David Hicks
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Now i'm not very well versed in these matters, but why not send over a RAAF Challenger? Hasn't got the legs of a Gee-Vee
, but could surely have done the job for under half a mil.
ABX- It was actually the US military prosecuters themselves that said Hicks had never fired a shot in anger.
The whole process of having a person held without charge for YEARS, regardless of the outcome, just makes me hang my head in shame. How we as a country not only accept, but endorse this process is appalling.
For the record, i think the guy's a f***wit.
, but could surely have done the job for under half a mil.ABX- It was actually the US military prosecuters themselves that said Hicks had never fired a shot in anger.
The whole process of having a person held without charge for YEARS, regardless of the outcome, just makes me hang my head in shame. How we as a country not only accept, but endorse this process is appalling.
For the record, i think the guy's a f***wit.
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i read in the paper that the flight wasorganised through ADAgold aviation. www.adagold.com.au
they are not a charter company but a broker or sorts.
I cant find the link but it was on the daily telegraph site
they are not a charter company but a broker or sorts.
I cant find the link but it was on the daily telegraph site
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With a bit of luck, when the hick is allowed to open his mouth in public, he'll make as big a fool of himself almost as quickly as the last 'oppressed champion' the cuddlies rescued from the Yanks' Cuban holiday camp.
...maybe even before Bob Brown tries to get him to stand for Parliament for his crowd.
...maybe even before Bob Brown tries to get him to stand for Parliament for his crowd.
The Reverend
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ABX, YesTAM's source was Wikepedia. Hicks was captured by an Afgan warlord and sold to the Northern Alliance authorities for USD 1000. What YesTAM failed to convey, was the preceding paragraphs in the Wikepedia report. Interesting reading!
[edit] Early life
David Hicks was born in Adelaide, South Australia, son of Terry and Susan, who are British citizens by birth. He has one sister. His parents separated when he was ten years old, his father later remarrying.[11][12] Hicks was expelled from school at age 14.[13]
Described by his father as "a typical boy who couldn't settle down",[13] and by his old school mates from Salisbury High as a heavy drinker and cannabis smoker who would use a compass to scratch satanic symbols into his arm,[5] Hicks moved between various jobs. These jobs included skinning kangaroos at a meat-packing factory, fishing for sharks, and working at a series of outback cattle stations in the Northern Territory, Queensland, and South Australia. It was at a cattle station that he met his wife by common-law Jodie Sparrow in 1992. Hicks and Sparrow had two children before separating in 1996. He eventually lost contact with his two young children. "He used to pinch cars and you know, that sort of stuff. Like, that was the only way he sort of fed himself and that." remembers Sparrow. [13][5] After their separation Hicks moved to Japan to become a horse trainer.[13]
[edit] Militant activity
David Hicks, on the left, posing with a Rocket propelled grenade (RPG) on his first day of training with the KLA in Albania [14]In 1999, Hicks traveled to Albania, where he joined the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA), a paramilitary organization of ethnic Albanians fighting against Serbian forces in the Kosovo War, and served with them for two months. [15] On returning to Australia Hicks applied to join the Australian Army but was rejected due to his low level of formal education.[5] Hicks then converted to Islam and began to study Arabic.[16]
On November 11, 1999,[14] Hicks traveled to Pakistan to study Islam.[17] After a period of time he began training with the Lashkar-e-Toiba [18] learning guerrilla warfare, weapons training (including landmines), kidnapping techniques, and assassination methods.[2] In a March 2000 letter, Hicks told his family
"don't ask what's happened, I can't be bothered explaining the outcome of these strange events has put me in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir in a training camp. Three months training. After which it is my decision whether to cross the line of control into Indian-occupied Kashmir."[19]
In another letter on August 10, 2000, Hicks wrote from Kashmir, claiming to have been a guest of Pakistan's army for two weeks at the front in the "controlled war" with India.[19] At the time, Lashkar-e-Toiba was an Islamic fighting group that had widespread support in Pakistan. It had a reputation for being focused on fighting India in Kashmir but was also accused of attacks against Indian civilians. After the September 11, 2001 attacks and its banning as a terrorist group by Pakistan in January 2002, Lashkar-e-Toiba fragmented and branched out into sectarian violence.[20][21] Lashkar-e-Toiba was banned in Australia in 2003.[22]
A "resentful and deeply unflattering" handwritten memoir signed by Feroz Abbasi while incarcerated in Guantanamo Bay, later repudiated by Abbasi on October 20, 2004, in another signed statement, claimed Hicks was "Al-Qaedah's 24 ct. [carat] Golden Boy" and "obviously the favorite recruit" of their al-Qaeda trainers during exercises at the al-Farouq camp near Kandahar.[23]The failed British shoe bomber Richard Colvin Reid was another graduate of the camp. The memoir made a number of (hearsay) allegations, including that Hicks was teamed in the training camp with Filipino recruits from the Moro Islamic Liberation Front and that during internment in Camp X-Ray, "Hicks [said] he was praying to Satan for help". Hicks "attended a number of al-Qaeda training courses at various camps around Afghanistan, including an advanced course on surveillance, in which he conducted surveillance of the US and British embassies in Kabul, Afghanistan". [2] On one occasion when al-Qaeda founder Osama bin Laden visited an Afghan camp, Hicks questioned bin Laden about the lack of English in training material and subsequently "began to translate the training camp materials from Arabic to English".[2] Hicks wrote home that he'd met Osama bin Laden 20 times, later telling investigators that he'd exaggerated. He'd seen bin Laden about eight times and spoken to him only once.[24]Prosecutors also allege Hicks was interviewed by Muhammad Atef, an al-Qaeda military commander, about his background and "the travel habits of Australians".[2] The US Department of Defense statement claimed "that after viewing TV news coverage in Pakistan of the Sept 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, [Hicks] returned to Afghanistan to rejoin his al-Qaeda associates to fight against US, British, Canadian, Australian, Afghan, and other coalition forces [...] It is alleged Hicks armed himself with an AK-47 automatic rifle, ammunition, and grenades to fight against coalition forces."[2]
Hicks spoke to his parents from just outside the southern Afghan city of Kandahar in November 2001. "He said something about going off to Kabul to defend it against the Northern Alliance," Terry Hicks said.
David Hicks was born in Adelaide, South Australia, son of Terry and Susan, who are British citizens by birth. He has one sister. His parents separated when he was ten years old, his father later remarrying.[11][12] Hicks was expelled from school at age 14.[13]
Described by his father as "a typical boy who couldn't settle down",[13] and by his old school mates from Salisbury High as a heavy drinker and cannabis smoker who would use a compass to scratch satanic symbols into his arm,[5] Hicks moved between various jobs. These jobs included skinning kangaroos at a meat-packing factory, fishing for sharks, and working at a series of outback cattle stations in the Northern Territory, Queensland, and South Australia. It was at a cattle station that he met his wife by common-law Jodie Sparrow in 1992. Hicks and Sparrow had two children before separating in 1996. He eventually lost contact with his two young children. "He used to pinch cars and you know, that sort of stuff. Like, that was the only way he sort of fed himself and that." remembers Sparrow. [13][5] After their separation Hicks moved to Japan to become a horse trainer.[13]
[edit] Militant activity
David Hicks, on the left, posing with a Rocket propelled grenade (RPG) on his first day of training with the KLA in Albania [14]In 1999, Hicks traveled to Albania, where he joined the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA), a paramilitary organization of ethnic Albanians fighting against Serbian forces in the Kosovo War, and served with them for two months. [15] On returning to Australia Hicks applied to join the Australian Army but was rejected due to his low level of formal education.[5] Hicks then converted to Islam and began to study Arabic.[16]
On November 11, 1999,[14] Hicks traveled to Pakistan to study Islam.[17] After a period of time he began training with the Lashkar-e-Toiba [18] learning guerrilla warfare, weapons training (including landmines), kidnapping techniques, and assassination methods.[2] In a March 2000 letter, Hicks told his family
"don't ask what's happened, I can't be bothered explaining the outcome of these strange events has put me in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir in a training camp. Three months training. After which it is my decision whether to cross the line of control into Indian-occupied Kashmir."[19]
In another letter on August 10, 2000, Hicks wrote from Kashmir, claiming to have been a guest of Pakistan's army for two weeks at the front in the "controlled war" with India.[19] At the time, Lashkar-e-Toiba was an Islamic fighting group that had widespread support in Pakistan. It had a reputation for being focused on fighting India in Kashmir but was also accused of attacks against Indian civilians. After the September 11, 2001 attacks and its banning as a terrorist group by Pakistan in January 2002, Lashkar-e-Toiba fragmented and branched out into sectarian violence.[20][21] Lashkar-e-Toiba was banned in Australia in 2003.[22]
A "resentful and deeply unflattering" handwritten memoir signed by Feroz Abbasi while incarcerated in Guantanamo Bay, later repudiated by Abbasi on October 20, 2004, in another signed statement, claimed Hicks was "Al-Qaedah's 24 ct. [carat] Golden Boy" and "obviously the favorite recruit" of their al-Qaeda trainers during exercises at the al-Farouq camp near Kandahar.[23]The failed British shoe bomber Richard Colvin Reid was another graduate of the camp. The memoir made a number of (hearsay) allegations, including that Hicks was teamed in the training camp with Filipino recruits from the Moro Islamic Liberation Front and that during internment in Camp X-Ray, "Hicks [said] he was praying to Satan for help". Hicks "attended a number of al-Qaeda training courses at various camps around Afghanistan, including an advanced course on surveillance, in which he conducted surveillance of the US and British embassies in Kabul, Afghanistan". [2] On one occasion when al-Qaeda founder Osama bin Laden visited an Afghan camp, Hicks questioned bin Laden about the lack of English in training material and subsequently "began to translate the training camp materials from Arabic to English".[2] Hicks wrote home that he'd met Osama bin Laden 20 times, later telling investigators that he'd exaggerated. He'd seen bin Laden about eight times and spoken to him only once.[24]Prosecutors also allege Hicks was interviewed by Muhammad Atef, an al-Qaeda military commander, about his background and "the travel habits of Australians".[2] The US Department of Defense statement claimed "that after viewing TV news coverage in Pakistan of the Sept 11, 2001, attacks against the United States, [Hicks] returned to Afghanistan to rejoin his al-Qaeda associates to fight against US, British, Canadian, Australian, Afghan, and other coalition forces [...] It is alleged Hicks armed himself with an AK-47 automatic rifle, ammunition, and grenades to fight against coalition forces."[2]
Hicks spoke to his parents from just outside the southern Afghan city of Kandahar in November 2001. "He said something about going off to Kabul to defend it against the Northern Alliance," Terry Hicks said.
Last edited by HotDog; 22nd May 2007 at 09:08.
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ABX, from the age
The draft charges against Hicks
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/d200...%20Charges.pdf
The original charges against Hicks
http://www.theage.com.au/multimedia/...hargesheet.pdf
David Hicks is one of about 75 detainees of the United States' "war" on terror likely to face charges and a US military commission.
Under President George W. Bush's original military commissions, Hicks was charged with conspiracy, attempted murder and aiding the enemy.
The prosecution alleged Hicks had trained at al-Qaeda camps, translated training manuals into English for the terror group, knew Osama bin Laden, conducted surveillance on US and other embassies, and was armed to battle coalition forces in Afghanistan in late 2001.
Hicks’ defence lawyer Major Michael Mori described the charges as weak, pointing out that Hicks’ Arabic skills were minimal, and that several of the embassies were no longer used at the time of Hicks’ alleged surveillance work.
The charges against Hicks were dropped when the US Supreme Court ruled the first military commission model illegal in mid-2006.
Major Mori said in response to Colonel Davis’ allegations that no proof of Hicks’ alleged al-Qaeda membership or of his willingness to fight coalition troops had ever been revealed.
He says Hicks did not break any US or Australian laws.
In February 2007, Hicks' prosecutors drafted fresh charges against him under the Military Commissions Act of 2006. The fresh charges were attempted murder and providing material support for terrorism.
Colonel Davis said there was no evidence that Hicks had injured or killed anybody in Afghanistan.
Major Mori questioned the retention of the attempted murder charge and said the charge of providing material support for terrorism was based on retrospective legislation.
Under President George W. Bush's original military commissions, Hicks was charged with conspiracy, attempted murder and aiding the enemy.
The prosecution alleged Hicks had trained at al-Qaeda camps, translated training manuals into English for the terror group, knew Osama bin Laden, conducted surveillance on US and other embassies, and was armed to battle coalition forces in Afghanistan in late 2001.
Hicks’ defence lawyer Major Michael Mori described the charges as weak, pointing out that Hicks’ Arabic skills were minimal, and that several of the embassies were no longer used at the time of Hicks’ alleged surveillance work.
The charges against Hicks were dropped when the US Supreme Court ruled the first military commission model illegal in mid-2006.
Major Mori said in response to Colonel Davis’ allegations that no proof of Hicks’ alleged al-Qaeda membership or of his willingness to fight coalition troops had ever been revealed.
He says Hicks did not break any US or Australian laws.
In February 2007, Hicks' prosecutors drafted fresh charges against him under the Military Commissions Act of 2006. The fresh charges were attempted murder and providing material support for terrorism.
Colonel Davis said there was no evidence that Hicks had injured or killed anybody in Afghanistan.
Major Mori questioned the retention of the attempted murder charge and said the charge of providing material support for terrorism was based on retrospective legislation.
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/d200...%20Charges.pdf
The original charges against Hicks
http://www.theage.com.au/multimedia/...hargesheet.pdf
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While I'm no fan of detention without trial, the thing I find interesting in the current asymmetric war we find ourselves in, is do we wait for someone to commit an act of evil? Or do we attempt to stop that act before it occurs? If we bang them up before they do their evil then the civil libertarians will speak loudly. If we wait for the act, who tells the families of the innocents? It's a hard line we have to take these days and open to some abuses but what are the consequences of not acting.
Last edited by Whiskey Oscar Golf; 23rd May 2007 at 02:19. Reason: spilling
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I'm sure I read somewhere that Hick's father - Terry, was nominated for Australian father of the year for the support he has provided his son throughout the 5 years he spent in Cuba.
From what I have seen on TV he is nothing but anti-govt and is quite vocal about it.
From what I have seen on TV he is nothing but anti-govt and is quite vocal about it.
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I suspect I'd be rather ticked off if the powers-that-be could do something about a close family member's situation and deliberately chose not to (irrespective of the guilt or innocence of the person involved).
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IMHO the problem has become one of a lack of leadership and follow-up; the US had goodwill from just about every country - even Iran, Cuba and Venezuela - in the days following 11 September 2001 - but the administration managed to successfully p!ss that all away.
The Hicks thing is part of that. Right or wrong, the processes put in place were flawed. 'Fog of war' and all that aside, the process then became one away from the battlefield and it has been very poorly handled.
The one thing Blair has done right is to see that the whole Gitmo process was going nowhere, was going to end up becoming a cluster-fcuk and defused it in the UK before it became a political issue. Now, far from being forgotten, the administration has let this become a political black hole.
The Hicks thing is part of that. Right or wrong, the processes put in place were flawed. 'Fog of war' and all that aside, the process then became one away from the battlefield and it has been very poorly handled.
The one thing Blair has done right is to see that the whole Gitmo process was going nowhere, was going to end up becoming a cluster-fcuk and defused it in the UK before it became a political issue. Now, far from being forgotten, the administration has let this become a political black hole.
