Are you telling me that the previous EBA negotiating team sat through 18 months and 40 odd separate meetings with the company to eek out EBA 8 and now the new Wonder Team is going cut a deal in two weeks?
Equine droppings.
You people who think EBA 8 is OK stagger me. Read section F again and think how savagely you would be screwed by it. Remember, what is written is what would happen - those comfortable words from QCC that "we would never use xxxx" are not worth the paper they are written on.
I have been in charge of scheduling and negotiated contracts with charlie Q and I've seen it time after time.
I have been in charge of scheduling and negotiated contracts with charlie Q and I've seen it time after time.
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The reason EBA8 took 18 months was because GD et al were re-writing the entire agreement and making it fit their retirement plan. The new exec will merely put EBA7 to bed so we can get on with number 8, after asking the rank and file what's important.
OK mustafagander I will read Part F again. But perhaps you could enlighten people like me into exactly how we were going to be screwed because the changes that I reviewed seemed reasonable asks.
Considering the rostering Part F of EBA 8 contained some 39 pages replacing the at least 108 pages of Part 6 of EBA 7 even dumb prix like myself had a reasonable chance of understanding the new rostering rules.
And lambsie, I am sure it wasn't GD ,et al as you put it that rewrote the entire agreement, but rather it was the AIPA team that came up with the proposals in the first instance. All the Company said was that we needed to be more efficient. Oh, and that they didn't want to pay any more for the A380.
Putting EBA7 to bed in the next 2 weeks will consign us to greater irrelevance.
Pushing forward with a new pay rate for the A380 embedded within a revised EBA7 is largely what this whole shemozzle is about - because, you know, 300 grand a year to be a 744 Capt is just not enough.
By all means go ahead and ask the rank and file what is important. They will most likely tell you that they want more dough for less work.
Considering the rostering Part F of EBA 8 contained some 39 pages replacing the at least 108 pages of Part 6 of EBA 7 even dumb prix like myself had a reasonable chance of understanding the new rostering rules.
And lambsie, I am sure it wasn't GD ,et al as you put it that rewrote the entire agreement, but rather it was the AIPA team that came up with the proposals in the first instance. All the Company said was that we needed to be more efficient. Oh, and that they didn't want to pay any more for the A380.
Putting EBA7 to bed in the next 2 weeks will consign us to greater irrelevance.
Pushing forward with a new pay rate for the A380 embedded within a revised EBA7 is largely what this whole shemozzle is about - because, you know, 300 grand a year to be a 744 Capt is just not enough.
By all means go ahead and ask the rank and file what is important. They will most likely tell you that they want more dough for less work.
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Our new president summed it up nicely yesterday....EBA 7 is dead. It is unrealistic to think that we can continue with our head in the sand thinking that the EBA 7 contract and all the b#***** that goes with it will keep us competitive in the current environment. Give us the EBA7 rollover, get the back pay and lets get a new competitive EBA 8 underway.
Tempo, you are 100% correct. I might be out by 3 or 4 days however the aim is to have this finished by November 30 and a vote prior to xmas. There is goodwill from the new CP grab it with both hands and run.
I have heard on good authority all that will be offered is 3%.
New rates for the A380 so we can kiss goodbye any hope of relevance for the future.
Rumour has it QANTAS have employed the services of a former RUDD adviser to lobby for change to the Sale ACT opening the way for the final stage in GOD's plan.
Already we see JitConnect getting B737-800's, Mainline portrayed in the media as suffering great downturn in forward bookings whilst Jetstar is saving the day.... heard today from the gingerbeers the B767's are due to stay now till 2016!!
Mainline will wither on the vine in the new global order unfolding before us!!
New rates for the A380 so we can kiss goodbye any hope of relevance for the future.
Rumour has it QANTAS have employed the services of a former RUDD adviser to lobby for change to the Sale ACT opening the way for the final stage in GOD's plan.
Already we see JitConnect getting B737-800's, Mainline portrayed in the media as suffering great downturn in forward bookings whilst Jetstar is saving the day.... heard today from the gingerbeers the B767's are due to stay now till 2016!!
Mainline will wither on the vine in the new global order unfolding before us!!
Well I can't see good old GD rushing to sign off on another EBA or variant in the next 15 days before he hands over the reins to Al Joyce.
And when the new bloke arrives I think his plate is going to be rather full with reviews of capacity cuts, etc so worrying about a pay rate for the A380 is going to be way down the list. And why not - he is having his flying done for Dec 2005 rates of pay. No need to rush that one through*.
Lets face it boys and girls - our one shot has been well and truly fired. And it missed.
And Tempo - if EBA 7 is well and truly dead then how come I received an email this morning from the Pres informing me of the four so-called options?
*I know about the contractural requirement to have A380 pay and conditions in place within 3 months(?) of it commencing revenue ops. But here is my prediciton - it will still be flying regardless.
And when the new bloke arrives I think his plate is going to be rather full with reviews of capacity cuts, etc so worrying about a pay rate for the A380 is going to be way down the list. And why not - he is having his flying done for Dec 2005 rates of pay. No need to rush that one through*.
Lets face it boys and girls - our one shot has been well and truly fired. And it missed.
And Tempo - if EBA 7 is well and truly dead then how come I received an email this morning from the Pres informing me of the four so-called options?
*I know about the contractural requirement to have A380 pay and conditions in place within 3 months(?) of it commencing revenue ops. But here is my prediciton - it will still be flying regardless.
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Even the smaller brained Pilots in Qantas would not accept back pay at 3%. If the new AIPA Executive wants to follow that line, then they are truly without backbone and intelligence and will be relegated very quickly to the dustbin marked “incompetents”.
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The new team are getting the runs on the board early...... not!
An email went out today to all AIPA members. There will be no roll-over agreement of the EBA so good bye backpay and all the other niggly little issues for the time being, its back to negotiating a new EBA from scratch! Apparently the "speak softly and negotiate with our cuddly new friends in Flt Ops" approach has had about as much luck as the realists amongst us expected it would.
All those who tossed out the last President because they perceived the company wouldn't negotiate with him take note. You were wrong and this team is going to run into exactly the same roadblocks.
Contract 2010 anyone?
An email went out today to all AIPA members. There will be no roll-over agreement of the EBA so good bye backpay and all the other niggly little issues for the time being, its back to negotiating a new EBA from scratch! Apparently the "speak softly and negotiate with our cuddly new friends in Flt Ops" approach has had about as much luck as the realists amongst us expected it would.
All those who tossed out the last President because they perceived the company wouldn't negotiate with him take note. You were wrong and this team is going to run into exactly the same roadblocks.
Contract 2010 anyone?
Capt K,
You can still get your backpay if you choose.....at 3%. I am quite comfortable that we are being asked...BTW didn't we get told EBA 7 +3+3 wasn't available and now it is...Who was telling the truth? EBA 8 was voted down wasn't it or was I mistaken. The best time to get a deal across the line came and went. Who's fault was that?
You can still get your backpay if you choose.....at 3%. I am quite comfortable that we are being asked...BTW didn't we get told EBA 7 +3+3 wasn't available and now it is...Who was telling the truth? EBA 8 was voted down wasn't it or was I mistaken. The best time to get a deal across the line came and went. Who's fault was that?
Com meeting to be held tomorrow. Rumour has it one of the agenda items is the survey findings. > 90% return rate
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Some of you guys are unbelievable.
What did the ARG achieve in their time in power besides endless court cases with a win-loss ratio that make Souths look good, an EBA overwhelmingly voted down (negotiated by the man who turned jetstar away, yet another masterstroke) and were trusted as much as management??? Oh and I'm not a 400 capt either....
Time for a change and the tribe has spoken! Accept it!
What did the ARG achieve in their time in power besides endless court cases with a win-loss ratio that make Souths look good, an EBA overwhelmingly voted down (negotiated by the man who turned jetstar away, yet another masterstroke) and were trusted as much as management??? Oh and I'm not a 400 capt either....
Time for a change and the tribe has spoken! Accept it!