The 10-7 page is just one of the pages that Jeppesen publishes for my airline and it and the subsequent 10-7A,10-7B etc. are considered airport information pages. For us it simply states that 9L is not used for departure for noise abatement reasons. My life is way too short to have launched a 1000 hour inqiury with the airline as to why this is in the book and how to get it changed and how many people would need to sit in on a meeting with Jeppesen to formulate a review plan and if a contractor should be studied to determine if this statement is valid at all times etc. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...lies/smile.gif In other words I simply read the thing and took it for what it was worth but was certainly surprised by it.

Of course I have landed on 9L many times--it is just that I have not been there when it was being used for takeoff ---which when I am only there perhaps 4 times a month hat makes sense that the odds of me seeing this runway used for departure are slim.

I did look through my books however (in a serious case of geekdom I must admit that I am doing this at home!), and indeed noticed that all the 10-3 departure pages list 9L as a possibility so all the obstacle data must be in. One of those things perhaps that just does not come up that often for some of us and I never really noticed it as all my departures seem to be 27 R/L or 9R with the turn at LON 2 DME to a heading of 220. Sort of like asking the European crews if they knew that ORD had until not so long ago a runway 36? Not long enough for large jet use but I have seen departures from it.

Apologies, Fred. I misunderstood and thought the paperwork was suggesting 09L was not normally used at all!

Sorry Director. I was not very clear on my first writing and I could see how what I said could have been misunderstood!

Talk to all of you tomorrow morning upon arrival!

Runway 23 / 05
 

There's a lot of interesting stuff written about 23 / 05. I have landed a few times on 23. It was always an interesting experience. There was always plenty of whoooooo from the passengers. I remember doing a trip to Athens on a BA 757. It left terminal 4 and back tracked runway 23. It then did a 180 and launched off runway 23. It was late at night, so the airport wasn't busy. With regards to runway 05, I can rember seeing a few land on it, but that was extremely rare. I have often wondered when 23 was last used - does anyone know?
John (Airport Staff)

JohnLHR.... See post #27.

Talking of runway 23, I noticed from the train a couple of weeks ago that the blue Gasometer in Southall still has the sign for Heathrow..

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3551/...002f47d43d.jpg

I can remember 05 being used for landings late 80s/early 90s as I used to live in Frimley and they turned final about there. I think it was used maybe up to mid 90s when the wind required it; certainly I can remember watching the inbounds on the radar at Farnborough.

Try some real nostalgia (circa 1957)
Still had a flashing green ident beacon then!

http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/...throwChart.jpg

scotbill,
wow. Fascinated by old charts like this. Do you have any more you could scan in please?

Still had the green beacon in the 1970s too!

Scotbill.. I've flicked quickly through The Book but there appears to be no mention of the airfield beacon. I think it said "LH" but that chart above seems to suggest "VA"?? It's certainly in the right location - at the end of Beacon Road south of the 05R threshold. Hmmm... interesting.

During ADC validation boards question Jack Carruthers always asked about the beacon.

Bren

Zooker

Only of the Scottish airfields.

Heathrow Director

Do you remember what the ident was on the green beacon? I thought it was LH but the memory banks can play tricks and there is no confirmation on the chart.

Sorry to step on HD's anticipated reply, but it was 'LH' in the late 60s/early70s. I remember seeing it on my first visit to EGLL on a Trent Bus Co day out from Loughborough. We had a guided tour around the perimeter road. It was amazing. I had never seen jet airliners before. The guide told us that the beacon, (or pundit), could be seen from over The English Channel. It was this bus trip which made me decide to become an ATCO.
A year or so later, (1970ish), my dad and I went to EGLL at night, with a friend who drove freight down there 4 nights a week. We stood on the grass outside the 'Hunting. hangar for an hour or so watching Argosies, Merchantmen and DC8 freighters landing on 28L. No security. I remember this beacon lighting up the whole sky with green flashes.
We had a smaller 40W model at EGNX, west of the old tower. It flashed 'CA', also in green, I think the RAF beacons were red.
Why were they called 'pundits' though?

I remember doing 23 ops in the early 90s as a trainee. Saw an Aer Lingus 737 do a screaming turn onto a 1/2 mile final for 23 to beat another inbound. As the plane vacated |I asked to pilot if that was fun to which the reply was "Best fun I've had in cockpit for years, keep lucky". Creased me and the mentor.

Further evidence that the ident beacon was 'VA' in the fifties

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i2...ionpix/AIP.jpg

The logbook says my first arrival at LAP (sic) was just after Xmas '59 by DC3 from Glasgow. Must have been an extra. (2.20 block time since you ask - 2.45 on the return).
I could easily convince myself it was LH then.

RW05
 

Talkdown Man and I started at LL on 3rd Nov '86, and we saw loads of 23 ops particularly in that winter of 86/7.

I can honestly say that I never saw 05 in operation, but of course it could have been used when I was not at work.

Chevvron, the Heathrow Book states that 05 was finally pensioned off in the latter part of '93. I'm not a betting man but I'd wager it hadn't been used for a year or two before that.

Just been talking to Bob Hillyer on the blower and he was a 05 virgin too.

I can vaguelly recollect 05 being taken out of use for arrivals due to the extension of T4 stands, so that was probably '93.

Sorry about the thread drift but Zooker did ask!
Copied from a notebook I used to keep in the late 50s (hence the scribbles).
Note they both had VDF homers as well as light beacons.

http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/...erChart50s.jpghttp://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/...amChart50s.jpg

scotbill,
many thanks indeed.

Coming in rather late on this thread, but rember being at LL as a lowly ATCA when a Concorde landed on 23. Didn't touch down anywhere near the normal point and eveyone was convinced he was going off at the end. The pilot held the nose up and used aerodynamic braking and ended up stopping in plenty of time, but pretty convinced CONC ops on 23 were banned after that.

I alway found 23 the be a bit nervewracking driving on the airfield, we were supposed to have a briefing on runways in use etc before venturing out but generally just winged it - approaching to cross 23 in Pixie there was always doubt in your mind as the whether it was a taxiway or runway that day! Definate loss of face to ask on the radio, so just hoped that the wig-wags at you intersection hadn't failed, had a good look down the approach and drove over!

Off back to work in Fraggle Radar!

I had the dubious honour of abandoning a 05 departure!
BMA FK27 was very slow to roll off 05 (his request due the wind) against an inbound on final for10L.
I didn't fancy what would happen over Block 27 if the inbound went round so told the BMA to stop. It was so windy it wasn't a problem to depart from where he'd stopped.
Oh and 10R was in use for Deps as well.
3 Runways and a planner to help with your phones/arrange gaps etc.

I recall coming in for a late spinner with B Watch to find they were running two landing streams to cut delays - 05R and 10L packed as tight as you can believe with 10R for deps. Didn't need ExLax in those days!

Have really enjoyed reading this as I used to live under 23 approach when I was kid
right where the point Northolt approach crossed.
Went camping down by Thames under 05 approach one day, that was fun as we nearly got blown away in the gale.

Ian B

I'm sure I remember a KLM DC8 landing on 23 on a very blustery day in the early 70s....went a long way down the runway before it fell out of what was left of the sky. It flew back to EHAM the next day with the gear down all the way.

The last approach I flew to LHR 23 (SRA) was 1st Feb 2002 in A319 G-EUOD as BA363 from LYS in VERY strong SW winds ar about 2200Z.

Another approach I recall was in B737-400 G-DOCD where we held at BNN for about 40 minutes in mod turbulence on BA4773 ex EDI on sector 4 of a double LHR-EDI day. We were vectored from BNN towards BIG then up to LAM then west and SRA to 23. The cloudbase was about 700ft (around the SRA limit iirc) and we came visual arounf that point but the encountered windshear of about 30kts resulting in a 2 white/2 red PAPI becoming 4 red and a w/s go-around! We had a rather hectic few minutes and ended up in STN with not much fuel left in 60kt SW winds - couldn't even use the airstairs! Many sick bags filled!

Remember landing 05 as a pax sometime on the early 1980's.

23/05
 

A few shots of 05 being used for landing winter 70/71? from Air India earth mound
http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...LHR-05-900.jpg

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...LHR-05-900.jpg

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...737-05-900.jpg

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...727-05-900.jpg

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...est-05-900.jpg

and one by Kjell Nilsson from QB or T2 carpark?Photos: Boeing 747-136 Aircraft Pictures | !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Piket/Bish book records rwy05 permanently withdrawn latter part 1993 (p95) and last use rwy23 27Oct 2002 by SAA 747

Where was the green beacon situated...I used to see one light up the sky over Heston about 1953?

Beacon was south of the 05R threshold in Beacon Road.

I always assumed that what I saw was a beacon actually at Heston Airfield whereas the approach to LHR 05 was some 4 miles away

Great photos yoyo thanks for sharing them!

I remember the week before T4 opened (April 1986) due strong NE winds runway 05 was used for a couple of days. It made us all wonder how ATC would cope if it happened again after T4 opened.

View from Air India Maintenance Earth Mound ca.1971
 

Emperor Sharjehan delivery flight

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...rjehan-800.jpg

United Arab Il-62 above intersection of 23/05 climbing off 10R

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...b-airlines.jpg

and ONTOS taxying by the 05 threshold

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...yoyo/ONTOS.jpg

The airport police always arrived though :)

Other diagonal runways at Heathrow
 

The B-29 featured in Heathrow Skyport 14Jul2011 has been identified as a USAF example approaching RWY15R over the eastern end of the Colnbrook By-Pass (about 1949 :))...scroll down a bit on:
Heathrow Skyport - The independent voice of the airport since 1976: July 2011 Archives

Wow... I'd loved to have seen that B-29.

I seem to remember (it's all becoming foggy now) a Pan Am freighter landing on 23 at night when it had a little ;) problem with an engine. From the Tower it was obvious that there was at least a fire, so bearing in mind the crew would be a little busy, nothing was said on the R/T but the Fire Service dispatched.
Eventually the fire was put out, there was serious damage and Boeing flew over to decide if it could be repaired or written off (they did repair it).
The crew eventually told us their side of the incident. On touchdown and selecting reverse, there was a small jolt on one throttle and all the parameters ran down on one so they thought it had run down. It was only when the engineer (yep had them then) noticed it was a bit orange outside that they realised it was on fire. The engine had dropped from it's front mounting severing all the cables, caught fire and also set fire to the wing!
And where did this all happen? Block 85 so took 2 Runways out.

Yep, remember that...

Bit late in the day to reply to Over+Out's post in 2009 about the 'recent Swanwick manager' who validated on 23 at Heathrow, absolutely true, he was on my watch and I can remember talking to him when he was having a break during it. Everyone was absolutely stunned, but he did it. Bren/HD were you not in that day he was on our watch?

Possibly, if I was spinning. The only watch list I have is July, 1981 and none of the names ring a bell about Swanwick Managers.... It wasn't unknown for trainees doing boards to be faced with something they hadn't seen before but a bit of initiative came in useful!

If my memory serves me correctly the chap in question arrived after the move to TC had taken place, so that was after '93.

He's now off to boss the Swiss about, wonder if he'll be back in the future to take on the top job in NATS?

I have just retired, thanks EGLL for being the best ATC in the world. No I never landed on 23/05 but always remember that awful pad numbering system. Thanks for the great memories. You will always be the best. SQ308/319