Threat to Pension
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More "previous" -
http://business.guardian.co.uk/story...886032,00.html
Let's make sure we're not left lying in the wet patch.
http://business.guardian.co.uk/story...886032,00.html
Let's make sure we're not left lying in the wet patch.
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Any division between employees and CAAPS members over this issue will hurt all. The mooted option of a different pension being offered dependent on which Union you come under is nonsense. What kind of company would base fundamental policies on TU subscription?
The history of final salary pension schemes that have closed to new members is very clear. Company closes to new members, relying on the self-interest of current members to swallow the "but it doesn't effect you, why care about some newbie you don't even know?" line. Then some time later as members retire and new employees are hired, the balance tips and there are more employees of the new scheme than of the good old one. At this point the company (under pressure to do so from the TU ironically) will close the old scheme and force all members into the new one. Been done and done and done.
The answer to me is clear.. don't swallow their bull... They need to save money yeah, so stop wasting hundreds of thousands on (dodgy) re-branding, piss-ups in 5 star hotels for hundreds of managers every few weeks.. etc etc. Don't even think about touching our pension.
There's never been a company who have attempted closure of their scheme in this way before when the scheme is actually operating with a healthy surplus!
Oh... and on the HTD. I'm one of those that doesn't get it, so obviously I voted yes - money for nothing - but I wont criticise anybody who does get it that voted no.
The history of final salary pension schemes that have closed to new members is very clear. Company closes to new members, relying on the self-interest of current members to swallow the "but it doesn't effect you, why care about some newbie you don't even know?" line. Then some time later as members retire and new employees are hired, the balance tips and there are more employees of the new scheme than of the good old one. At this point the company (under pressure to do so from the TU ironically) will close the old scheme and force all members into the new one. Been done and done and done.
The answer to me is clear.. don't swallow their bull... They need to save money yeah, so stop wasting hundreds of thousands on (dodgy) re-branding, piss-ups in 5 star hotels for hundreds of managers every few weeks.. etc etc. Don't even think about touching our pension.
There's never been a company who have attempted closure of their scheme in this way before when the scheme is actually operating with a healthy surplus!
Oh... and on the HTD. I'm one of those that doesn't get it, so obviously I voted yes - money for nothing - but I wont criticise anybody who does get it that voted no.
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Me me me me
Well put old boy.
As regards the HTD - I get the full amount, voted no, but can't blame you for voting yes to get money for nothing!! It is another clever way of the management using money to divide and conquer.
Well put old boy.
As regards the HTD - I get the full amount, voted no, but can't blame you for voting yes to get money for nothing!! It is another clever way of the management using money to divide and conquer.
One NATS, One Pension
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Unfortunately these days its not just a divide between ATCO's and ATSA's, I am far from being an ATSA. These days is a divide between ATCO's and everyone else. Thing is that ATCO's 'think' they are getting the better deal. That will last until there is no "other ranks" support for them, then its their turn, believe me. So, the divide and conquer strategy applies to everyone, not just us slaves.
Stick together now because soon it will be just too late.
Stick together now because soon it will be just too late.
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Minesapint
Totally agree with your comments - including the need to stick together over the pension issue. Problem is, I cannot see the "unity" staying together for long if divide and conquer tactics are employed.
UKATCO 535 - check yr PMs.
Totally agree with your comments - including the need to stick together over the pension issue. Problem is, I cannot see the "unity" staying together for long if divide and conquer tactics are employed.
UKATCO 535 - check yr PMs.
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I have seen absolutely no hint of any split between any of the endangered grades. It has been a totally united front from all parties. Don't allow management or others to kid you otherwise.
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Lets hope that remains the case.
Almost looking forward to the Barron's imminent visit... what with him trying to sell us the pension scheme attack as well as talking up the new brand... Should be a laugh.
Almost looking forward to the Barron's imminent visit... what with him trying to sell us the pension scheme attack as well as talking up the new brand... Should be a laugh.
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INTERESTING INFO FOR 'BAR STOOL SESSIONS'
Some of the reps my have a document prepared by moi that may be useful for upcoming chats with the boss. If anyone is interested, I would suggest they have a word with their Prospect rep. Hope at least some find it useful and a good source of questions/answers.
Cheers, JBG
Some of the reps my have a document prepared by moi that may be useful for upcoming chats with the boss. If anyone is interested, I would suggest they have a word with their Prospect rep. Hope at least some find it useful and a good source of questions/answers.
Cheers, JBG
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Interesting thread on Flight deck forums - BA pensions.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...42#post2473342
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...42#post2473342
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One observation I have to make regarding the pensions issue...
The top bods are on the road trying to sell us the story about how we have to look at the pension scheme now, too expensive etc etc... They are relying on the management team as a whole to back them up... but I don't know any managers in the company that aren't looking forward to their CAAPS pension! I feel our newly imported executive have yet to understand exactly what they are taking on with this one.
The top bods are on the road trying to sell us the story about how we have to look at the pension scheme now, too expensive etc etc... They are relying on the management team as a whole to back them up... but I don't know any managers in the company that aren't looking forward to their CAAPS pension! I feel our newly imported executive have yet to understand exactly what they are taking on with this one.
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So It's pensions this month, HTD last month whats next - pay cuts probably. Our GM has sold us all a story about how hard up NATS are and how we should not claim AAVAs and put in unpaid duties. It is time to stand up to these cuts.
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Our GM has sold us all a story about how hard up NATS are and how we should not claim AAVAs and put in unpaid duties.
He might ask people to consider working for 'time off in lieu' but I am not sure that Prospect would be too happy with that for operational duties.
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The GM has no power to override the national AAVA agreement (which includes payments !!).
Anyway, aren't we swimming in cash?? After all we have just spunked £1.2 million on a re-brand!
We all get to see it in the morning....
If they had asked me I would have done it for 500k.....
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Just had a little trawl through the murkier depths of our expensively stripy and rather sick inducing corporate web site.
Under the 'Commercial Services' menu and the 'Business consulting services' topic, our wonderful company is providing consultancy for, amongst other things, 'Operational Changes'.
Apparently we have an 'expert' that will advise on matters such as:
"Moving Civil Service Pensions to Private pensions"
and
"Managing Union expectations throughout the change"
Just wonder where this 'expert' will get the relevent experience from
Under the 'Commercial Services' menu and the 'Business consulting services' topic, our wonderful company is providing consultancy for, amongst other things, 'Operational Changes'.
Apparently we have an 'expert' that will advise on matters such as:
"Moving Civil Service Pensions to Private pensions"
and
"Managing Union expectations throughout the change"
Just wonder where this 'expert' will get the relevent experience from
Oh god looks like our company has got the NHS syndrome ie see a problem and rather than resolve it with existing rescources, employ someone on a contract for a vast amount of money.
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Warning Papparazzi alert
I can see the headlines now -
NATS directors snapped whilst out celebrating the rebranding:
http://www.ephotozine.com/gallery/sh...photoid=446213
NATS directors snapped whilst out celebrating the rebranding:
http://www.ephotozine.com/gallery/sh...photoid=446213