Logging hours towards JAA CPL-H

[onehalfmonk]

Is it true that all hours logged towards the JAA CPL-H must be completed at a JAA approved school ? i.e. Post PPL-H up until 155 hours.

Any info, much appreciated.

[Hedski]

No way. My previous FTO tried this one on people and they believed it. Nowhere is it written in JAR-FCL that you need to clock all hours at your FTO. Be warned, if they're telling porkies like this, what will they try next?! :suspect: Your P1 hours can come from anywhere as long as they're true P1 on a rated type. If you're rated, fly it anywhere in the world you can, like 206 in LA for USD135 per hour flying for radio stations! :ok:

[Slotty]

Hedski is right, only an Integrated course has to be done at the same FTO. I've had PPL students go all over the place to hour build USA, Oz, New Zealand etc and get some good experience in mountains, outback, turbine news/radio copilot.
Try and get the night rating completed though during your 155 hours and save yourself having to do it at the end, PM me if you want more info.

[misterbonkers]

urm, the 206 in LA for USD135 aint true P1 hours because they don't let you sit in the right hand seat.

I believe that certain people at the CAA are aware of this.

[Martin1234]

Even though it is contrary to the JAR I've heard that the UK CAA counts "N-" hours as half. Where does that rumour come from?

[onehalfmonk]

Firstly thanks for all the replies.

I good while ago I read through JAR FCL-2

I asked my instructor the same question I asked you guys and he told me the same as you guys, "they count".

Because I'm a bit nerdy :) (and because of all the money and hoops) I rang to confirm it with my aviation authority and I was told they did not count :ugh: I called them again today and the "intern" asked somebody else who confirmed what both you guys, my instructor and my own reading of JAR FCL-2 had told me
, in the context of experience and total time towards 155 hours, they can count.

The excuse for the misinformation was in the form of "It's very confusing isn't it ?" :zzz:

[DBChopper]

Apologies, Onehalfmonk, for hijacking your thread, but this seems to fit in as I'm hour-building too...

In a copy I have of JAR-FCL 2 obtained when I was first thinking of doing the PPL(H), it states for the issue of a CPL(H) the applicant needs to have completed,

"a x-country flight totalling at least 185km (100NM) in the course of which full-stop landings at two aerodromes different from the aerodromes of departure shall be made"

No, I've read and re-read this and I'm still not sure if it is a pre-course requirement or if it is to be completed during the modular course. Can anyone assist as to which is correct and where I can find the up-to-date JAR stuff online?

Thanks in anticipation.

DBChopper
:cool:

[The Nr Fairy]

DBChopper :

As long as it's done before the CFI signs up the course training record, and puts his signature on the form which goes to the CAA, it's fine.

[onehalfmonk]

Regarding the most up-to-date JAR FCL-2 documentation (pdf) it is supposed to be available at :-

http://www.jaa.nl/section1/jars/39/36/393677/393677.pdf

This is one of the worst websites I have visited, given the range of issues which they are tasked with handling. The information is presented in a very bad manner. I also read that the JAR's are available for purchase :) This is pure ripoff and evidence of how inefficient all this red-tape is, they need to charge for what should be basic information (Too many cooks means your beans on toast is very expensive!)

However it is availble cached from Google.com in html format at:-

http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:dpx1bB5drVkJ:www.jaa.nl/section1/jars/39/36/393677/393677.pdf+jar+fcl-2&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

It's a bit ugly to read though.

[Hedski]

CAA don't count left-seat 206 hours as P1 cos most clock them under FAA rules as P2 without type rating. They give 50% credit. This can be done on any type as P2 as long as you have a stick in front of you under FAA rules. However if you have a CAA/JAA type rating on same then you must be allowed to log it as P1 with full entitlement even if you are left seat as you have control, you're flying the machine and how do ya think instructors log PIC from left seat when they're teaching you!!! If they still say no, then don't be afraid to challenge them and have a go! I would.:ouch:

[Whirlygig]

Sorry onehalfmonk, I, too, would be grateful if I could hi-jack your thread for a similar query.

I am currently doing a PPL(H) with a view to CPL(H) but have received conflicting information with respect to this figure of 155 hours? Is this 155 as PiC? and would this include any solo time during the PPL(H) training? or is this total hours?

I'd be grateful for some clarification.

Cheers

Whirlygig

[Whirlybird]

Whirlygig,

It's 155hrs total time, PIC and P U/T.

[Expat in the sun]

I fly an AS-350 B2 from the left seat doing tour flights, we don't have controls installed on the right side so if you can't log P1 under FAA rules from the left seat then who is P1???:uhoh:

[Whirlybird]

At least in the UK, there is no rule that the PIC has to fly from any particular seat. The question is really whether people flying with a pilot doing traffic watch can log PIC. If you're doing the flying, you should be able to. Do the CAA agree? You'll hear different stories...but it has nothing to do with who sits in what seat.