Close liaison yesterday over Trafalgar Square ??
 

Yesterday, I was in central London to take she that must be obeyed for afternoon tea at the Ritz. She thought this a great idea as she had apparently given me 25 years of blissful marriage.:hmm:

Having arrived early, we decided to kill some time and found ourselves heading for Trafalgar Square, where we had heard that Eddie Izzard was finishing his marathon for charity. Also, out of curiosity, of what was occuring on the 4th plynth.

We arrived at about 1600hrs and left at about 1645hrs. During this time it was raining heavily with 8/8 cloud cover. Cloud base seemed to be about 800 -1000 ft.

I was watching a small helicopter (something like a Squirell) flying around the square. I guessed it was from Sky News or something, waiting for 'our Eddie' to arrive, as there were quite a few press about including BBC news.

The pilot appeared to have to have to keep adjusting height, to stay out of cloud.

I was then aware that the Squirrell (?) had moved away from the square and a much larger helicopter arrived, flew around the square and then slowly flew down towards Buckingham Palace. This one looked military, possibly a Merlin or slightly bigger.

After the second helicopter had gone, the Squirrell (?) came back and continued flying around the square.

It appeared to me that both aircraft were aware of each others presence, if not visually, then through ATC etc and gave each other a sensibly wide birth.

A short while later however, I was surprised and alarmed to see the Squirell (?) at one side of the square and a 4 engined jet (similar to and probably from, the City Airport) appear, at what seemed like little or no height separation and a horizontal distance of a hundred yards or so from each other.

I realise things always look different from ground level, but given that cloud base was so low and visibilty so poor, I was surprised to see these two aircraft in such close proximity to each other.

My impression was that the two helicopters had appeared to be very aware of each other and had taken measures to avoid each other at an early stage, but that the second incident wasn't as well separated.

I mention this out of interest, as I'm sure my 'ground perception' view was different to that of those in the air or at ATC and someone can throw a bit of light on what was going on.

I await with baited breath. Oh, and in case you were wondering - (4th plynth) - there was a little old lady dressed all in red, sitting in a wheelchair with red balloons tied to it, whilst she read some poetry about cats !! Poor old dear was absolutely soaked through, but at least she had her moment of fame.:D

It would help tremendously if your profile gave us some idea of your aviation knowledge/ experience.

You said it was overcast at 800-1000ft... and then a 4-engined jet appeared. Except in dire mergency, in which case it would have been national news, there is no way in this world that such an aircraft is going to fly over Trafalgar Square below 1000ft.

London City Airport is about 8 miles east of Trafalgar Square. I believe they have been landing to the east the last few days so it would be on it's approach. I stand to be corrected but the lowest it would be in that position would be 2000 ft.

It is acknowledged by aviation professionals that normal humans cannot accurately determine the height of an aeroplane or helicopter. The only people who can estimate cloud height with any degree of accuracy are professional observers. When I worked at Heathrow, rarely a day would pass without some member of the public ringing to say they had seen two aircraft "very close together". Pity they had nothing better to do!

If there had been a "close liaison" over Trafalgar Square I am certain that you would not be the only person in the world to know about it.

I think the topic poster is being Zilly.

http://www.augk18.dsl.pipex.com/Smil...feedtrolls.gif

Maybe he also sees one of the journalists he saw every day in the mirror

So we're likely talking B747, A340 or A380... I didn't think the runway at London City was suitable for any of these?

Pat 42, try BAe146.

skills........

My wife and I just got back from the London Eye.. We saw a helicopter holding and a BAe146 flew past, missing it by a fag paper. Most dangerous thing I've ever seen...... or maybe they were properly, safely separated but even my experienced eye couldn't tell at ground level??

Maybe it was an IL-76 :)

Nah - going too fast. I had one of those on the ILS at 15 miles for Heathrow once.. asked him his airspeed and he said "96 kts". To which there is no answer!

I suppose it's better than asking some to speed up only to be told,"At that speed we're climbing."

Stapleford operates pleasure flights over London in a Piper Senica on Sundays, Ive seen it also on other days.. Could this be it? I know he said 4 engines but maybe didnt see it correctly.

Piper Seneca = 4-engined jet? I think not! No, he almost certainly saw a BAe 146.

Ah but that low? :eek:

C'mon.... this is getting very silly. As I mentioned earlier, I saw exactly the same thing last Thursday and I can, for sure, tell the difference between a jet airliner and a clockwork mouse.

Sorry HD,

I did read what you said.
I thought it was a joke, sarcasm against the poster. But I guess you actually did see this then?

Well it wasn't intended to be sarcastic but humourous. Yes, I did see several BAe146s on the approach to LCY and helicopters close by. But so what? It happens dozens of times every day.