Dubai / UAE
Join Date: May 2007
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Back to Square 1
Simply - NO MONEY..........
2 years in a row..... it seems like 'Back to the Future'.........
People tend to forget what happened in the past, where RETAINING or even ATTRACTING ATCOs for Dubai was very difficult!
Always keeping in mind the YEARLY Increase in Passenger figures & Aircraft Movements...& not just last year, but it's YEAR AFTER YEAR, & BOTH Dubai Airports & Emirates Airlines BOASTING on the increase in figures & MOSTLY on their Profits!
Greed???
In the meantime, try to relax with your feet up & continue drinking your coffees!
2 years in a row..... it seems like 'Back to the Future'.........
People tend to forget what happened in the past, where RETAINING or even ATTRACTING ATCOs for Dubai was very difficult!
Always keeping in mind the YEARLY Increase in Passenger figures & Aircraft Movements...& not just last year, but it's YEAR AFTER YEAR, & BOTH Dubai Airports & Emirates Airlines BOASTING on the increase in figures & MOSTLY on their Profits!
Greed???
In the meantime, try to relax with your feet up & continue drinking your coffees!
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: UAE
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Agreed! When you read every month how great things are and how movements, pax and cargo are growing at an unbelievable rate then all of a sudden "We`re not making any money so we can`t give you a fil but thanks for shifting all our new shiny jets" ain`t great for morale or retention.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: T.C.
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Guys and girls in Dubai. You are not going to get any pay rises until SERCO can't recruit staff. Whilst there is a pile of CV's on the managers desk, they have no reason to give pay rises.
This is what happened around 2005/6, 10 left one year 8 the next, short staffed, not able to recruit because the package was poor. SERCO go cap in hand to the DCA to re-negotiate their contract and then give the huge pay packet that your on now.
Its a fact and the way SERCO run things, just enjoy the cash, and when it becomes too hard to live leave!!! Its the old bucket of cash v the bucket of sh*t, when the sh*t bucket is over flowing time to leave!!!!
This is what happened around 2005/6, 10 left one year 8 the next, short staffed, not able to recruit because the package was poor. SERCO go cap in hand to the DCA to re-negotiate their contract and then give the huge pay packet that your on now.
Its a fact and the way SERCO run things, just enjoy the cash, and when it becomes too hard to live leave!!! Its the old bucket of cash v the bucket of sh*t, when the sh*t bucket is over flowing time to leave!!!!
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Gulf
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The fickleness of people never ceases to amaze me. Everyone was more than happy when the big payrise came in but now that there's no money around for ANYONE the whinging starts. Who hasn't heard of friends or friends of friends losing their jobs and their livelyhood during the last 18 months.
Try getting out there and comparing what you're on and the benefits you get and see how much sympathy you get from others in this city...or don't you have any friends outside of work? Then remember what you'd be left with back home after the mortgage and everything else.
Time to be grateful for what you have rather than exercising the one human feature that brought the city to its knees....greed. Everyone deserves to be rewarded for what they do, but a bit more 'big picture' thinking would go a long way right now.
Oh, and I'll think you'll find that it's not the way Serco runs things....it's any business. Supply and demand. Sure things fell behind back then and it got to meltdown stage, but look at where we are now. Maybe I'm wrong, but compared to a lot of people around here I'm pretty happy that I haven't got an axe over my head, I can pay the bills and live a pretty good life. And that's in the bad times.
It's also not the case that Serco doesn't need to award a payrise. One was applied for that was reasonable given the circumstances, but if DA aren't getting one and all departments are required to cut costs - how's a payrise gonna look?
Try getting out there and comparing what you're on and the benefits you get and see how much sympathy you get from others in this city...or don't you have any friends outside of work? Then remember what you'd be left with back home after the mortgage and everything else.
Time to be grateful for what you have rather than exercising the one human feature that brought the city to its knees....greed. Everyone deserves to be rewarded for what they do, but a bit more 'big picture' thinking would go a long way right now.
Oh, and I'll think you'll find that it's not the way Serco runs things....it's any business. Supply and demand. Sure things fell behind back then and it got to meltdown stage, but look at where we are now. Maybe I'm wrong, but compared to a lot of people around here I'm pretty happy that I haven't got an axe over my head, I can pay the bills and live a pretty good life. And that's in the bad times.
It's also not the case that Serco doesn't need to award a payrise. One was applied for that was reasonable given the circumstances, but if DA aren't getting one and all departments are required to cut costs - how's a payrise gonna look?
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Sandpit
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I refer the honourable (?!) gentleman to the answer someone else gave a moment ago......
namely
Not to mention the ever growing profits that Serco like to crow about!
Can't have it both ways.
p.s. How's that Sercocision scar coming along?
namely
Always keeping in mind the YEARLY Increase in Passenger figures & Aircraft Movements...& not just last year, but it's YEAR AFTER YEAR, & BOTH Dubai Airports & Emirates Airlines BOASTING on the increase in figures & MOSTLY on their Profits!
Can't have it both ways.
p.s. How's that Sercocision scar coming along?
Join Date: Feb 2001
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So for the guys in UK and elsewhere post 9/11 when the traffic figures dropped off and the airlines were suffering the controllers should have had a pay cut then?
As you say, can't have it both ways....but then you know it doesn't work like that old boy.
As you say, can't have it both ways....but then you know it doesn't work like that old boy.
Not really that far behind me, are you? Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Sandpit
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Point missed by quite some distance I fear Guy.
So for the guys in UK and elsewhere post 9/11 when the traffic figures dropped off and the airlines were suffering the controllers should have had a pay cut then?
Regardless of the position you're looking from, I think that asking anyone to handle 30+ percent more traffic, (notwithstanding the greatly increased complexity re SJ and DWC) for the same salary as 2 years ago, while simultaneously crowing about best ever profits is, at best, shortsighted - we could all go a lot further.
TTFN
Guy.
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Gulf
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The justification for a payrise is clear and I agree with you, but that's not the point. A nil payrise may be what we end up with but it wasn't what Serco has requested. If we end up with nothing it's because there's no money to give, irrespective of how many more movements or passengers are moving through the airport. Deserving it and the abililty to pay it are two completely unconnected issues. Emirates are clearly making huge profits if they are to be believed, but we don't share in any of that and why should we? Is the airport making similar profits?..don't know and I don't think it's operated in that way either. Much of their funding comes from the ministry of finance and if they are asking for cost reductions across the board due to the extremely poor financial state of affairs (well documented) then what to do?
As I said before....a little big picture thinking would go a long way and try to accept that much of this is outside the control of the company that you so easily criticise when things are less than perfect. Anyone who's been around here for a while will know that things come around eventually and as with any industry you just have to ride out the bad times.
As I said before....a little big picture thinking would go a long way and try to accept that much of this is outside the control of the company that you so easily criticise when things are less than perfect. Anyone who's been around here for a while will know that things come around eventually and as with any industry you just have to ride out the bad times.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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NOT Again.........
1 = Gone
2 = Going/Resigned
3 = 4-5 Leaving by year end??
It seems, what we have discussed here, is really a sign of 'RETENTION' being tackled carefully! Besides what has been discussed, regarding no payrise for the last 2 years, now people are really fed up & LEAVING!
Hopefully, this does not fall on 'deaf ears'.... we are literally going back to square one, as has been posted some time ago.....!
D-DANS has Resigned & is leaving.....
1 - ATCO GONE
2 - ATCO Resigned & going back home
3 - ATCO 5years + probably is leaving as fed up, especially night fatigue
4 - 3+ leaving by year end........
It's a pity, that Dubai is again losing & about to lose some dedicated staff, at a time when things are 'in place', but no sort of 'Retention' scheme in place.....
Hopefully, 'history won't repeat itself' with another mass exodus!
Everyone knows by how much traffic & passenger numbers have increased..but WE ALL KNOW how much MORE EXPENSIVE it has become living here. If it is no longer an attractive package, then for sure HISTORY WILL REPEAT ITSELF.......
Fingers X'd........ ENOUGH SAID!
2 = Going/Resigned
3 = 4-5 Leaving by year end??
It seems, what we have discussed here, is really a sign of 'RETENTION' being tackled carefully! Besides what has been discussed, regarding no payrise for the last 2 years, now people are really fed up & LEAVING!
Hopefully, this does not fall on 'deaf ears'.... we are literally going back to square one, as has been posted some time ago.....!
D-DANS has Resigned & is leaving.....
1 - ATCO GONE
2 - ATCO Resigned & going back home
3 - ATCO 5years + probably is leaving as fed up, especially night fatigue
4 - 3+ leaving by year end........
It's a pity, that Dubai is again losing & about to lose some dedicated staff, at a time when things are 'in place', but no sort of 'Retention' scheme in place.....
Hopefully, 'history won't repeat itself' with another mass exodus!
Everyone knows by how much traffic & passenger numbers have increased..but WE ALL KNOW how much MORE EXPENSIVE it has become living here. If it is no longer an attractive package, then for sure HISTORY WILL REPEAT ITSELF.......
Fingers X'd........ ENOUGH SAID!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Dune
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From my experience the morale has dropped to pre-2008 levels. The traffic levels are such that it is pushing the limits of the system and it can been seen by the number of occurrences we get.
The Dubai shine wears off pretty quickly and we are here for the money. If it does not flow pretty soon, me and so many others are off. Hands tied we go!!
The Dubai shine wears off pretty quickly and we are here for the money. If it does not flow pretty soon, me and so many others are off. Hands tied we go!!
Join Date: Apr 2011
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Patience, patience.........negotiations take time in this neck of the woods, especially when savings are being sought across all government departments.
It is tricky to ask for a pay rise when the whole of DA hasn't had one for the last couple of years and the entire airport is coping with the increased traffic levels.
Are terms and conditions that bad yet when compared to other busy ATS units? Who should we compare ourselves against? The big European airports are still shifting significantly higher volumes of traffic overall and our pay is comparable with many Europeans already. The allowances and tax free status also helps considerably.
There is a rumour that there may be some good news in the not too distant future.
It is tricky to ask for a pay rise when the whole of DA hasn't had one for the last couple of years and the entire airport is coping with the increased traffic levels.
Are terms and conditions that bad yet when compared to other busy ATS units? Who should we compare ourselves against? The big European airports are still shifting significantly higher volumes of traffic overall and our pay is comparable with many Europeans already. The allowances and tax free status also helps considerably.
There is a rumour that there may be some good news in the not too distant future.
Join Date: Aug 2007
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ThirstyCamel - u sound exactly like my manager which I bet you are ... which makes me hopeful! BTW you cant compare to any European ATS unit or any other for that matter. We compare our salaries to what we would get at home which is what we are actually paid for - meaning if what we get here is not really good - we go home!
God bless rumours may they come true - SOON !
God bless rumours may they come true - SOON !
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Gulf
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Not to receive a payrise for two years in a row is disappointing of course and the rise in cost of living needs to be addressed, but I think that that in itself can generate a feeling of low morale. Making the decision as to whether it's worth staying here is an individual one and everyone has different circumstances. But I'm sure that for many, when it comes time to crunch the numbers it will nearly always make sense to stay on what we're on here. When you factor in the allowances that we're paid here, thereby affording us far greater disposable income, it usually makes the decision for you.
Getting pissed off with the place and leaving because we didn't get a payrise will only come back to bite you and once the harsh realities of living back in the home country start to kick in and the memories of what you used to be able to do here, it wouldn't be long before you reconsider and want to come back. I've seen it many times.
Aside from the Nationals of course, this isn't home for any of us and none of us have to work here. We're all mercinaries at heart and rightly or wrongly we're here for the money. Of course it's only part of the equation - there's family, kids and quality of life which may be better back home. The situation now is very different to the pre-2008 one. The cost of living has increased there's no doubt about that, but we're far better off now then we were then and for that reason I don't see a line of people queueing at the exit.
Getting pissed off with the place and leaving because we didn't get a payrise will only come back to bite you and once the harsh realities of living back in the home country start to kick in and the memories of what you used to be able to do here, it wouldn't be long before you reconsider and want to come back. I've seen it many times.
Aside from the Nationals of course, this isn't home for any of us and none of us have to work here. We're all mercinaries at heart and rightly or wrongly we're here for the money. Of course it's only part of the equation - there's family, kids and quality of life which may be better back home. The situation now is very different to the pre-2008 one. The cost of living has increased there's no doubt about that, but we're far better off now then we were then and for that reason I don't see a line of people queueing at the exit.
Join Date: Apr 2009
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It is tricky to ask for a pay rise when the whole of DA hasn't had one for the last couple of years and the entire airport is coping with the increased traffic levels.
Apart from this 'discrimination', IF EK really appreciate our services, then for sure this discount of 10-16% is definitely an insult!
Surprisingly other Carriers offer us better rebated travel, & besides this, EK DO offer much better rebated travel to ATC from OTHER ATC Units!
There is a rumour that there may be some good news in the not too distant future.
Taking into account the yearly inflation of approximately 8%, no pay rise for 2 years, with the constant rise in bills, I really wonder & hope if we can eventually receive a significant payrise!
God bless rumours may they come true - SOON !
The cost of living has increased there's no doubt about that, but we're far better off now then we were then and for that reason I don't see a line of people queueing at the exit.
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Believe it or not, there are a few lined up for the 'EXIT'.....Rumors are rumors, but the reality is that people have left, resigned, and resigning slowly slowly.... Wouldn't it be ideal IF stability is retained, & move on towards all the long & short term projects, & actually recruiting staff to augment the present numbers, & not simply to replace those leaving???
Looks like the payrise situation is about to change based on the High Commander's letter the other day.
As for the numbers, it doesn't quite work like that. There's a lot of transparency to the customer nowadays and carrying extra staff above what we actually need is difficult. There is a defined headcount down to the last person. Replacing staff that have left is pretty standard, having more staff than you actually need is not good business practice.
