Airservices Australia Global Search for ATCs
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As for volume of traffic... that's always been a fairly useless indication of workload.
How many sectors handle that traffic?
What's the traffic mix like?
What ancillary services are required of the controller?
Do they have an assistant?
Is flight data processed automatically or manually?
What separation standards/traffic information parameters are applicable to the volume of airspace?
What constraints are placed on traffic management by noise abatement/curfew requirements?
etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.............
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Desert Rose and the rest wondering about going to Oz from the UAE, the best I can offer is that guys returning from here to Oz certainly haven't had any trouble with the workload.
Not a mine is bigger than yours exercise so chill out everyone but the following info is to help the guys in Dubai know what to expect.
October 2006 Sydney had an average of 781 movements a day, whilst Dubai had about 850 movements a day.
To use 5 Miles' other factor list, mix of traffic for Sydney, according to Airservices Stats, about 550-600 per day are jets, and 250 are props. Dubai would be weighted more towards jets, but about 15-20% of those jets are Russian crap boxes (TU154's, IL76's etc) and then there are lots of AN-12's, F50's, B-1900's, and F27's, so a pretty varied traffic mix, with extremely varied pilot abilities and english capabilities.
Sydney has 3 runways, whilst Dubai has one runway (although hopefully before hell freezes over we may have 2 again). Dubai is open 24 hours a day (except when it is closed for runway de-rubbering (not sure thats a word??) as it has been for a couple of hours a day recently), whilst Sydney is closed for 7 hours every night due to a noise abatement curfew.
Sydney has a lot of retrictions placed on their operations due to noise abatement procedures which Dubai doesn't have to contend with.
Dubai does of course have UAE ACC providing a perfect 20 NM spacing between the aircraft during busy periods and 15 NM at all other times, so that is a consideration for you.
Number of sectors I can't answer for Sydney, and as far as Dubai is concerned I can only go on my best guess, that being, one Arrivals sector, one Departures sector, one Coordinator sector, and one Director sector (during busy times), and I think sometimes a Minhad sector to "control" the military. Dubai guys can correct me on that one I'm sure.
Sydney is a lot more automated with a flow system in place that hopefully means the intervention needed by the approach controllers is kept to a minimum to achieve the sequence (well that was the plan with Maestro, whether that is the case I'm not sure). Dubai for all intense and purposes has no flow system, with the approach guys getting aircraft in the same gate spaced at the required spacing but no sequencing of traffic from the 3 different gates, so the approach controllers in Dubai do a lot of intervention to achieve the sequence.
Dubai controllers have assistants to pass estimates and distribute strips. I am assuming like the rest of Oz, Sydney controllers do not.
I am again assuming Sydney Approach can run 3 NM's. Dubai Approach can only use 3 NM when director is open and aircraft are with the director (and there may be other restrictions), otherwise the separation standard is 5 NM's.
As has been said previously, controllers handle whatever traffic they have to handle. The point of this post is the guys from Dubai (and UAE ACC for that matter) who are seriously considering a move to Australia, want to know what traffic levels to expect. I hope this post helps them out with that.
Not a mine is bigger than yours exercise so chill out everyone but the following info is to help the guys in Dubai know what to expect.
October 2006 Sydney had an average of 781 movements a day, whilst Dubai had about 850 movements a day.
To use 5 Miles' other factor list, mix of traffic for Sydney, according to Airservices Stats, about 550-600 per day are jets, and 250 are props. Dubai would be weighted more towards jets, but about 15-20% of those jets are Russian crap boxes (TU154's, IL76's etc) and then there are lots of AN-12's, F50's, B-1900's, and F27's, so a pretty varied traffic mix, with extremely varied pilot abilities and english capabilities.
Sydney has 3 runways, whilst Dubai has one runway (although hopefully before hell freezes over we may have 2 again). Dubai is open 24 hours a day (except when it is closed for runway de-rubbering (not sure thats a word??) as it has been for a couple of hours a day recently), whilst Sydney is closed for 7 hours every night due to a noise abatement curfew.
Sydney has a lot of retrictions placed on their operations due to noise abatement procedures which Dubai doesn't have to contend with.
Dubai does of course have UAE ACC providing a perfect 20 NM spacing between the aircraft during busy periods and 15 NM at all other times, so that is a consideration for you.
Number of sectors I can't answer for Sydney, and as far as Dubai is concerned I can only go on my best guess, that being, one Arrivals sector, one Departures sector, one Coordinator sector, and one Director sector (during busy times), and I think sometimes a Minhad sector to "control" the military. Dubai guys can correct me on that one I'm sure.
Sydney is a lot more automated with a flow system in place that hopefully means the intervention needed by the approach controllers is kept to a minimum to achieve the sequence (well that was the plan with Maestro, whether that is the case I'm not sure). Dubai for all intense and purposes has no flow system, with the approach guys getting aircraft in the same gate spaced at the required spacing but no sequencing of traffic from the 3 different gates, so the approach controllers in Dubai do a lot of intervention to achieve the sequence.
Dubai controllers have assistants to pass estimates and distribute strips. I am assuming like the rest of Oz, Sydney controllers do not.
I am again assuming Sydney Approach can run 3 NM's. Dubai Approach can only use 3 NM when director is open and aircraft are with the director (and there may be other restrictions), otherwise the separation standard is 5 NM's.
As has been said previously, controllers handle whatever traffic they have to handle. The point of this post is the guys from Dubai (and UAE ACC for that matter) who are seriously considering a move to Australia, want to know what traffic levels to expect. I hope this post helps them out with that.
Last edited by AirNoServicesAustralia; 11th Dec 2006 at 09:06.
Thanx ANSA, this is very helpful info!
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Hello. I'm a new member in this forum and basically the reason was this thread.
I'm a mil ATC in navy helicopter base in Athens Greece.
The last 4 months i have aplied in many countries for an ATC job.
I thought Australia is a good chance and i'm thinking about it since they replied me.
The reason for posting is just to hear new ideas even though i know this issue is personal.
I get about 1.350 euros per month (navy...), i'm single and i would have no problem moving in another country.
What do you think?
P.S. Also any info about how to apply for job in Dubai?
I'm a mil ATC in navy helicopter base in Athens Greece.
The last 4 months i have aplied in many countries for an ATC job.
I thought Australia is a good chance and i'm thinking about it since they replied me.
The reason for posting is just to hear new ideas even though i know this issue is personal.
I get about 1.350 euros per month (navy...), i'm single and i would have no problem moving in another country.
What do you think?
P.S. Also any info about how to apply for job in Dubai?
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Latest Civil Air newsletter reports:
"He stressed that there is now recognition by Airservices that there is a staff shortage problem; Greg Russell acknowledged this two weeks ago. Airservices have received 156 applications from the Global ATC search and they had 100 applicants on the website."
"He stressed that there is now recognition by Airservices that there is a staff shortage problem; Greg Russell acknowledged this two weeks ago. Airservices have received 156 applications from the Global ATC search and they had 100 applicants on the website."
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Could you tell me if this amount 70-100K is netto or not.
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HELLO!
At first Happy holidays!
I would like to ask for more information, actually I will extend previous question posted by Japanac! Is anybody able to explain precisely how much money will stay in pocket after all taxes, social payments and health insurance? I Simple answer such as : Salary is between 55 and 70k$ but after all it will be in your pocket________$ . Also we would like to know is there any change in relation between brut and net salary after license validation?
Best regards to JAPANAC!
I know who you are!
Last edited by SINGAPURCANAC; 27th Dec 2006 at 20:36. Reason: I forgot something
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$55k per year =$42640 in your hand
$70k per year =$52300 in your hand
$100k per year =$69450 in you hand
Current top increment about $129k =$84820 in your hand (as of mid Jan 07)
These tax rates include medicare levy which is free(ish) care in the public health system, most people take out private health cover as well which adds between $1-2k per year as the publis isn't great.
http://calculators.ato.gov.au/script...lc/Summary.asp explains it all.
On top of this salary you could add $1-2K for public holidays (depending on how many you work) and probably anywhere between 0-15K for overtime depending on how much you like being at work and where you are.
Once rated (validated) your salary will increase to whatever you and ASA have negotiated your pay level will be. Somewhere between $77397 (level 2) to $118395 (Level 10 Cat D tower), $122558 (Level 11 Cat C Tower), $129736 (Level 13 Cat B Tower), all stop here, including en route. If at Sydney, continues to $139723.
You won't be rich but you will be comfortable on these salaries in most parts of Australia and can live very well.
$70k per year =$52300 in your hand
$100k per year =$69450 in you hand
Current top increment about $129k =$84820 in your hand (as of mid Jan 07)
These tax rates include medicare levy which is free(ish) care in the public health system, most people take out private health cover as well which adds between $1-2k per year as the publis isn't great.
http://calculators.ato.gov.au/script...lc/Summary.asp explains it all.
On top of this salary you could add $1-2K for public holidays (depending on how many you work) and probably anywhere between 0-15K for overtime depending on how much you like being at work and where you are.
Once rated (validated) your salary will increase to whatever you and ASA have negotiated your pay level will be. Somewhere between $77397 (level 2) to $118395 (Level 10 Cat D tower), $122558 (Level 11 Cat C Tower), $129736 (Level 13 Cat B Tower), all stop here, including en route. If at Sydney, continues to $139723.
You won't be rich but you will be comfortable on these salaries in most parts of Australia and can live very well.
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What is a salary sacrifice arrangement?
A salary sacrifice arrangement is also commonly referred to as salary packaging or total remuneration packaging. It is an arrangement between an employer and an employee, whereby the employee agrees to forgo part of their future entitlement to salary or wages in return for the employer providing them with benefits of a similar cost (to the employer). The employee is likely to place greater value on the benefit than its cost to the employer.
The arrangement should be entered into before you perform the work
If the arrangement is put into place after the work has been performed, the salary sacrifice arrangement may be ineffective.
There should be an agreement between you and your employer
It is advisable that you and your employer clearly state and agree on all the terms of any salary sacrifice arrangement. If you enter into an undocumented salary sacrifice arrangement, you may have difficulty establishing the facts of your agreement. Subject to the terms of any contract of employment or industrial agreement, employees can renegotiate a salary sacrifice arrangement at any time. Where you have a renewable contract, you can renegotiate amounts of salary or wages to be sacrificed before the start of each renewal.
The contract of employment includes details of your remuneration, including any salary sacrifice arrangement. This contract can be varied by agreement between you and the employer.
There should be no access to the sacrificed salary
The sacrificed salary must be permanently forgone for the period of the arrangement. If a fringe benefit that has not been provided is cashed out at the end of a salary sacrifice arrangement accounting period, the amount cashed out is salary and is taxed as normal income.
What types of benefits can be included?
There is no restriction on the types of benefits that can be sacrificed. The important thing is that these benefits form part of your remuneration, replacing what otherwise could have been paid as salary. The types of benefits generally provided in salary sacrifice arrangements by employers include fringe benefits, exempt benefits and superannuation.
Fringe benefits
Common fringe benefits include:
cars
property (including goods, real property such as land and buildings, and shares or bonds), and expense payments (such as the payment of your loan repayments, school fees, child care costs and home phone costs).
Exempt benefits
A number of benefits are exempt from FBT. Expense payment, property or residual benefits arising for the following items commonly provided in salary sacrifice arrangements are exempt benefits.
A notebook computer, laptop computer or similar portable computer. The exemption for portable computers is limited to the purchase or reimbursement of one computer per year per employee.
A mobile phone or car phone that is primarily for use in your employment.
Superannuation
Salary sacrificed superannuation contributions under an effective salary sacrifice arrangement are considered to be employer contributions which, when paid in respect of an employee to a complying superannuation fund, are not fringe benefits.
However, superannuation contributions made for an associate, such as your spouse, are a fringe benefit. Similarly, contributions paid to a non-complying superannuation fund will be a fringe benefit.
What are the implications of entering into an arrangement?
As an employee you need to be aware how entering into a salary sacrifice arrangement with your employer will affect you. Under an effective arrangement:
you pay income tax on the reduced salary or wages
your employer may be liable to pay FBT on the fringe benefits provided
salary sacrificed superannuation contributions are classified as employer superannuation contributions (rather than employee contributions) and are taxed in the superannuation fund under tax laws dealing specifically with this subject
your employer may be required to report certain benefits on your payment summary following information may provide you with some guidance.
A salary sacrifice arrangement is also commonly referred to as salary packaging or total remuneration packaging. It is an arrangement between an employer and an employee, whereby the employee agrees to forgo part of their future entitlement to salary or wages in return for the employer providing them with benefits of a similar cost (to the employer). The employee is likely to place greater value on the benefit than its cost to the employer.
The arrangement should be entered into before you perform the work
If the arrangement is put into place after the work has been performed, the salary sacrifice arrangement may be ineffective.
There should be an agreement between you and your employer
It is advisable that you and your employer clearly state and agree on all the terms of any salary sacrifice arrangement. If you enter into an undocumented salary sacrifice arrangement, you may have difficulty establishing the facts of your agreement. Subject to the terms of any contract of employment or industrial agreement, employees can renegotiate a salary sacrifice arrangement at any time. Where you have a renewable contract, you can renegotiate amounts of salary or wages to be sacrificed before the start of each renewal.
The contract of employment includes details of your remuneration, including any salary sacrifice arrangement. This contract can be varied by agreement between you and the employer.
There should be no access to the sacrificed salary
The sacrificed salary must be permanently forgone for the period of the arrangement. If a fringe benefit that has not been provided is cashed out at the end of a salary sacrifice arrangement accounting period, the amount cashed out is salary and is taxed as normal income.
What types of benefits can be included?
There is no restriction on the types of benefits that can be sacrificed. The important thing is that these benefits form part of your remuneration, replacing what otherwise could have been paid as salary. The types of benefits generally provided in salary sacrifice arrangements by employers include fringe benefits, exempt benefits and superannuation.
Fringe benefits
Common fringe benefits include:
cars
property (including goods, real property such as land and buildings, and shares or bonds), and expense payments (such as the payment of your loan repayments, school fees, child care costs and home phone costs).
Exempt benefits
A number of benefits are exempt from FBT. Expense payment, property or residual benefits arising for the following items commonly provided in salary sacrifice arrangements are exempt benefits.
A notebook computer, laptop computer or similar portable computer. The exemption for portable computers is limited to the purchase or reimbursement of one computer per year per employee.
A mobile phone or car phone that is primarily for use in your employment.
Superannuation
Salary sacrificed superannuation contributions under an effective salary sacrifice arrangement are considered to be employer contributions which, when paid in respect of an employee to a complying superannuation fund, are not fringe benefits.
However, superannuation contributions made for an associate, such as your spouse, are a fringe benefit. Similarly, contributions paid to a non-complying superannuation fund will be a fringe benefit.
What are the implications of entering into an arrangement?
As an employee you need to be aware how entering into a salary sacrifice arrangement with your employer will affect you. Under an effective arrangement:
you pay income tax on the reduced salary or wages
your employer may be liable to pay FBT on the fringe benefits provided
salary sacrificed superannuation contributions are classified as employer superannuation contributions (rather than employee contributions) and are taxed in the superannuation fund under tax laws dealing specifically with this subject
your employer may be required to report certain benefits on your payment summary following information may provide you with some guidance.
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Having spent plenty of time in Oz in recent years, I can tell you that the property prices are indeed ridiculous compared to those not that long back.
The high end of the market is insanely priced! You can buy better in well-known expensive realestate hotspots around the world.
(I wont even discuss Perth, which is off the scale altogther!)
And the lower end of the market is overpriced for what you get.
I'd say the real cost of living (including home, food, entertainment) - at a decent level of lifetstyle - is no better in Oz than elsewhere nowadays. And whilst the banking/accounting style salaries (and the wages for certain trades) are up, the aviation-related salaries & wages continue to decline in comparison, with conditions worsening.
The country's in the midst of a China-induced resource boom, and the economy is being sustained by that boom. However, structurally, the economy is becoming unstable, and personal debt levels are through the roof. In addition, the government has re-written the industrial relations framework such that if and when a "hard landing" of the economy occurs, there will be widespread discontentment if not worse.
If you really feel likely to spend a lot of time on the beach, then Oz might still be a good bet - sacrificing long term wealth for current beach-centric lifestyle. But if you really are going to live more normally, I wouldn't get too exited by the tourism ads!
Not just wrt the campaign that's this thread's topic, but in respect of other aviation-based careers and even unrelated jobs, I'd consider current "enticements" more as a good backup for harder bargaining back at home... a fall-back position if you overdo the negotiations!
Disclaimer: This argument does not apply to those considering leaving certain countries with particularly low life-expectancies, and high drive-by shooting/car-jacking rates!
The high end of the market is insanely priced! You can buy better in well-known expensive realestate hotspots around the world.
(I wont even discuss Perth, which is off the scale altogther!)
And the lower end of the market is overpriced for what you get.
I'd say the real cost of living (including home, food, entertainment) - at a decent level of lifetstyle - is no better in Oz than elsewhere nowadays. And whilst the banking/accounting style salaries (and the wages for certain trades) are up, the aviation-related salaries & wages continue to decline in comparison, with conditions worsening.
The country's in the midst of a China-induced resource boom, and the economy is being sustained by that boom. However, structurally, the economy is becoming unstable, and personal debt levels are through the roof. In addition, the government has re-written the industrial relations framework such that if and when a "hard landing" of the economy occurs, there will be widespread discontentment if not worse.
If you really feel likely to spend a lot of time on the beach, then Oz might still be a good bet - sacrificing long term wealth for current beach-centric lifestyle. But if you really are going to live more normally, I wouldn't get too exited by the tourism ads!
Not just wrt the campaign that's this thread's topic, but in respect of other aviation-based careers and even unrelated jobs, I'd consider current "enticements" more as a good backup for harder bargaining back at home... a fall-back position if you overdo the negotiations!
Disclaimer: This argument does not apply to those considering leaving certain countries with particularly low life-expectancies, and high drive-by shooting/car-jacking rates!
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Thank you!
Thanks for Albizia and Myway or Highway! Your answers were exactly what me and Japanac asked for.Personaly I expected such answers. The only thing that is possitive for your country in terms of aviation bussines is that your country need it! That is only one reason ( but the strongest ,as well) why I spending days and nights thinking about this carrier oportunity. Also I have some relatives that live in Oz and as I know they work for lower salaries and they are satisfied!
Question for JAPANAC: Did you survive last night?
Best regards
Question for JAPANAC: Did you survive last night?
Best regards
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@singapurcanac:
are u really living/working in mauritius? is it that bad thinking to leave there? i know a lot of people here in germany who would do a lot to work over there....
cheers spike.
are u really living/working in mauritius? is it that bad thinking to leave there? i know a lot of people here in germany who would do a lot to work over there....
cheers spike.
Thread Starter
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Gees,
After reading the posts from MYway or the Highway and Another Number, I might as well slash my wrists now!
Just for some balance.
I own my own house, I salary sacrifice 2 new Hondas (Jazz and Civic), and both my kids go to private schools. I live 50 minutes drive from the Gold Coast where I surf with my mates. I never have worries about being murdered when driving around this sunburnt country (although of course it can happen, just ask Peter Falconio when you see him!).
I have travelled to UK, Ireland, and Europe. I've been to NZ, Fiji, Hong Kong, Indonesia, and Malyasia. I'm very happy here living and working as an ATC in Oz. Sure the management types are often seeing the world of aviation differently to me, but I get paid well to do what I do and I have a great lifestyle.
I work with many ex-pats from the UK and Ireland. They all love Oz and are glad to have made the change, and I'm a better person for knowing and working with them.
After reading the posts from MYway or the Highway and Another Number, I might as well slash my wrists now!
Just for some balance.
I own my own house, I salary sacrifice 2 new Hondas (Jazz and Civic), and both my kids go to private schools. I live 50 minutes drive from the Gold Coast where I surf with my mates. I never have worries about being murdered when driving around this sunburnt country (although of course it can happen, just ask Peter Falconio when you see him!).
I have travelled to UK, Ireland, and Europe. I've been to NZ, Fiji, Hong Kong, Indonesia, and Malyasia. I'm very happy here living and working as an ATC in Oz. Sure the management types are often seeing the world of aviation differently to me, but I get paid well to do what I do and I have a great lifestyle.
I work with many ex-pats from the UK and Ireland. They all love Oz and are glad to have made the change, and I'm a better person for knowing and working with them.
Thread Starter
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Myway,
You sound like a financial advisor!
Since when is owning a car anything but a loss making exercise!!! Salary sacrificing enables me to drive new cars and budget easily for them.
What I'm saying is that Oz ATCs have a good income that enables them to enjoy the great lifestyle we have here.
You sound like a financial advisor!
Since when is owning a car anything but a loss making exercise!!! Salary sacrificing enables me to drive new cars and budget easily for them.
What I'm saying is that Oz ATCs have a good income that enables them to enjoy the great lifestyle we have here.
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Dirty Pierre
Just a quick question, does your wife work or is this managed on a single income?
Both my wife and I are hoping to get into AsA and if we get this right I take it our combined salaries would make us a pretty good living in Oz, equal to or better than we have here? (minus of course the occassional murder, house break, drive by, hijack, petty theft, rape and corrupt politicians)
Both my wife and I are hoping to get into AsA and if we get this right I take it our combined salaries would make us a pretty good living in Oz, equal to or better than we have here? (minus of course the occassional murder, house break, drive by, hijack, petty theft, rape and corrupt politicians)