Merged: ASA Staff Shortage
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Seems ASA isn't just short of staff at home:
Kona Airport Incident Raises Safety Questions - Honolulu News Story - KITV Honolulu
PS Dick Smith, maybe this is the key to how ASA runs these towers cheaper than the FAA...?
Kona Airport Incident Raises Safety Questions - Honolulu News Story - KITV Honolulu
PS Dick Smith, maybe this is the key to how ASA runs these towers cheaper than the FAA...?
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Staff shortage fix???
There has been a project team formed for the eurocat replacement with the aim of a supposed replacment of the current platform in 2013ish.
Given the board papers doing the rounds that stated a goal of a single centre in Melbourne, would that not reduce the need for operational staff overall and those that would move from Brisbane to Melbourne would be able to provide the hold grail of "full staffing"?
Maybe TFN is in no great hurry to employ more staff?????
seeing that this is the 304th day of August an all....
Given the board papers doing the rounds that stated a goal of a single centre in Melbourne, would that not reduce the need for operational staff overall and those that would move from Brisbane to Melbourne would be able to provide the hold grail of "full staffing"?
Maybe TFN is in no great hurry to employ more staff?????
seeing that this is the 304th day of August an all....
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Where did this "move Brisbane to Melbourne" thing surface from anyway ? Heard some Melbourne sectors were actually being transferred up to Brisbane...???
Wasn't Sydney approach (50 people) going to Melbourne Centre by 2012 ? (announced in 2002). How quickly that fell on its arse. How the hell then are you going to move 350 odd people out of Brisbane ? Not in 10 years, that's for sure...
Wasn't Sydney approach (50 people) going to Melbourne Centre by 2012 ? (announced in 2002). How quickly that fell on its arse. How the hell then are you going to move 350 odd people out of Brisbane ? Not in 10 years, that's for sure...
Join Date: Feb 2004
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"Heard some Melbourne sectors were actually being transferred up to Brisbane...???"
WTF? Don`t ya know most sectors in the deep south don`t even use the current system we have? Wots an auto hand-off? Non-coord trial? It all sounds a bit dodgy to the deep south.
Still, i digress. Yes, BS Castle ( somewhere between the two largest operational centres ) no doubt is formulating plans to efficiently and effortlessly move Vegas to the deep south. Think of the cost savings, the axing of the Brisbane Gymnasium, the forced redundancies in the cafeteria ( No, they`re on contract- we just close the doors! Easy!) The list is endless. Quick, employ more consultants, accountants etc. to compile a list of efficiencies that we can realise. OOOOHHHH this sounds so GOOOOOD!
Close that Academy NOW. Who needs trainees! Version 12 will save us heaps until we can move to a new fangled thing that doesn`t require those pesky controllers.
ps. Anybody know when we can expect V12 to get another go! Now that was fun!
WTF? Don`t ya know most sectors in the deep south don`t even use the current system we have? Wots an auto hand-off? Non-coord trial? It all sounds a bit dodgy to the deep south.
Still, i digress. Yes, BS Castle ( somewhere between the two largest operational centres ) no doubt is formulating plans to efficiently and effortlessly move Vegas to the deep south. Think of the cost savings, the axing of the Brisbane Gymnasium, the forced redundancies in the cafeteria ( No, they`re on contract- we just close the doors! Easy!) The list is endless. Quick, employ more consultants, accountants etc. to compile a list of efficiencies that we can realise. OOOOHHHH this sounds so GOOOOOD!
Close that Academy NOW. Who needs trainees! Version 12 will save us heaps until we can move to a new fangled thing that doesn`t require those pesky controllers.
ps. Anybody know when we can expect V12 to get another go! Now that was fun!
Join Date: May 2002
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Management are desperate to get Version12 in as it provides seamless upgrades i.e. we don't have to go to a degraded system whilst upgrades are done.
Why is this you ask. Because the seamless upgrades are required to allow the use of the Flight Plan Conflict Probe (FPCP or FPCTool) to be used on the operational platform. It doesn't pass the safety case in degraded modes.
The FPCP will allow 'Free Flight' that the GSH promised to industry last year at Waypoint 2008 Conference. At this same conference the GM ATC assured industry that ASA would stop over-promising and under delivering. The conference is usually held in July/August. Embarrassing.
The one centre concept is just more 'smoke and mirrors'. If you have less than 10-15 years to go (which is probably most of us in Vegas) I wouldn't worry about updating the winter wardrobe.
It is just more spin that allows ANOTHER project team to justify their existence and get up their FF points.
I hope V12 does get up in a usable form and we can give the industry what ASA keep promising. We then run into the problem that the procedural sim exercises will all then need to be redone. From what I am hearing not a lot of work has been done in this regard yet.
Why is this you ask. Because the seamless upgrades are required to allow the use of the Flight Plan Conflict Probe (FPCP or FPCTool) to be used on the operational platform. It doesn't pass the safety case in degraded modes.
The FPCP will allow 'Free Flight' that the GSH promised to industry last year at Waypoint 2008 Conference. At this same conference the GM ATC assured industry that ASA would stop over-promising and under delivering. The conference is usually held in July/August. Embarrassing.
The one centre concept is just more 'smoke and mirrors'. If you have less than 10-15 years to go (which is probably most of us in Vegas) I wouldn't worry about updating the winter wardrobe.
It is just more spin that allows ANOTHER project team to justify their existence and get up their FF points.
I hope V12 does get up in a usable form and we can give the industry what ASA keep promising. We then run into the problem that the procedural sim exercises will all then need to be redone. From what I am hearing not a lot of work has been done in this regard yet.
Assuming such a move is actually possible / probable / (WTF?)
Will those staff who choose not to relocate to 'Mexico' be offerred redundo, or will they simply be 'left by the wayside'?
(Could be 'nice' if one is approaching retirement age anyway....)
Will those staff who choose not to relocate to 'Mexico' be offerred redundo, or will they simply be 'left by the wayside'?
(Could be 'nice' if one is approaching retirement age anyway....)
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Max1,
Very insightful!
On the money, I'd suggest, except for:
Book early to avoid disappointment! 
Very insightful!
On the money, I'd suggest, except for:
Participate, engage and contribute at Waypoint 2009
Here is your chance to become actively involved in Airservices Australia's planning for the future.
At Waypoint 2009, international and domestic experts from industry and government will engage in collaborative discussions and decision making on issues critical to the services Airservices Australia provides and the aviation industry as a whole.
You can engage with our aviation partners including airlines, airports, defence, policy makers, regulation providers and the general aviation community.
Facilitated workshops will provide you with an opportunity to outline your priorities and contribute to the future of our industry.
Airservices is calling on you to get involved and have your say at our annual premier industry consultative forum, Waypoint 2009.
This year's conference will be held at the National Convention Centre in Canberra on 17 – 18 June.
This event is by invitation only.
For more information about Waypoint 2009 please contact....
Here is your chance to become actively involved in Airservices Australia's planning for the future.
At Waypoint 2009, international and domestic experts from industry and government will engage in collaborative discussions and decision making on issues critical to the services Airservices Australia provides and the aviation industry as a whole.
You can engage with our aviation partners including airlines, airports, defence, policy makers, regulation providers and the general aviation community.
Facilitated workshops will provide you with an opportunity to outline your priorities and contribute to the future of our industry.
Airservices is calling on you to get involved and have your say at our annual premier industry consultative forum, Waypoint 2009.
This year's conference will be held at the National Convention Centre in Canberra on 17 – 18 June.
This event is by invitation only.
For more information about Waypoint 2009 please contact....
Join Date: May 2002
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FGS,
It is not so much a doesn't fit. The current exercises are in line with the aircraft flying on designated routes.
New exercises will have to be designed to have the aircraft in 'free flight' and the new dilemnas that may bring up.
Current sectorization is built around designated routes, and there are usually defined boundary positions. With the advent of free flight controllers will have to be alert to the different co-ord requirements that may be required.
As such I have heard that these new exercises for some sectors have not been developed yet. There may be issues that haven't been considered in full yet. e.g. myriad exit/re-entry flights that may impinge on automatic ESTs , Hand-offs etc.
Or it may work well? Heres hoping.
It is not so much a doesn't fit. The current exercises are in line with the aircraft flying on designated routes.
New exercises will have to be designed to have the aircraft in 'free flight' and the new dilemnas that may bring up.
Current sectorization is built around designated routes, and there are usually defined boundary positions. With the advent of free flight controllers will have to be alert to the different co-ord requirements that may be required.
As such I have heard that these new exercises for some sectors have not been developed yet. There may be issues that haven't been considered in full yet. e.g. myriad exit/re-entry flights that may impinge on automatic ESTs , Hand-offs etc.
Or it may work well? Heres hoping.
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Further to my last, I am not disparaging the FPCP. It is a great tool.
The person/s who developed it are very smart individuals.
It is now whether the forward planning, when we get it on the operational platform, has been done?
The person/s who developed it are very smart individuals.
It is now whether the forward planning, when we get it on the operational platform, has been done?
Join Date: Feb 2004
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Doesn`t the FPCP rely on Version 12?
A little birdy whispered in my ear today " At least a month and maybe 12 months away from the operational platform for a second go". mmmmm.
I still reckon we`ll need more contollers before technology and generic ratings make controllers obsolete!
A little birdy whispered in my ear today " At least a month and maybe 12 months away from the operational platform for a second go". mmmmm.
I still reckon we`ll need more contollers before technology and generic ratings make controllers obsolete!
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Version X11: king Jim version?
All those jolly airplanes,
Zapping hither thither,
Version 12 will save the day:
ATC ranks will wither.
No longer ratings need be held
For some this may suit yer
The ali-cans controlled from blo
By my version 12 computer.
GR
Zapping hither thither,
Version 12 will save the day:
ATC ranks will wither.
No longer ratings need be held
For some this may suit yer
The ali-cans controlled from blo
By my version 12 computer.
GR
Last edited by go-rownd; 2nd Jun 2009 at 14:35.
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Last time I checked, the kiwis had a FPCP and also have controllers. I assume this would be world's best practice? As usual AsA will look for flexibility and this would of course mean in real language 'saving money' hence the requirement for Zero controllers. Of course this would mean no shut down due lack of services...... until the whole thing shuts down with a failure...... again.
Thread Starter
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The GCAA, Serco, the IAA, DFS et al, all thank Airservices management for their ongoing ineptitude and dazzling contribution to staffing the world's Towers and ACCs. Well done. Other ANSPs to be added shortly.
Smile and wave, boys, smile and wave.
Smile and wave, boys, smile and wave.
Join Date: Apr 2009
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Add
ANS Czech Republic.
ps
Global Recruits be careful what you wish for: the Learning Academy still has no idea how to effectively manage you training, and it's a bloody long way to go to be very disappointed !
SP xxxx
ANS Czech Republic.
ps
Global Recruits be careful what you wish for: the Learning Academy still has no idea how to effectively manage you training, and it's a bloody long way to go to be very disappointed !
SP xxxx