Help for becoming an ATCO
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: London
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Help for becoming an ATCO
Well, after years of dreaming and doubting I've decided to finally try and get into the aviation industry, starting with Air Traffic Controlling. The opportunity seems great - I've achieved well at school, have a perfect (at least I think) medical health and good enough vision and am young enough (18), so I've applied to take a test to determine whether I'm suitable for an ACTO trainee position. I have three questions though:
1: Where can I find more resource material on which there are practice papers, common interview questions etc? The NATS has sent me an 8-page .pdf document with three questions - that's right: just three single questions... The three have the following tests - basic checking (identifying duplicate digits), spatial reasoning (visualising what shapes would appear on a box in three dimensions when shown a two dimensional plan) and diagramming (calculating what shapes go in what boxes). My question is where can I get more of this test material?
2: Since the pay appears good, would it be wise to save up while working as an ATCO for a PPL before perhaps moving up to a CPL? Does anyone have any experience doing this, and does the experience in ATC help towards securing any jobs?
3: Any general advice when taking the test? Spatial reasoning looks quite difficult at a glance
Thanks in advance to anyone helpful enough to reply to my questions - it'd mean a lot to me; it's the first step in achieving my dream of being a part of the aviation industry (I dream I thought I would never realise)
1: Where can I find more resource material on which there are practice papers, common interview questions etc? The NATS has sent me an 8-page .pdf document with three questions - that's right: just three single questions... The three have the following tests - basic checking (identifying duplicate digits), spatial reasoning (visualising what shapes would appear on a box in three dimensions when shown a two dimensional plan) and diagramming (calculating what shapes go in what boxes). My question is where can I get more of this test material?
2: Since the pay appears good, would it be wise to save up while working as an ATCO for a PPL before perhaps moving up to a CPL? Does anyone have any experience doing this, and does the experience in ATC help towards securing any jobs?
3: Any general advice when taking the test? Spatial reasoning looks quite difficult at a glance
Thanks in advance to anyone helpful enough to reply to my questions - it'd mean a lot to me; it's the first step in achieving my dream of being a part of the aviation industry (I dream I thought I would never realise)
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UAE
Posts: 204
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I guess I'll be the first the say this then....
ATC is NOT a "starting" career in aviation. There are considerably fewer air traffic controllers than professional pilots, by a factor of at least 10, probably much more. In the UK, a senior ATCO is paid about the same as a captain in a major low-cost airline, and in the UAE, for example, ATCO pay at one airport is about the same as the basic for an Emirates captain flying wide-body jets. There is a reason for this.
Flying to CPL and ATPL standard is not easy, of course. The exams are pretty tough too, but if you have the money and the time, most people of reasonable intelligence and motor skills can get the necessary licenses. ATCO training has a somewhat higher failure rate than civilian pilot training.
Now, since I've perhaps slapped you down a little, I'll be fair. I do know two ATCOs who became commercial pilots. I am now paid more than them, but if you really want to be a pilot and can take the pay cut, ATC is a very good background to have. I just don't see why you'd spend between 2 and 4 years training for one job, in order to do another for which you can train in a year.
ATC is NOT a "starting" career in aviation. There are considerably fewer air traffic controllers than professional pilots, by a factor of at least 10, probably much more. In the UK, a senior ATCO is paid about the same as a captain in a major low-cost airline, and in the UAE, for example, ATCO pay at one airport is about the same as the basic for an Emirates captain flying wide-body jets. There is a reason for this.
Flying to CPL and ATPL standard is not easy, of course. The exams are pretty tough too, but if you have the money and the time, most people of reasonable intelligence and motor skills can get the necessary licenses. ATCO training has a somewhat higher failure rate than civilian pilot training.
Now, since I've perhaps slapped you down a little, I'll be fair. I do know two ATCOs who became commercial pilots. I am now paid more than them, but if you really want to be a pilot and can take the pay cut, ATC is a very good background to have. I just don't see why you'd spend between 2 and 4 years training for one job, in order to do another for which you can train in a year.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: London
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for the info - I assumed the pay for piloting was better than in ATC. I'd still like to get a private license in that case - and by 'entering aviation' I mean going into air traffic controlling is still a part of the aviation industry. I'd be happy if I was earning well in that job stuck with a PPL just as general interest - as long as i'm earning money and can have the chance to fly, i'd be happy. And in the end, i'd be willing to take a slight (being a few thousand pounds) pay cut if I found piloting to be a more interesting experience. It would be gradual too - i'm thinking this long-term - i'm not gonna do a few years of air traffic controlling only to go and risk it all by moving into a different field of work.
Basically I just want to pilot out of interest, and I feel the money from ATC and the experience there may help keep my interest and help me achieve my goal - flying commercially is just an option i'd like open, hence why I asked the question.
Basically I just want to pilot out of interest, and I feel the money from ATC and the experience there may help keep my interest and help me achieve my goal - flying commercially is just an option i'd like open, hence why I asked the question.
Last edited by ke200; 24th Jun 2008 at 23:39.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Sunny South
Posts: 61
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As scooby said ATC is not an easy way into the aviation industry, and if paying for your own licences, it is not much cheaper than a CPL/IR. The rewards both financially and in terms of job satisfaction are good though, and a lot of controllers have a PPL and some have a CPL and fly commercially on days off too.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: London
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh, I never said it was an EASY way into the industry; it merely allows sustained interest in aviation. I'm expecting it to be the most difficult challenge in life so far. Well, not expecting, I KNOW it will be. I just wondered if it were possible to gain a CPL and do well - if not then I still have the intention to fly, just as a private pilot for my own leisure.
Thanks for the replies - can anyone answer the other two questions though?
Thanks for the replies - can anyone answer the other two questions though?
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I found the two jobs hardly interrelated...a lot of people seem to think that having a PPL or a CPL automatically means they will be super ATCs, this is sadly not correct at all.
Spatial Orientation, Attention to detail, ability to multitask, ability to see a job through to completion no matter what is happening around you....all of these and a few more are ESSENTIAL tools/abilities for a prospective ATC. How you talk to the mike is really not, anybody can do that with enough practice.
You also need the ability to think in 3D....This is why people from all walks of life need to be screened for suitability as an ATC and not everyone can do the job, be it a professor in physics, a CPL Pilot, etc.
As for practice....I suggest you start playing chess....yes, chess, the ancient game, it will allow you to practice thinking in 3D, planning ahead, etc.
As for saving for a PPL while doing ATC, by all means, but you will probably find that at the end of your days you will be very tired and further studies will not happen immediately, at least not until you consolidate your ATC career.
Just remember, ATC is not a job, it IS a career, and not everyone can do it....you can front up to a flying school and make your way to CPL....but unless you have certain abilities, no matter how many courses you take, how much you pay and what you do, you will not succeed as an ATC.
Spatial Orientation, Attention to detail, ability to multitask, ability to see a job through to completion no matter what is happening around you....all of these and a few more are ESSENTIAL tools/abilities for a prospective ATC. How you talk to the mike is really not, anybody can do that with enough practice.
You also need the ability to think in 3D....This is why people from all walks of life need to be screened for suitability as an ATC and not everyone can do the job, be it a professor in physics, a CPL Pilot, etc.
As for practice....I suggest you start playing chess....yes, chess, the ancient game, it will allow you to practice thinking in 3D, planning ahead, etc.
As for saving for a PPL while doing ATC, by all means, but you will probably find that at the end of your days you will be very tired and further studies will not happen immediately, at least not until you consolidate your ATC career.
Just remember, ATC is not a job, it IS a career, and not everyone can do it....you can front up to a flying school and make your way to CPL....but unless you have certain abilities, no matter how many courses you take, how much you pay and what you do, you will not succeed as an ATC.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: London
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, ATC is the focus and will be for the rest of my working career... assuming I can get past the three stages first :s Flying will just have to be a past time - both jobs interest me, but i'll have to try and do the one which is more accessible to me right now and stable - i've heard it's quite hard to get a jet-job or something that pays well in commercial piloting.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Scotland
Age: 45
Posts: 418
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My advice is get into NATS and enjoy. If you fancy doing flying for leisure, then fab! But it will be a good few years down the line as you won't get much pay until you are a valid ATCO, and even then it's not until you've been with the company 3 years (ie 3 years after starting at college) until you are on proper ATCO payscales. If you do start the flying later, and want to change to it permanantly then fine. I do know of people who have done that. In short... Convince yourself that you want to be an ATCO, and put that across to the interviewers if you get to stage 3! Get through college and get posted, then you can start planning your life.....
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Oman
Age: 41
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ATC
Hello people,
i really wounder, how come you say ATC is that difficult, to what i know from my friends who are ATC assistance, it is not that difficult if effor is being put.
or mybe you mean the last stage of the ATC controller?
Could any one advice on the schools providing ATC cources (Apptoved once).
Awaiting your reply.
Cheeeeers
i really wounder, how come you say ATC is that difficult, to what i know from my friends who are ATC assistance, it is not that difficult if effor is being put.
or mybe you mean the last stage of the ATC controller?
Could any one advice on the schools providing ATC cources (Apptoved once).
Awaiting your reply.
Cheeeeers
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Scotland
Age: 45
Posts: 418
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think when people say it is not that difficult, I take it to mean that once you are competant and have experience on your sector / position, you don't feel that it is taking as much concentration, it comes more naturally and therefore less effort. The goings on in your brain are still working as hard, but just not as evident to you, as with driving / flying / possibly even sex! 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: LHR/EGLL
Age: 45
Posts: 4,392
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Are you looking for the phrase 'unconsciously competent'
See I did listen in those HR lessons.
See I did listen in those HR lessons.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: LHR/EGLL
Age: 39
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i never ever want to go to aberdeen in that case...
and the only human factors lesson i remember was about sleep
and getting back on topic... i suspect that if you get the opportunity to do ATC you'll enjoy it quite a lot, and so wanting to be a pilot might diminish a bit. but as others have said, its a career not a job
and the only human factors lesson i remember was about sleep
and getting back on topic... i suspect that if you get the opportunity to do ATC you'll enjoy it quite a lot, and so wanting to be a pilot might diminish a bit. but as others have said, its a career not a job
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: LHR/EGLL
Age: 39
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
si... aberdeen cant wait to have you and your unconsciously competent abilities back... i hear theres a lovely offshore radar seat with your name engraved on it... 
neo - hows tricks at lovely old Seaton?
neo - hows tricks at lovely old Seaton?
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: QS, HH, FF
Age: 41
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SACrIGGER, obviously not listening hard enough, otherwise you'd have twigged they were HF lessons........
Did I get away with it... Thought not
