Tower or Enroute
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Prefer Area, though 'proper' tower controlling - i.e. visual and radar circuit integrated with Fast jet (mil) mixed with prop, Helos, hovering jets and dummy ramps and crossing runways with simultaneous approaches is hard to beat.... and unfortunately hard to find nowadays 
Join Date: Mar 2007
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I have done tower, approach and currently enroute. I pick tower every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Love it miss it want to get back into a tower.
Cheers
FGS
Cheers
FGS
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Thanks for your reply, I was starting to think that there weren't many out there that preferred Tower.. which I find strange, as I was told that it's harder in Australia to change over from Enroute to Tower as opposed to Tower to Enroute.
I am swinging towards Tower as I have spent more time observing ATC from the Tower when I was in the Military.... however saying that, the technology in Enroute here is amazing!
I am swinging towards Tower as I have spent more time observing ATC from the Tower when I was in the Military.... however saying that, the technology in Enroute here is amazing!
Join Date: Oct 2000
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I loved Tower work, but I was lucky that most units I worked at combined Tower with other facililities. However, during my last ten years I was very glad to do radar exclusively. Tower is for very sharp-minded kids and not doddery old men. You could tell this when we went to the car park later... the youngsters would go straight for their cars and the oldies would still be searching half an hour later!!
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Take a trip out to Bankstown or any of the GA airports. You'll see plenty of aircraft there and it may help in your decision. There are a lot more towers to choose from in Oz and only 2 Area centres, I think.
On the beach
P.S. I've done tower, approach and area and would find it very difficult to single any one discipline out above the others. Good luck whichever you choose.
On the beach
P.S. I've done tower, approach and area and would find it very difficult to single any one discipline out above the others. Good luck whichever you choose.
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If you choose Tower, you potentially could end up in Karatha, Port Headland, Albury, Tamworth and so on. They have removed the pay cap however so you will earn the same as Enroute. With the new D tower rules I am guessing they will be having a fairly large intake to staff the new requirements so I would think tthe most likely spots for you would be the current GAAP places like Bankstown, Archerfield, Morrabbin, Jandakot.
If you choose Enroute you will be off to Brisbane or Melbourne and if the rumours are anythiing to go by it will all be in Melbourne in a number of years. You will most likely start an finish yoour career with the original endorsements that you receive. It is going to be a different place to what it is now with Generic endorsements, centralised rosters and default night shift staffing all further bringing down what was once a good place (different building) to work.
In OZ it is not that it is hard to make the transition to tower it is that it is near on impossible to get released for a job due staff shortages and there are many many applications that go in when they do come up. When a key criteria for any job internally is now 'Corporate Behaviour' it is becoming inccreasingly obvious that the 'Air Traffic Controller' will never win the position over the 'Cock Sucker'.
None of my above has anything to do with the day to day duties of the job however and that is as broad a subject as any.
I would say Tower.
If you choose Enroute you will be off to Brisbane or Melbourne and if the rumours are anythiing to go by it will all be in Melbourne in a number of years. You will most likely start an finish yoour career with the original endorsements that you receive. It is going to be a different place to what it is now with Generic endorsements, centralised rosters and default night shift staffing all further bringing down what was once a good place (different building) to work.
In OZ it is not that it is hard to make the transition to tower it is that it is near on impossible to get released for a job due staff shortages and there are many many applications that go in when they do come up. When a key criteria for any job internally is now 'Corporate Behaviour' it is becoming inccreasingly obvious that the 'Air Traffic Controller' will never win the position over the 'Cock Sucker'.
None of my above has anything to do with the day to day duties of the job however and that is as broad a subject as any.
I would say Tower.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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On the Beach, you are correct.. there are 2 Centres in Oz & 26 Towers. I've spent a lot more time observing ATC in a Tower as I was in the RAAF. I have also plugged in at Brisbane Enroute Facility. And I think I'm swaying towards Tower.
Thanks very much for the best wishes.
Tobzalp...Very aware I could end up in any number of the 26 locations & that doesn't bother me as I am ex military & got sent anywhere & everywhere. And yes, the pay is the same for both Enroute & Tower. I too heard `the rumour' that all will relocate to Melbs in a matter of years... needless to say a lot of the Brissy Controllers I spoke with would prefer retirement over moving.. haha.
Are you still in Oz or working O/S ??
I really appreciate all your imput ! Makes my decision easier!
Thanks very much for the best wishes.
Tobzalp...Very aware I could end up in any number of the 26 locations & that doesn't bother me as I am ex military & got sent anywhere & everywhere. And yes, the pay is the same for both Enroute & Tower. I too heard `the rumour' that all will relocate to Melbs in a matter of years... needless to say a lot of the Brissy Controllers I spoke with would prefer retirement over moving.. haha.
Are you still in Oz or working O/S ??
I really appreciate all your imput ! Makes my decision easier!
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Cottam - 'twas Yeovs, and it was about 15yrs ago. Great fun. The only good reason to close some RAF stations would be to get away from Typed Air Station operations and get a really good mix...
Anyways, civvy now and I find that radar, certainly en-route or TC (Area) is not for doddery old men as HD put it above... civvy Approach might be different (don't know, never done it, but still doubt it), but methinks it was just a perception of Bren's as he got older.
Had he stayed in the tower he'd possibly have said the same thing about radar.
Gemmy, if you want to be an ATCO and enjoy a challenging job, you will like either, I think.
Anyways, civvy now and I find that radar, certainly en-route or TC (Area) is not for doddery old men as HD put it above... civvy Approach might be different (don't know, never done it, but still doubt it), but methinks it was just a perception of Bren's as he got older.
Had he stayed in the tower he'd possibly have said the same thing about radar.
Gemmy, if you want to be an ATCO and enjoy a challenging job, you will like either, I think.
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Enroute if you prefer the idea of long term location either Melbourne or Brisbane. Tower if you want a chance to see other parts of Australia.
It used to make sense to start in enroute before moving into Tower - procedural followed by GAAP followed by Radar Tower.
This allowed considerable valuable experience to be gained. Unfortunately for many reasons people win jobs now at other locations and are unable to move as not enough controllers are available to fill holes.
Enroute or Tower are both good options for various reasons. Ultimately it is up to you.
It used to make sense to start in enroute before moving into Tower - procedural followed by GAAP followed by Radar Tower.
This allowed considerable valuable experience to be gained. Unfortunately for many reasons people win jobs now at other locations and are unable to move as not enough controllers are available to fill holes.
Enroute or Tower are both good options for various reasons. Ultimately it is up to you.
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anotherthing.... Humble apologies. I had no intention of suggesting that all radar was easy and the TMA controllers with whom I worked had my utmost admiration. They were nothing short of supermen/women and I could never have done their job.
I should have specifically referred to the job I did - Approach Radar for Heathrow, which hardly changed in the 30+ years I did it because there is a limit to the amount of traffic one can squeeze onto a runway whereas with the TMA and Area, they have constantly increasing traffic and work like trojans.
When the move to TC took place, a lot of older ATCOs chose to move and I think that was largely because they, like me, found the radar side far more leisurely than the Tower. Going up the stairs early on a foggy morning when one couldn't see much but aircraft were operating normally.. and then to learn that it was GMC to be relieved was akin to having a dreadful nightmare!!! On the other side of the coin, Approach Control, with LVPs, was like a rest home!
I should have specifically referred to the job I did - Approach Radar for Heathrow, which hardly changed in the 30+ years I did it because there is a limit to the amount of traffic one can squeeze onto a runway whereas with the TMA and Area, they have constantly increasing traffic and work like trojans.
When the move to TC took place, a lot of older ATCOs chose to move and I think that was largely because they, like me, found the radar side far more leisurely than the Tower. Going up the stairs early on a foggy morning when one couldn't see much but aircraft were operating normally.. and then to learn that it was GMC to be relieved was akin to having a dreadful nightmare!!! On the other side of the coin, Approach Control, with LVPs, was like a rest home!
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: On the wireless...
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Get the experience of all if you can, TWR/APP/RAD/TMA/Enroute. Each can have its own special challenges:
Heathrow GMC on a wet and windy friday evening on 23.
Heathrow GMC in Low Vis Procedures.
Heathrow ARR on a wet and windy friday evening.
Heathrow 09R DEP when slot demand is heavy.
Heathrow GMP when the computer goes down.
Heathrow APP on 05 with back-to-back SRAs.
Heathrow APP on 23, 28L avail.
Heathrow APP with 25 mins holding and three CAT Bs out and about.
Heathrow Special during US state visits.
Heathrow when the lift has failed.
Heathrow when the Spur is blocked.
DTY Sector at 0800 on a Monday without flow control.
CLN Sector on a Friday evening without flow control.
TMA NE bandboxed due staff shortage.
Sector 25 with 'northabout' tracks and 'FLASH'.
London FIR on a sunny summer Saturday afternoon.
Stansted APP without radar.
Farnborough Tower during the Falklands with panic R&D, mixed circuits, mixed types, crossing runways, RHAG engagements, geostationary rotary, SE5 on the LALA and midnight total darkness FLIR Ops.
Farnborough LARS on a summer weekend.
SRAs and PARs to minima....and beyond....
Anything else is a rest-cure.......
No one discipline is any more interesting the the other, although the Centre has a much more leisurely feel to it and with more staff comes more spare capacity with more support and less stress. The easy life was definitely at LATCC.....and a great leveller.....
Heathrow GMC on a wet and windy friday evening on 23.
Heathrow GMC in Low Vis Procedures.
Heathrow ARR on a wet and windy friday evening.
Heathrow 09R DEP when slot demand is heavy.
Heathrow GMP when the computer goes down.
Heathrow APP on 05 with back-to-back SRAs.
Heathrow APP on 23, 28L avail.
Heathrow APP with 25 mins holding and three CAT Bs out and about.
Heathrow Special during US state visits.
Heathrow when the lift has failed.
Heathrow when the Spur is blocked.
DTY Sector at 0800 on a Monday without flow control.
CLN Sector on a Friday evening without flow control.
TMA NE bandboxed due staff shortage.
Sector 25 with 'northabout' tracks and 'FLASH'.
London FIR on a sunny summer Saturday afternoon.
Stansted APP without radar.
Farnborough Tower during the Falklands with panic R&D, mixed circuits, mixed types, crossing runways, RHAG engagements, geostationary rotary, SE5 on the LALA and midnight total darkness FLIR Ops.
Farnborough LARS on a summer weekend.
SRAs and PARs to minima....and beyond....
Anything else is a rest-cure.......
No one discipline is any more interesting the the other, although the Centre has a much more leisurely feel to it and with more staff comes more spare capacity with more support and less stress. The easy life was definitely at LATCC.....and a great leveller.....
Join Date: Feb 2006
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HD, No slight taken!!
Thought it was maybe just a perception issue because you continued to do radar and gave up tower... thus losing a skill set. Always looks harder from the 'outside'!
True that EGLL App/Dir is probably the most regimented/systemised approach function in the LTMA, but then again it does have to be. It is pretty routine (saying this never having done it), exactly for the reasons you stipulated - lack of airspace. However this does allow for more emphasis on nailing the correct spacing time after time hour after hour.
Might be slightly mundane, but still an immense skill of concentration to keep that going. Never mind the silly notion of sharing a frequency!!
Thought it was maybe just a perception issue because you continued to do radar and gave up tower... thus losing a skill set. Always looks harder from the 'outside'!
True that EGLL App/Dir is probably the most regimented/systemised approach function in the LTMA, but then again it does have to be. It is pretty routine (saying this never having done it), exactly for the reasons you stipulated - lack of airspace. However this does allow for more emphasis on nailing the correct spacing time after time hour after hour.
Might be slightly mundane, but still an immense skill of concentration to keep that going. Never mind the silly notion of sharing a frequency!!