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UK ATCO Redundancies

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UK ATCO Redundancies

Old 31st Oct 2020, 22:06
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
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escaped.atco. I'm not quite sure why you keep talking down ATC. It is an expensive part of the infrastructure but is essential. If you cut staff, it is very difficult to get back to a position where you can operate as you were last year. If you cut wages then some staff will just retire early, again leaving you short in the future. And let's face it, the ATC business was looking into an abyss of being short of staff before this crisis. Also, why would new people come in, devote their entire career to the job, when what was previously a good secure job, has now become insecure especially when you are training for 2 years before even having a chance of validating on a lower salary than before. Basically, it's the last part of the operation to cut back too much. It takes years to get an operation able to operate at an airfield that can shift 40-50 aircraft an hour all the time. You can't cut it and then suddenly turn the tap on again. Maybe if this situation lasts for a lot longer then there will be cuts, but it will be one of the last things to be cut. Just my opinion.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 00:50
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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I don't mean to talk ATC down, I do believe however that as a group we need to be realistic regarding the state of our industry. Pilots are essential, they were also expensive, they have borne the brunt of cost cutting in many companies - both job cuts and degraded T&Cs. Ground handlers are also essential, they are relatively inexpensive, they have also borne a heavy price in job cuts. I suppose my point is that as a group we cannot expect to survive this crisis unscathed - thats not talking ATC down, its just my opinion that everyone within aviation will be affected in now way or another. When someone gets in their head that they're essential and effectively untouchable then thats a dangerous place to be. Remember every business is run by accountants - people that know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. If they can save a few quid over a relatively short term period then the problems in a few years will be just that - not something to worry about just now. I have sat in meetings with airport managers and believe me they only see the large wage bill from ATC, if it can be reduced then they really don't care the potential issues that might be there at a later time.

I take great pride in my profession, always have done. Ultimately though the older I get the more I realise we are just numbers on a spreadsheet in an accountants office.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 08:23
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
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Originally Posted by escaped.atco View Post
I don't mean to talk ATC down, I do believe however that as a group we need to be realistic regarding the state of our industry. Pilots are essential, they were also expensive, they have borne the brunt of cost cutting in many companies - both job cuts and degraded T&Cs. Ground handlers are also essential, they are relatively inexpensive, they have also borne a heavy price in job cuts. I suppose my point is that as a group we cannot expect to survive this crisis unscathed - thats not talking ATC down, its just my opinion that everyone within aviation will be affected in now way or another. When someone gets in their head that they're essential and effectively untouchable then thats a dangerous place to be. Remember every business is run by accountants - people that know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. If they can save a few quid over a relatively short term period then the problems in a few years will be just that - not something to worry about just now. I have sat in meetings with airport managers and believe me they only see the large wage bill from ATC, if it can be reduced then they really don't care the potential issues that might be there at a later time.

I take great pride in my profession, always have done. Ultimately though the older I get the more I realise we are just numbers on a spreadsheet in an accountants office.
Completely agree with that. Aviation right now is undergoing a Ďresetí like never before. There have and will have to be cuts/ savings in every aspect of aviation, nobody is safe. There is no sign of any recovery right now and the losses just continue to compound exponentially. Itís a dire situation.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 14:53
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by escaped.atco View Post
I take great pride in my profession, always have done. Ultimately though the older I get the more I realise we are just numbers on a spreadsheet in an accountants office.
The current situation, for once, has nothing to do with accountants.

At the moment we are gardeners looking after concrete blocks. The only thing keeping us in a job is the hope that there'll be a garden again.

It's unsustainable.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 19:34
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
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I think the current situation had nothing to do with accountants as far as cause goes, but everything to do with accountants as to how its handled. Can you imagine contract negotiations over the foreseeable future? The accountant will be saying what they can afford and what they are prepared to pay, it will be up to the ATC provider to work out how to make it fit. I refer back to my previous post, the biggest part of any contract is in all probability is the wages bill. An uncomfortable fact but there we are.
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Old 11th Nov 2020, 10:11
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
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https://www.theguardian.com/business...e-back-in-2021

I imagine Mr. OíLeary will be the first to shout when there isnít the capacity to match demand.
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Old 26th Nov 2020, 19:15
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: hampshire
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Is it going to get better

Feeling a bit in limbo now, tempted to start a business venture. Genuinely worried that ATSAís jobs could be unsustainable, on the other hand donít want to walk away if redundancy package is coming. Any thoughts people
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Old 15th Dec 2020, 19:14
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
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justbeingnosey, not sure who exactly you work for but I'm hearing the threats of cutbacks have been reduced by a very large ANSP in the UK. They have seen fit to pay out bonuses to all staff and an extra bonus to management grades? This is just after paying out a large amount of VR packages with amounts that would settle the debt of a small third world country! It must warm the hearts of all the employees to know that even in these times of fiscal hardship that the gravy train has not yet been derailed. Should make for some interesting conversations at the next round of contract renewals though!
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